How To Behave, When To Accuse, Bad Media, And More

[aygart]

None of this would lead to arrest/charges if it was known/understood at the outset. Agree?

Some are making it seem like the mother had difficulty getting her child back from him. If that is true then it still can.

[zh cohen]

Then I must have gotten confused with a different link. I stand corrected.

I also thought I saw a picture on YWN, but I also saw the NYP article, so I may have confused them.

[skyguy918]

Not sure I am understanding. What I am pointing out is what the video shows.

The point is there's such a thing as a middle ground. The guy did something dumb, but not malicious. On the other side, I can see reason to be concerned, but also getting to the point of arrest/charges seems ridiculous. I would think this is exactly where someone (shomrim?) could have done their own minimal verification - including reviewing the footage - before involving the police. If there remained any doubt or even just hesitance from the family you can still involve the police after that.

Some are making it seem like the mother had difficulty getting her child back from him. If that is true then it still can.

That's nice but the video doesn't support that in the least bit.

[aygart]

. I would think this is exactly where someone could have done their own minimal verification - including reviewing the footage - before involving the police.

.....

That's nice but the video doesn't support that in the least bit.

Seriously? Putting aside whether or not the allegations make sense to have been made, should they wait hours before calling the police? How does that make sense?


The video I saw does not reach the mother getting the child back.

[jj1000]

That's nice but the video doesn't support that in the least bit.

Who is the woman at the end of the video and did she say anything to him?

[CountValentine]

The point is there's such a thing as a middle ground. The guy did something dumb, but not malicious. On the other side, I can see reason to be concerned, but also getting to the point of arrest/charges seems ridiculous. I would think this is exactly where someone (shomrim?) could have done their own minimal verification - including reviewing the footage - before involving the police. If there remained any doubt or even just hesitance from the family you can still involve the police after that.

The point is at the time the police had no idea if it was malicious or not. I am guessing others seen what happened and probably backed up the mother's version. The video also backs up her version. Touching someone's child is crossing the line.

Now playing devil's advocate. What didn't the man right in front of him grab the child? Why didn't he walk out with the man right in front of him instead of the child?

[yesitsme]

I don't think anyone is blaming the mother for calling police,
the outrage is on the outrage of a nothing burger.
first do your due diligence and investigate the facts on ground before you trash the other guy

[yesitsme]

- Matzav report on the fake kidnap abduction story In the meantime, an innocent man was dragged through the mud by the media – including portions of so-called “frum media,” which has no limits on what it will report and won’t bother doing a modicum of investigation. The only “creeps” in this story are the reporters and news outlets who couldn’t run fast enough to release a story without knowing the facts.

[yuneeq]

Who is the woman at the end of the video and did she say anything to him?

That is his mother. She is in the entire video and was looking towards her son the entire time.

[CountValentine]

I don't think anyone is blaming the mother for calling police,

I think you are mistaken.

Unreal he wasn't even with the kid by the time this was reported by this kid's crazy nutty mother.

Why doesn't YWN post the mother's name and picture?

[yesitsme]

I think you are mistaken.

that was not about calling police, its about not dropping charges, i assume

[yuneeq]

I don't think anyone is blaming the mother for calling police,
the outrage is on the outrage of a nothing burger.
first do your due diligence and investigate the facts on ground before you trash the other guy

When she reported it, it automatically will be reported publicly as an alleged abduction/luring based on what she saw and testified, and based on what the video shows. There was no reason to think otherwise until he was found. Trashing him or coming to conclusions before he has his chance to speak is obviously wrong as well.

[CountValentine]

that was not about calling police, its about not dropping charges, i assume

"crazy nutty mother" makes it clear, no?

[yesitsme]

When she reported it, it automatically will be reported publicly as an alleged abduction/luring based on what she saw and testified, and based on what the video shows. There was no reason to think otherwise until he was found. Trashing him or coming to conclusions before he has his chance to speak is obviously wrong as well.

thats not her job to investigate its the job of the police, i would also call police maybe shomrim

[whacked1]

That is his mother. She is in the entire video and was looking towards her son the entire time.

I just re-watched the video a few times even more so, I believe the mother did the 100% right thing.

1) the man was not looking at the adults the whole time
2) child comes and he whispers to the child something
3) puts his hand on the child
4) when the mother grabs the child, the man does not make eye contact or look at the woman, rather scurry away

[aygart]

I don't think anyone is blaming the mother for calling police,

. I would think this is exactly where someone (shomrim?) could have done their own minimal verification - including reviewing the footage - before involving the police. If there remained any doubt or even just hesitance from the family you can still involve the police after that.

[skyguy918]

Seriously? Putting aside whether or not the allegations make sense to have been made, should they wait hours before calling the police? How does that make sense?


The video I saw does not reach the mother getting the child back.

First of all, who said anything about waiting hours? How long does is take to look at camera footage? I'm not expecting the family to do this on their own. They didn't call the police directly in the first place. But once shomrim is there, what exactly is the point of calling them instead of the police if they didn't bother trying to see what was going on and just called the police themselves?

And second of all, the guy was gone already anyway. The only reason they 'found' him so quick is because people knew who he is and where he would be (in seder).

The video I saw does not reach the mother getting the child back.

I hate to call you out like this, but that's classic @aygart right there. Maybe go watch the full video before discussing it?

Who is the woman at the end of the video and did she say anything to him?

Don't know which is which, but I saw elsewhere that one is the mother and one is an aunt.

I don't think anyone is blaming the mother for calling police,

Don't put words in my mouth.

[yesitsme]

she might have done different doesn't make her doing something wrong, they are both on the same level, they both might have done things differently that would avoid this confusion
the only one that outright wrong is the media

seriously he did something wrong for not looking on women, come on man

[yesitsme]

btw just for the record i checked my calendar and today is Friday!!

[skyguy918]

seriously he did something wrong for not looking on women, come on man

No, he did something wrong by using the child to avoid the problem in a way that created an opening for this whole story to unfold. He could've done a lot of things differently to avoid it.