Israel vs. Iran And Proxies: War Discussion Master Thread

[Euclid]

https://www.jyrics.com/lyrics/it-happened-yom-kippur/
The song going through my head on ST when I heard the news

[justaregularguy]

48+ hours into this nightmare and Israel still has not gained control of the situation. Netanyahu and every General needs to be fired. Now. Dont tell me I need to wait until after the war. We are losing now! We are not gaining control! We are not attacking the way we should! This is a complete embaressment!

Can't do mass air strikes due to hostages.
Can't go into Gaza unless there's enough forces ready to fully occupy it. But I'm sure it's coming.

These are my exact 2 feelings I’m getting. On the one side it’s frustrating that Gaza needs to be flattened already every minute is precious. And yet on the other hand it is so hard with hostages you can’t  go and just flatten gaza.

It’s so tempting to read up and stay in the know but you should know you are 100% participating in the war when you say a perek Tehilim, when you give tzedakah and say the zechus should go to our brothers in eretz yisroel, when you do a little extra something to help someone or cheer them up.

Mitzvos need chavana/intent so be a drop more aware of a mitzvah you’re performing b’zechus acheinu bnei yisroel.
 We will carpet bomb them with our zechusim.

[yelped]

What's the plan when entering and occupying, overthrowing the Hamas regime? What's the plan after, who will govern the 2 million angry uncivilized population, the Israeli forces? Impossible. Or maybe they'll just enter to destroy target locations, eliminate current terrorist cells, hopefully recover the hostages alive, and? Hope for a few months of quiet until Hamas drafts new terrorists and restocks their rocket stockpile?

This looks like a vicious rinse and repeat cycle with no endgame vision in sight. To all those calling for severe and deadly retaliation, revenge surly feels great but is there any method to eliminate the threat once and for all? What am I missing?

Mashiach, plain and simple. No other way.

[EliJelly]

Mashiach, plain and simple. No other way.

Exactly my point! All other calls for this and that seems odd and missing the point to me.

[Euclid]

https://www.jyrics.com/lyrics/it-happened-yom-kippur/
The song going through my head on ST when I heard the news

https://twitter.com/safier/status/1711243203536458057

[ilherman]

Some of the stuff that happened here almost make no sense!

Doesn't Israel have advanced air capabilities? How in the world was a bulldozer allowed to work at the wall without being bombed within minutes? How did Thousand fighters manage to enter Israel without a single shot being fired at them?  How were they able to roam free on the streets of these Kibutzim without the IDF being right there??

Do we ever have basic answers to these questions

[Dan]

Mashiach, plain and simple. No other way.

Correct. This is golus.

[Dan]

https://www.jyrics.com/lyrics/it-happened-yom-kippur/
The song going through my head on ST when I heard the news

We sang it towards the end of hakafos last night as we neared midnight.

[sam2015]

Let’s remember that the Israeli army will only be as successful as הקב״ה wants it to be. And this largely depends on Klal Yisroel’s zechusim. Of course there has to be a hishtadlus, and not just a minor hishtadlus. We have to work hard and do everything possible as if it all depends on us - while at the same time remembering that we are not the one controlling the events and outcome. Anyone familiar with R’ Avigdor Miller’s teachings will know that a minor hishtadlus can be just an excuse for laziness. But while we are working extremely hard and planning every aspect - הקב״ה will be the one that makes it successful. If He doesn’t want Gaza wiped out then it can’t be no matter what we can try to do. So while it’s nice to have “ideas” what you think the IDF should do - keep in mind the results are not up to them.

[AMH]

Some of the stuff that happened here almost make no sense!

Doesn't Israel have advanced air capabilities? How in the world was a bulldozer allowed to work at the wall without being bombed within minutes? How did Thousand fighters manage to enter Israel without a single shot being fired at them?  How were they able to roam free on the streets of these Kibutzim without the IDF being right there??

Do we ever have basic answers to these questions

Not 1 part of this infiltration makes sense
Im hashem lo yishmor..............

[ExGingi]

What's the plan when entering and occupying, overthrowing the Hamas regime? What's the plan after, who will govern the 2 million angry uncivilized population, the Israeli forces? Impossible. Or maybe they'll just enter to destroy target locations, eliminate current terrorist cells, hopefully recover the hostages alive, and? Hope for a few months of quiet until Hamas drafts new terrorists and restocks their rocket stockpile?

This looks like a vicious rinse and repeat cycle with no endgame vision in sight. To all those calling for severe and deadly retaliation, revenge surly feels great but is there any method to eliminate the threat once and for all? What am I missing?

The only possible man made solution is bringing the enemy down on their knees to complete surrender. Think Nazi Germany, think Imperial Japan.

[EliJelly]

What do people have in mind when using the phrase "have Gaza wiped out", "carpet bombing Gaza", like literally wipe out two million people off the face of the earth in 2023?

[EliJelly]

The only possible man made solution is bringing the enemy down on their knees to complete surrender. Think Nazi Germany, think Imperial Japan.

Hmm.. I think "Think Taliban" is more appropriate here. The two you mentioned were evil country governments, not entire populations raised to become martyrs in the holy war.

[shapsam]

Some of the stuff that happened here almost make no sense!

Doesn't Israel have advanced air capabilities? How in the world was a bulldozer allowed to work at the wall without being bombed within minutes? How did Thousand fighters manage to enter Israel without a single shot being fired at them?  How were they able to roam free on the streets of these Kibutzim without the IDF being right there??

Do we ever have basic answers to these questions

First they disabled the system that shoots down anything that approaches the barrier (מערכת רואה יורה).

https://www.ynet.co.il/news/article/byj4jpcl6

[Yehuda57]

https://twitter.com/safier/status/1711243203536458057

https://twitter.com/JMMusings/status/1711174784569025006

[mevinyavin]

Cue "Someone's child." There are at least six kids I've personally known since they were not yet Bar Mitzvah who are on the front right now. I'm sure the number is exponentially higher for Israelis in any other circles.

[yuneeq]

CNN TV has been doing a very good job covering this story. Much better than Fox so far.
Interviewing many parents with heartbreaking stories including Americans with kidnapped kids with messaged for the President, and presenting the facts without resorting to saying good people on both sides.

CNN dictionary - terrorist = militant

[Proisrael]

Ok, their fired. Now what?
This is not time for politics.

Politics?!?! These are the leaders going into war!! There is not confidence in them, it has nothing to do with politics.

[kosherjid]

Starting new thread for discussion here

?!? ?!? why is this in: Just Schmooze. Visit this board to kick back and talk about anything worthless. ?!?!??!?

[mevinyavin]

I'm seeing messages on WhatsApp from Israeli soldiers begging people to donate up to date gear..

Seriously? Is this Ukraine? This is Ukraine level requests... This is pathetic.

And with all these issues they are still thinking of attacking Iran? They can't figure it with Hamas how will they win over Iran?

FWIW
https://www.timesofisrael.com/reserve-soldiers-complain-that-equipment-is-lacking-or-substandard/