Author Topic: ADL  (Read 10999 times)

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: ADL
« Reply #60 on: September 07, 2023, 11:17:58 AM »

What I find surprising (maybe not) is where most come down on ADL.

I just want to reiterate what I've said a couple of times - my thoughts on the ADL have no bearing on what I think of this ADL-Twitter/Musk fight, which is that Musk has basically given cover for all antisemites to express their bigotry under the guise of attacking the ADL. It is a mirror image of how antisemites use "Zionism" or "Israel" to cover for their antisemitism. Anyone who is hopping on board the Musk train has some pretty Nazi company

Offline CountValentine

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Re: ADL
« Reply #61 on: September 07, 2023, 11:21:31 AM »
I just want to reiterate what I've said a couple of times - my thoughts on the ADL have no bearing on what I think of this ADL-Twitter/Musk fight, which is that Musk has basically given cover for all antisemites to express their bigotry under the guise of attacking the ADL. It is a mirror image of how antisemites use "Zionism" or "Israel" to cover for their antisemitism. Anyone who is hopping on board the Musk train has some pretty Nazi company
Is your position that ADL is selective in their fight against antisemitism?
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Offline Sammy82

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Re: ADL
« Reply #62 on: September 07, 2023, 11:23:29 AM »
Is your position that ADL is selective in their fight against antisemitism?
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Offline Dan

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Re: ADL
« Reply #63 on: September 07, 2023, 11:26:26 AM »
It is a mirror image of how antisemites use "Zionism" or "Israel" to cover for their antisemitism. Anyone who is hopping on board the Musk train has some pretty Nazi company
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: ADL
« Reply #64 on: September 07, 2023, 12:08:12 PM »
Can you give an example?

Is your position that ADL is selective in their fight against antisemitism?

This article describes the changes Greenblatt made to the mission of the organization

https://www.commentary.org/articles/seth-mandel/adl-progressives-antisemitism-greenblatt/

Here is an example of double standards
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/new-adl-guide-blasts-right-wing-anti-semites-gives-left-leaning-bigots-a-pass


And this is from way before he even took over

I don't know when this video is from, pre or post riots, but a little context as to how the Crown Heights community was helped by the ADL and other Jewish organizations during the riots

https://twitter.com/Mottel/status/1427333067694346244

There is way, way more out there.

ADL on Ilhan Omar: https://www.foxnews.com/media/adl-ilhan-omar-cnn-interview-anti-semitic-statements
ADL on Kyrie Irving: https://www.adl.org/resources/press-release/adl-statement-kyrie-irvings-apology
ADL on Ye: https://www.adl.org/resources/blog/ye-kanye-west-what-you-need-know

The list goes on and on.

You're picking the most high-profile cases, 2 of which are not even "left-wing". Those were the biggest news stories of their day, imagine they wouldn't have said anything then! But we experience antisemitism DAILY in Brooklyn. Every. Single. Day. Jews get accosted for being Jewish and the ADL has done NOTHING. I don't care. I don't expect them to. They are a progressive political group that removed antisemitism from their mission statement years ago.

Offline yuneeq

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Re: ADL
« Reply #65 on: September 07, 2023, 01:14:01 PM »
You fixed that for your own agenda, no?
I want to know what most Jews think of the ADL not a minority view.

Not to beat a dead horse, but the visibly Jewish sect suffers the most from antisemitism, and they represent Jews more visibly than the rest. If the ADL doesn’t care or speak up for them, then they cannot be considered a representative of Jewish interests. Imagine if the Christian equivalent of the ADL would not defend hateful attacks against Christians that wear a cross.
Visibly Jewish

Offline CountValentine

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Re: ADL
« Reply #66 on: September 07, 2023, 01:28:45 PM »
Imagine if the Christian equivalent of the ADL would not defend hateful attacks against Christians that wear a cross.
That would be a very small minority.
The majority of Christians would believe they were defending their interest.

When did all of a sudden we start using the term "visible Jewish"? Are we not talking about strict religious Jews?
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Offline CountValentine

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Re: ADL
« Reply #67 on: September 07, 2023, 01:35:16 PM »
Here is an example of double standards
https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/new-adl-guide-blasts-right-wing-anti-semites-gives-left-leaning-bigots-a-pass
Sorry I meant an example of where someone made antisemitic remarks in the news where the ADL did not call them out. I gave examples of them calling out the right and left. I can also provide many more.
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Offline jj1000

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Re: ADL
« Reply #68 on: September 07, 2023, 02:07:14 PM »
That would be a very small minority.
The majority of Christians would believe they were defending their interest.

When did all of a sudden we start using the term "visible Jewish"? Are we not talking about strict religious Jews?
Seems obvious when it comes to antisemitic acts to differentiate between visible Jews and not. Same for visible Jewish targets, shuls, kosher stores etc.
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Offline Alexsei

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Re: ADL
« Reply #69 on: September 07, 2023, 03:04:54 PM »
When 90% of Jews aren't Orthodox any organisation claiming to represent Jews should represent the values of the 90% not the 10% otherwise they can't claim they're presenting Jews...
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Offline Yehuda57

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Re: ADL
« Reply #70 on: September 07, 2023, 03:11:41 PM »
Sorry I meant an example of where someone made antisemitic remarks in the news where the ADL did not call them out. I gave examples of them calling out the right and left. I can also provide many more.

