NY Times vs. Chassidim

[CountValentine]

Any secular education is a means to an end not a end to a means in Judaism. Overwhelming emphasis has to be placed on learning Torah. Your ridiculous 50/50 proposition is a nonstarter.

Many secular studies can be done while teaching religion.

[jj1000]

Many secular studies can be done while teaching religion.

This comes from a grave misunderstanding of the Hassidic religion you are commenting on. One can say not learning English is an integral part of religious life for some sects. Just as no electronics is to the Amish example I gave earlier.

Perhaps we are getting closer to understanding why people are in an uproar when you make suggestions such as these and ask questions like you did.

[gozalim]

Why can't they do both?

I don't tell the pope how to train cardinals
We have a system that worked for centuries to produce a certain type of dedication.
an outside mandate has no clue what they're tinkering with

[CountValentine]

This comes from a grave misunderstanding of the Hassidic religion you are commenting on. One can say not learning English is an integral part of religious life for some sects. Just as no electronics is to the Amish example I gave earlier.

Perhaps we are getting closer to understanding why people are in an uproar when you make suggestions such as these and ask questions like you did.

I remember being told (it might have been you) that Judaism teaches critical thinking that encompasses math and other studies. 

[Sammy82]

Many secular studies can be done while teaching religion.

We do.  Try learning Sukka 7a with rishonim. Chazal knew pi centuries before it was 'discovered'

[jj1000]

I remember being told (it might have been you) that Judaism teaches critical thinking that encompasses math and other studies. 

It does.

[CountValentine]

Chazal knew pi centuries before it was 'discovered'

Did he know it was an irrational number?

[CountValentine]

It does.

Thats what I mean by:

Many secular studies can be done while teaching religion.

[aygart]

Did he know it was an irrational number?

They did and also knew that the square root of 2 is irrational. In fact the calculation for pi presented by tosfos in medieval western Europe is studied in universities today and discussed extensively in mathematical journals as being simpler and more intuitive than the calculation of Archimedes. I can look up citations for you if you want.

[ellemeno]

I remember being told (it might have been you) that Judaism teaches critical thinking that encompasses math and other studies.

It sure does, this for one example

True story - someone I know was teaching secular studies in Satmar, and the kids simply couldn't make sense of subtraction with borrowing.  The teacher comes in the next day to see perfect examples of what he was trying to teach them on the board. When asked, all of the kids said they understood the examples on the board, but "that's not math, it's Chumash"!

But do you have a method to shoehorn it to show compliance with the regulations?
And use the same expressions on standardized test with what was taught?

[WAM]

If I listed all the accomplished people that came from the PS system it would never end.

Difference is, we're not threatening people with jail for sending their kids to public school.

[WAM]

and and ill bet that the percentage of ppl from the "system" living off tzedakah far outnumber the supper successful ones.

Source?

Mendy, welcome to the conversation. If you want the bash Hasids thread, it's in the NYT comment section.
If you want to have a back and forth discussion, you will be asked to bring sources for your theories.

[WAM]

 

Someone else gave one single example at no one questioned that. I can give thousands of examples if not more and I get called out.

The reason for that is in the Manalapan thread 

If you want fairness, then shouldn't we lead by example (everyone)?

Indeed, we should.

[CountValentine]

They did and also knew that the square root of 2 is irrational. In fact the calculation for pi presented by tosfos in medieval western Europe is studied in universities today and discussed extensively in mathematical journals as being simpler and more intuitive than the calculation of Archimedes. I can look up citations for you if you want.

I have citations and don't want to go 100 pages.

[CountValentine]

Difference is, we're not threatening people with jail for sending their kids to public school.

People are being threaten for sending their kids to private schools?

[WAM]

Split secular studies and religious studies 50/50.

How does that make it in between the goal posts?
Some of what we learn covers secular topics as well.

[Yehuda57]

People are being threaten for sending their kids to private schools?

If you send your kid to a school that is not approved by the Regents board, the child is considered truant, which makes the parent liable to pay fines and potentially be jailed

[WAM]

People are being threaten for sending their kids to private schools?

Good morning. That's what is happening here.

[CountValentine]

If you send your kid to a school that is not approved by the Regents board, the child is considered truant, which makes the parent liable to pay fines and potentially be jailed

That is for private or public schools, correct?

[CountValentine]

Good morning. That's what is happening here.

You misrepresented what was happening.

If you send your kid to a school that is not approved by the Regents board, the child is considered truant, which makes the parent liable to pay fines and potentially be jailed