Author Topic: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?  (Read 5400 times)

Offline imayid2

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #60 on: March 28, 2023, 02:30:10 PM »
It does not seem like you read the quotes I posted.
I did.
I donít see your problem with the pshat presented.

Offline aygart

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #61 on: March 28, 2023, 03:25:30 PM »
I did.
I donít see your problem with the pshat presented.
1. These things are a definite result of things spreading wildly on SM (regardless of the novel pshat in the CC)
2. Is it results based or action based?
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline imayid2

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #62 on: March 28, 2023, 03:29:58 PM »
1. These things are a definite result of things spreading wildly on SM (regardless of the novel pshat in the CC)
2. Is it results based or action based?
Iím not referring to a specific case.
If you know that the information you give will be used to do something Halacha doesnít allow itís prohibited to relay it.

What are you finding novel?

Offline aygart

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #63 on: March 28, 2023, 03:36:24 PM »
Iím not referring to a specific case.
If you know that the information you give will be used to do something Halacha doesnít allow itís prohibited to relay it.

What are you finding novel?
I am referring to this case where he was saying that it can be posted around based on seeing something fishy.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline aygart

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #64 on: March 28, 2023, 03:37:41 PM »

What are you finding novel?
To say that causing damage which is a result means saying it is second hand information.

This is besides that "something fishy" is not second hand information.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline imayid2

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #65 on: March 28, 2023, 03:41:47 PM »
To say that causing damage which is a result means saying it is second hand information.
Not sure what you mean. Itís explicit that you may relay unconfirmed second hand information לתועלת if  you are careful to say itís unconfirmed.

Offline moko

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #66 on: March 28, 2023, 03:42:55 PM »
We'll cover Kashrus scandals and non scandals today/tonight as well
https://us02web.zoom.us/j/83030495451?pwd=dnkwRG5Zc3UyL0lGOTVBZ0RFZERBUT09

Offline aygart

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #67 on: March 28, 2023, 03:55:20 PM »
Not sure what you mean. Itís explicit that you may relay unconfirmed second hand information לתועלת if  you are careful to say itís unconfirmed.

But only if it won't be gorem nezek.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline imayid2

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #68 on: March 28, 2023, 04:07:29 PM »
But only if it won't be gorem nezek.
Heís talking about unwarranted hezek which isnít Halachikly allowed under למיחש. Any source for not allowing damage within Halachikly allowed למיחש?

Offline imayid2

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #69 on: March 28, 2023, 06:49:10 PM »
But only if it won't be gorem nezek.
It is clear from הלכות רכילות כלל ט that הסרת טובה isnít נכלל in ďhezekĒ. I have no understanding of why not  shopping/eating somewhere because youíre concerned about the Kashrus should be anything more than הסרת טובה.

Offline avromie7

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #70 on: March 28, 2023, 07:35:07 PM »
It is clear from הלכות רכילות כלל ט that הסרת טובה isnít נכלל in ďhezekĒ. I have no understanding of why not  shopping/eating somewhere because youíre concerned about the Kashrus should be anything more than הסרת טובה.
That may be a good argument if you aren't already a customer.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline imayid2

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #71 on: March 28, 2023, 07:48:38 PM »
That may be a good argument if you aren't already a customer.
I have no idea why that would change if you are ďa customerĒ. There is no din to continue to shop somewhere youíve been shopping at.

Offline aygart

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #72 on: March 28, 2023, 07:49:18 PM »
It is clear from הלכות רכילות כלל ט that הסרת טובה isnít נכלל in ďhezekĒ. I have no understanding of why not  shopping/eating somewhere because youíre concerned about the Kashrus should be anything more than הסרת טובה.
The reputation would be ruined.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline imayid2

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #73 on: March 28, 2023, 07:55:26 PM »
The reputation would be ruined.
That is totally not true. If I as an individual change where I shop that does not ruin the reputation.

Offline yungermanchik

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #74 on: March 28, 2023, 07:58:32 PM »
I have no idea why that would change if you are ďa customerĒ. There is no din to continue to shop somewhere youíve been shopping at.
ערכין טז from אברהם אבינו
Small people talk about other people.
Average people talk about things
BIG PEOPLE TALK ABOUT IDEAS.

Offline avromie7

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #75 on: March 28, 2023, 08:02:23 PM »
That is totally not true. If I as an individual change where I shop that does not ruin the reputation.
If all the individuals stop shopping there, you completely destroy his businesses.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline imayid2

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #76 on: March 28, 2023, 08:10:06 PM »
If all the individuals stop shopping there, you completely destroy his businesses.
There are two aspects:
Telling someone else: you are allowed to tell people on an individual basis.
The one who hears: can be חושש, for example if you hear someone is dishonest you are allowed to not take him as business partner etc. even though if all individuals donít do business with him he wonít have parnassa. No reason this should be any different.

Offline imayid2

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #77 on: March 28, 2023, 08:14:28 PM »
ערכין טז from אברהם אבינו
?

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #78 on: March 28, 2023, 08:20:11 PM »
I heard a story (that I'm having trouble finding now) that in the early days of the Rebbeís leadership, there was a bakery in Crown Heights about which unfounded rumors were spread and people stopped shopping there. The owners were extremely distressed, they were going to lose their livelihood. Then one day, the Rebbe got someone to buy a cake from them, and the Rebbe made sure to be seen walking in 770 holding the cake. Needles to say, people weren't concerned about the rumors any more.

Offline aygart

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Re: [Update: Fake News B"H] Another Kashrus scandal?
« Reply #79 on: March 28, 2023, 08:36:05 PM »
That is totally not true. If I as an individual change where I shop that does not ruin the reputation.

Are you being intentionally obtuse? If a person spreads on SM that he found @Something Fishy:P ]in an establishment then his reputation is ruined.
Feelings don't care about your facts