Firstly, I gave a slew of examples of double standards within those pieces I linked to, including the one you quoted. But even putting that aside, what is the purpose of the ADL? To make a press statement every time a public figure says something antisemitic? We're literally giving you examples of real-life experiences that we have every day and the ADL is silent about it and you're asking about stuff that makes it to the news? Obviously, they condemn antisemitic things that make the news (even then, the forcefulness and quantity of pushback varies greatly depending on where the antisemitism is coming from), but they do practically nothing to "defend" the Jews who actually experience the bulk of antisemitism.

But again, they removed fighting antisemitism from their mission statement a few years ago and changed it to "stop the defamation of the Jewish people ..." They are no longer an organization that fights antisemitism (and did a piss poor job of it even when they were), they are a progressive organization dedicated to a progressive idea of social justice (which all too often doesn't know where Jews belong on the victimhood ladder known as "intersectionality").

And again, I don't particularly care that they don't do anything to stop people attacking my family and neighbors in Brooklyn. They are a multi-million dollar political organization, and you'd be hard-pressed to find any such organization that is worth anything.


Offline EliJelly

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Re: ADL
« Reply #71 on: September 07, 2023, 03:17:43 PM »
When 90% of Jews aren't Orthodox any organisation claiming to represent Jews should represent the values of the 90% not the 10% otherwise they can't claim they're presenting Jews...

I know this is a joke but to make it clear so CV shouldn't be mislead. Jews = Orthodox Jews. Whether or not the 90% are capable or willing to live as authentic Jews makes no difference. It's not like they have different values that requires different representation. In any case, Orthodox Jews aren't caring or expecting to have organizations like ADL's representing us in the first place.

Offline Alexsei

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Re: ADL
« Reply #72 on: September 07, 2023, 03:33:27 PM »
I know this is a joke but to make it clear so CV shouldn't be mislead. Jews = Orthodox Jews. Whether or not the 90% are capable or willing to live as authentic Jews makes no difference. It's not like they have different values that requires different representation. In any case, Orthodox Jews aren't caring or expecting to have organizations like ADL's representing us in the first place.

If Jews = Orthodox Jews then ADL isn't representing Jews at all, they probably harm Jews.

If Jews ≠ Orthodox Jews then ADL is probably doing a good job advocating for them.
Jews ≠ Zionists
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Offline CountValentine

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Re: ADL
« Reply #73 on: September 07, 2023, 04:10:34 PM »
Seems obvious when it comes to antisemitic acts to differentiate between visible Jews and not. Same for visible Jewish targets, shuls, kosher stores etc.
Can you explain what a "visible Jew" is?
I would assume you are a "visible Jew".
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Offline CountValentine

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Re: ADL
« Reply #74 on: September 07, 2023, 04:12:23 PM »
I know this is a joke but to make it clear so CV shouldn't be mislead. Jews = Orthodox Jews.
I thought we were talking about Orthodox Jews until everyone started using "visible Jew".
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Offline CountValentine

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Re: ADL
« Reply #75 on: September 07, 2023, 04:12:58 PM »
If Jews = Orthodox Jews then ADL isn't representing Jews at all, they probably harm Jews.

If Jews ≠ Orthodox Jews then ADL is probably doing a good job advocating for them.
End of discussion!!!  :)
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Offline Alexsei

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Re: ADL
« Reply #76 on: September 07, 2023, 04:16:09 PM »
Can you explain what a "visible Jew" is?
I would assume you are a "visible Jew".
It goes by their nose but you may need to be an anthropologist to identify them
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Offline Yehuda57

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Re: ADL
« Reply #77 on: September 07, 2023, 04:36:30 PM »
Can you explain what a "visible Jew" is?
I would assume you are a "visible Jew".

Someone that you can tell is Jewish when you pass them on the street. When a dude spits at me and curses me out, he's not doing that because I'm Orthodox, but because I'm Jewish. if I was walking with a reform Jew who was wearing a yarmulke and tzitzis he wouldn't get a pass because he's not Orthodox. Non-visible Jews don't experience the same type and level of antisemitism

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Re: ADL
« Reply #78 on: September 07, 2023, 04:39:40 PM »
When a dude spits at me and curses me out, he's not doing that because I'm Orthodox, but because I'm Jewish.
I hope the Amish are not in the same area.  ;)
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Offline CountValentine

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Re: ADL
« Reply #79 on: September 07, 2023, 04:41:20 PM »
Just from a basic Google search there is hundreds of articles like this. Isn't this a good thing?
https://www.adl.org/resources/press-release/adl-calls-americas-workplaces-adopt-pledge-fighting-antisemitism-plans
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