FBI opens investigation into killing of Shireen Abu Akleh

[jj1000]

You and everyone here is just dismissing anything brought up. I understand why that is but that doesn't change the facts.

If you feel my question is loaded, then rephrase it.

Reworded would be... If this was SOP would you be ok with it. Everyone said yes.

DDF'ers are postulating it broke SOP due to politics. Hence they are questioning it.

[Dan]

It's more than just about their frosty relationship, it's a strategic warning shot to Bibi to form a moderate government and not to assign key ministries to right-wing extremists, otherwise there would be serious ramifications in the US-Israeli relationship.

Correct, hence the highly curious timing, right when Bibi is given a mandate to create a new government.

[CountValentine]

Reworded would be... If this was SOP would you be ok with it. Everyone said yes.

DDF'ers are postulating it broke SOP due to politics. Hence they are questioning it.

So if it is not SOP then we should not investigate any US citizens getting killed on foreign soil?
That doesn't sound reasonable.

[imayid2]

So if it is not SOP then we should not investigate any US citizens getting killed on foreign soil?
That doesn't sound reasonable.

You are simply saying that it should be SOP. Why is it not SOP?

[CountValentine]

You are simply saying that it should be SOP. Why is it not SOP?

I don't know if it is or isn't. What a do know is a US citizen was killed. Conflicting reports on what actually happened. An investigation is warranted.

[Yehuda57]

FBI announces they're going to investigate the killing.

DDF: Whoa. This is political garbage.
CV: Why? An American citizen was killed!
DDF: Ok, so why don't they investigate any other Americans killed? Why announce it now?
CV: I agree they should investigate all killings, so they should investigate this one.
DDF: Ok, we agree that if it is SOP they should investigate this as well. But we live in a real world, not a hypothetical one, and we know the USA does NOT routinely investigate the deaths of its citizens on foreign soil. There is also the curious timing of the announcement after the Israeli elections which saw parties Biden isn't a fan of rise to power after months of not uttering a word about this incident.
CV: Pretzel! *I* said I would be ok with investigating all deaths, if you don't want this one investigated it must be because of pretzels.
DDF: You are not the FBI. If the FBI doesn't investigate other deaths and only chooses to investigate this one and under suspicious timing to boot, it must be a political stunt, not an honest investigation.
CV: Pretzel!
DDF: How?
CV: Chaim
DDF: Pretzel!

[jj1000]

So if it is not SOP then we should not investigate any US citizens getting killed on foreign soil?
That doesn't sound reasonable.

Your words...

If it's not SOP then I'd imagine it's a confluence of factors that are taken into consideration. Was it an assassination, is it likely to happen again, was it a friendly country, ally, enemy, etc.

Was an investigation already done? Who ran that investigation.

Will the foreign Government participate. What will be gained.

What type of pressure is being pushed from our own Government on the FBI.

And the list can go on and on.

In this case the factor of having a far right wing Israeli Government seems to have been the deciding one. And for that members are against it. If the facts were different then those specific facts would have to be weighed when deciding to break SOP.

[CountValentine]

Does anyone believe the investigation Israel did? Did you believe them when they claimed the other side fired the shot that killed a US citizen.

[Mordyk]

Doesn't seem strange to me to investigate the killing of a US citizen. It would be strange if they didn't.
ETA: Jamal Khashoggi comes to mind.

are you kidding? do you know how many US citizens died in terrorist attacks in Israel, and all that happened was a condemnation?

Does anyone believe the investigation Israel did? Did you believe them when they claimed the other side fired the shot that killed a US citizen.

go read the final report

[TimT]

It all makes perfect sense. We are following SOP.  The UN’s SOP.

[CountValentine]

are you kidding? do you know how many US citizens died in terrorist attacks in Israel, and all that happened was a condemnation?

You lost me on this one. You want the US to condemn Israel for the killing?

go read the final report

I am asking if anyone believes them? I don't trust them.

[jj1000]

Does anyone believe the investigation Israel did? Did you believe them when they claimed the other side fired the shot that killed a US citizen.

Israel conducted several thorough investigations into the circumstances of Abu Akleh’s killing, with the IDF concluding in September that she was most likely killed in “unintentional fire” from an Israeli soldier who did not realize she was a journalist. The US even participated in one of the investigations, including examining the bullet that the Palestinians said was the fatal one. The results of all the investigations were shared with the US, and particularly with the State Department. - https://www.jpost.com/opinion/article-722469

[CountValentine]

Israel conducted several thorough investigations into the circumstances of Abu Akleh’s killing, with the IDF concluding in September that she was most likely killed in “unintentional fire” from an Israeli soldier who did not realize she was a journalist. The US even participated in one of the investigations, including examining the bullet that the Palestinians said was the fatal one. The results of all the investigations were shared with the US, and particularly with the State Department. - https://www.jpost.com/opinion/article-722469

Nice commentary but you didn't answer either question.

[TimT]

the IDF concluding in September that she was most likely killed in “unintentional fire” from an Israeli soldier who did not realize she was a journalist.

Boom, end of story. Nothing more to be learned. All that’s left is politics.

[aygart]

It all makes perfect sense. We are following SOP.  The UN’s SOP.

Didn't the UN teach the same conclusion already?

[Yehuda57]

You lost me on this one. You want the US to condemn Israel for the killing? I am asking if anyone believes them? I don't trust them.

The fact that initial reports and findings contradict later ones is to be expected. Looks at what's happening now with the Russian/Ukrainian missiles that landed in Poland.

As for trusting Israel, I dare say Israel has a better track record of punishing its soldiers and LEOs than America does.

[TimT]

Didn't the UN teach the same conclusion already?

Yes. Everything is Israel’s fault.
Iran is executing its people ? Let’s meet to criticize Israel.

[jj1000]

Nice commentary but you didn't answer either question.

At the start I had no idea who shot her. I saw the arguments of both sides. Now it seems Israel shot her.

I am not sure if Israel ever said the other side did it definitively, did they?

But if they did, I wasn't convinced either way and now there store seems like a plausible one, but again I still don't see any definitive proof on who the shot was from or their intentions. Not do I see claims of it being definitive.

So do I believe a likely narrative, sure. But that doesn't mean I know who did or didn't do anything, just what could have happened.

[CountValentine]

From @jj1000 we seem to have an answer as to why? This was my guess earlier.
Israel should welcome an independent FBI probe to clear this up!!!

Perhaps the administration has come under increasing pressure from Abu Akleh’s family – and its own lawmakers – to mount an independent FBI probe. We know that more than 20 Democratic senators signed a letter calling for such a probe, with Sen. Chris Van Hollen (D-Maryland) saying that “this is an overdue but necessary and important step in the pursuit of justice and accountability in the shooting death of American citizen and journalist, Shireen Abu Akleh.”

[jj1000]

As for trusting Israel, I dare say Israel has a better track record of punishing its soldiers and LEOs than America does.

FWIU this is 100% accurate.

And  you can add dirty politicians to that list as well. In general Israel's justice system is much stronger than the US when it comes to criminal convictions, rates, etc. Not sure if that makes them better though.