Its Open Season on Minorities Master Thread!

[Yehuda57]

Let's recap. Since my OP on the latest killing there have been about 18 posts (not counting mine). One comment in passing calling it a "horrible thing". Good thing no one is trying to derail this thread. 

This was an unspeakably tragic crime. This highlights the very worst among us, which is all the more horrifying when they should be our finest.

The only reason people aren't expressing the appropriate disgust for these thugs is because it was posted in a thread supposedly about bias crimes against minorities, and here the perpetrators were the same minority race as the victim, giving it the appearance of being horrific police brutality and abuse of power, though not race related.

When people have questioned that, they're been accused of being racists and such.

Similar to people crying antisemitism when none exists, when you turn everything into racism, nothing is racism.

[drosenberg88429]

Are genetically Jewish NYT authors with clearly negative slants towards Orthodox Jews, Israel, and yeshivas anti semitic?

[EliJelly]

Are genetically Jewish NYT authors with clearly negative slants towards Orthodox Jews, Israel, and yeshivas anti semitic?

Call it AS or not, clearly that is a bias attack. They can simply be biased against religious people and against conservatives, and double portion of hate against those who claim both titles.

[CountValentine]

Sorry but I don't see any other way to explain to you that black on black or Jew on Jew isn't a racist attack. I admire the patience of the other members here who unsuccessfully tried to beat in that logic into you in the past 36754 pages.

No need to be sorry and I will keep moving your stupid posts.

The law does not care about the race of the perpetrator but keep spewing your non-sense. 

[CountValentine]

Similar to people crying antisemitism when none exists, when you turn everything into racism, nothing is racism.

Do you understand a hate crime has nothing to do with the race of the perpetrator?

[CountValentine]

The only reason people aren't expressing the appropriate disgust for these thugs is because it was posted in a thread supposedly about bias crimes against minorities, and here the perpetrators were the same minority race as the victim, giving it the appearance of being horrific police brutality and abuse of power, though not race related.

So we don't know the driving force behind this crime, but the default is there was no bias? Does that seem fair to you?

[drosenberg88429]

Call it AS or not, clearly that is a bias attack. They can simply be biased against religious people and against conservatives, and double portion of hate against those who claim both titles.

Can there be dermographic bias by black cops against black "hood" youth? Is racism vs bias just semantics?

[CountValentine]

When people have questioned that, they're been accused of being racists and such.

Wait, I called someone a racist for believing that race was not involved?

[Yehuda57]

Do you understand a hate crime has nothing to do with the race of the perpetrator?

Perhaps in rare instances. Though on the whole, no, I would think the race/religion/ethnicity of the perpetrator has everything to do with a hate crime. A hate crime is crime motivated by hate. These thugs are the worst of the worst, but motivated by prejudice against a minority they are part of? You'll need to provide evidence.

Civil rights crimes are not hate crimes.

[CountValentine]

Can there be dermographic bias by black cops against black "hood" youth? Is racism vs bias just semantics?

Bias is the basis for the hate crime law.

[CountValentine]

Civil rights crimes are not hate crimes.

Federal Civil Rights Statutes — FBI
This statute makes it unlawful to willfully cause bodily injury—or attempting to do so with fire, firearm, or other dangerous weapon—when 1) the crime was committed because of the actual or perceived race, color, religion, national origin of any person, or 2) the crime was committed because of the actual or perceived religion, national origin, gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, or disability of any person and the crime affected interstate or foreign commerce or occurred within federal special maritime and territorial jurisdiction.

Perhaps in rare instances.

I am asking according to the law.

[Yehuda57]

Wait, I called someone a racist for believing that race was not involved?

You're right, you didn't call anyone racist, I mistook your admonishions of "derailing the thread" vs preemptively calling out "all lives mattering" the story.

[drosenberg88429]

I think many police units in Israel (admittedly, a nice chunk of these individuals are likely not really Jewish) are also guilty of bias when discriminating against chareidim, even though they're the same race. Like was said, calling it racial bias or bias against a demographic is largely semantical when defining something as a hate crime.

[CountValentine]

Can there be dermographic bias by black cops against black "hood" youth? Is racism vs bias just semantics?

