Author Topic: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"  (Read 12033 times)

Offline imayid2

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #120 on: September 29, 2022, 10:58:24 PM »
Rabbi Yosef תאומים in SĒD 97:1
I didnít have a chance to check it up but he says otherwise regarding חלת חוץ לארץ in 92.

Offline aygart

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #121 on: September 29, 2022, 11:04:45 PM »
In Emes LeYaakov Rí Yaakov Kaminetzky brings a raya from the Rama that you can use the kelim of one who relies on Rí Moshe even if you disagree.
It isnít a perfect raya and he himself is using it because he holds מעיקר הדין like RMF IIRC. Have to check.

I can't believe that was ever meant as a raya since if it was it would be a pliya atzuma since the case he is coming from is because you can rely that  they won't give you from those keilim.

Note that Rav Moshe says that the machmirim should be machmir on keilim. (ETA I see others mentioned this)
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Offline imayid2

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #122 on: September 29, 2022, 11:06:37 PM »
I can't believe that was ever meant as a raya since if it was it would be a pliya atzuma since the case he is coming from is because you can rely that  they won't give you from those keilim.
Are you sure? By חלב בני מריינוס because they have the right to be maykil we can eat from their keilim from what I rememberÖ

Offline jye

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #123 on: September 29, 2022, 11:12:14 PM »
I didnít have a chance to check it up but he says otherwise regarding חלת חוץ לארץ in 92.
By chalav akum in צ״ז he is metzaref those who say that chalav akum is batel berov as well as אין דבר טמא מצוי. That is why he is more machmir in צ״ב.

Offline imayid2

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #124 on: September 29, 2022, 11:13:03 PM »
Your first highlight references a conclusion, but that one is even less relevant IMHO.
I see. My intention with that one was to highlight the נודע ביהודהs involvement. Not the conclusion specifically.

Offline AsherO

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #125 on: September 29, 2022, 11:13:56 PM »
I think itís very relevant at least for keilim which they seem completely fine with.

Youíre pretzeling. Even the keilim have lots of mitigating factors in that case that are different than לכתחילה using a milchig pot you borrowed from a neighbor that uses CS.
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Offline imayid2

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #126 on: September 29, 2022, 11:15:14 PM »
By chalav akum in צ״ז he is metzaref those who say that chalav akum is batel berov as well as אין דבר טמא מצוי. That is why he is more machmir in צ״ב.
Ok I donít know if the achronim I referred to wouldnít hold like that either being that they perhaps would agree to those צירופים.

Offline aygart

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #127 on: September 29, 2022, 11:15:16 PM »
Are you sure? By חלב בני מריינוס because they have the right to be maykil we can eat from their keilim from what I rememberÖ

You are right I was getting confused with the other cases in Shach 119:20 but by chelev reinus it is because the whole minhag lihachmir was set up that way.
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Offline imayid2

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #128 on: September 29, 2022, 11:16:30 PM »
Youíre pretzeling. Even the keilim have lots of mitigating factors in that case that are different than לכתחילה using a milchig pot you borrowed from a neighbor that uses CS.
I have to disagree. It sounds like they viewed that as a very solid standalone reason to be matir the keilim.

Offline imayid2

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #129 on: September 29, 2022, 11:18:03 PM »
You are right I was getting confused with the other cases in Shach 119:20 but by chelev reinus it is because the whole minhag lihachmir was set up that way.
In אמת ליעקב where he refers to that Halacha he says itís a כל שכן from there. I assume he means because the reasons to be maykil are so compelling by CS.

Offline aygart

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #130 on: September 29, 2022, 11:18:37 PM »
Perhaps I would have to look it up.
Either way, that RMF is the mechudash one! Though his logic isnít necessarily a chiddush, many achronim say otherwise.

Who?
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Offline aygart

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #131 on: September 29, 2022, 11:20:04 PM »
I have to disagree. It sounds like they viewed that as a very solid standalone reason to be matir the keilim.

A pasteurizer where they didn't drop the water can be worse.
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Offline aygart

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #132 on: September 29, 2022, 11:20:44 PM »
In אמת ליעקב where he refers to that Halacha he says itís a כל שכן from there. I assume he means because the reasons to be maykil are so compelling by CS.

Yes it is because he holds the whole thing is really mutar.
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Offline AsherO

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #133 on: September 29, 2022, 11:20:55 PM »
I have to disagree. It sounds like they viewed that as a very solid standalone reason to be matir the keilim.

They cite many other reasons, Iím not sure why youíre honing in on that one and saying itís very standalone. Iím not seeing it anywhere in the words.
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Offline imayid2

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #134 on: September 29, 2022, 11:24:14 PM »
Who?
I was referring to the pri magadim in 92 and חכמת אדם נא כד. However I accept @jye clarification that חלב עכו״ם is easier to be מיקל.

Offline aygart

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #135 on: September 29, 2022, 11:29:08 PM »
I was referring to the pri magadim in 92 and חכמת אדם נא כד. However I accept @jye clarification that חלב עכו״ם is easier to be מיקל.

IINM the source RMF brings for not saying chanan by chalav akum is literally a PMG.
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Offline imayid2

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #136 on: September 29, 2022, 11:31:56 PM »
IINM the source RMF brings for not saying chanan by chalav akum סתם יינם is literally a PMG.
FTFY (I think so) and I donít see him bringing a pri mgadim to be maykil.
Either way we went through this above.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2022, 11:36:43 PM by imayid2 »

Offline imayid2

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #137 on: September 29, 2022, 11:41:18 PM »
They cite many other reasons, Iím not sure why youíre honing in on that one and saying itís very standalone. Iím not seeing it anywhere in the words.
Many?
Regardless, the other reason could just as well apply to many/most cases of DE.

Offline imayid2

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #138 on: September 29, 2022, 11:45:49 PM »
It is interesting to read in מסורת משה the astonishment and disbelief that RMF allegedly displayed when he was told the ďstoryĒ of how he vomited up CS he had mistakenly consumed.

Offline jye

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Re: "Makpid During Aseres Yimei Teshuva"
« Reply #139 on: September 29, 2022, 11:54:22 PM »
It is interesting to read in מסורת משה the astonishment and disbelief that RMF allegedly displayed when he was told the ďstoryĒ of how he vomited up CS he had mistakenly consumed.

As the chazon ish was reported to have said when told they were saying in his name that there was a heter for cholov stam ďnext they will say I was matir an eishes ishĒ