That would be bias and a hate crime. The fact that the cops are black is meaningless. This is a fact some are missing.

[Yehuda57]

Federal Civil Rights Statutes — FBI
This statute makes it unlawful to willfully cause bodily injury—or attempting to do so with fire, firearm, or other dangerous weapon—when 1) the crime was committed because of the actual or perceived race, color, religion, national origin of any person, or 2) the crime was committed because of the actual or perceived religion, national origin, gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, or disability of any person and the crime affected interstate or foreign commerce or occurred within federal special maritime and territorial jurisdiction.I am asking according to the law.

I'm no expert or even basically knowledgeable in federal law, but a quick Google search of "Civil rights law" leads me to assume they are being investigated/charged for this, not what you quoted

https://www.fbi.gov/investigate/civil-rights/federal-civil-rights-statutes#:~:text=This%20statute%20makes%20it%20a,and%20laws%20of%20the%20U.S.

This statute makes it a crime for any person acting under color of law, statute, ordinance, regulation, or custom to willfully deprive or cause to be deprived from any person those rights, privileges, or immunities secured or protected by the Constitution and laws of the U.S.

This law further prohibits a person acting under color of law, statute, ordinance, regulation or custom to willfully subject or cause to be subjected any person to different punishments, pains, or penalties, than those prescribed for punishment of citizens on account of such person being an alien or by reason of his/her color or race.

Acts under "color of any law" include acts not only done by federal, state, or local officials within the bounds or limits of their lawful authority

[EliJelly]

I think many police units in Israel (admittedly, a nice chunk of these individuals are likely not really Jewish) are also guilty of bias when discriminating against chareidim, even though they're the same race. Like was said, calling it racial bias or bias against a demographic is largely semantical when defining something as a hate crime.

In that case it is established that such a hate/bias exists. Was there ever established that even among blacks there is a bias against black "hood" kids? More so than on any other troubled hood kids? Reasoning that the fact that the victim is black makes it by definition a biased attack is similar to reasoning that banning natural gas isn't in fact a ban on gas stoves.

[Yehuda57]

That would be bias and a hate crime. The fact that the cops are black is meaningless. This is a fact some are missing.

Like I said, when the perpetrator and victim are the same race, it may be a hate crime, though you'd need evidence of that. You were asked after posting it by a few people why you felt this is a hate crime and your only response is the victim was black. I'm not going to watch the videos, do the thugs say anything that implies bias was the motivator?

[drosenberg88429]

Federal Civil Rights Statutes — FBI
This statute makes it unlawful to willfully cause bodily injury—or attempting to do so with fire, firearm, or other dangerous weapon—when 1) the crime was committed because of the actual or perceived race, color, religion, national origin of any person, or 2) the crime was committed because of the actual or perceived religion, national origin, gender, sexual orientation, gender identity, or disability of any person and the crime affected interstate or foreign commerce or occurred within federal special maritime and territorial jurisdiction.

I am asking according to the law.

Hmm. If these police would treat a well dressed black businessman respectfully, and are mistreating these individuals because of their dress and conduct and perceived socioeconomic status which they associate with certain neighborhoods and groups, and they differentiate based on multiple factors, with skin color being one of the identifying factors but not the only one, as evidenced by fact that others with same skin color but other external differences are treated totally differently, I'm not sure if law as you quoted it would define that as a hate crime motivated by race and skin color. (I know nothing about the case at hand.)

[imayid2]

In case anyone wants more facts. There is no evidence of reckless driving for which was claimed as the reason for the stop.

So you’re assuming that he was stopped just for being black?

[CountValentine]

I'm no expert or even basically knowledgeable in federal law, but a quick Google search of "Civil rights law" leads me to assume they are being investigated/charged for this, not what you quoted

https://www.fbi.gov/investigate/civil-rights/federal-civil-rights-statutes#:~:text=This%20statute%20makes%20it%20a,and%20laws%20of%20the%20U.S.

Not going to go 100 pages on that but under either one the color of the perpetrator does not matter. This is a point you are all missing.

To believe that black cops can't or don't look at these young black men the same as white cops is ludicrous.