Author Topic: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam  (Read 55849 times)

Offline Dan

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #240 on: June 03, 2014, 02:31:15 PM »
They put vaccines in the milk.
If you drink the milk you don't need a VA appointment to treat that tumor for at least 18 months.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Online Moshe123

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #241 on: June 03, 2014, 02:53:32 PM »
Does anyone have a pdf of the mehadrin kuntres from before Pesach? There were some pretty damning stories with today's cholov akum.
Yeah, they're a business, but there were some real arguments about major problems that have arisen since Reb Moshe's psak that didn't exist then.
I managed to forget the content.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #242 on: June 03, 2014, 03:47:59 PM »
I've seen stam CS in a local dollar store for 99c. A comparable size CY cream cheese in Lakewood is 4.99.
Its still not  שבער צו זיין איד:)

Offline henche

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #243 on: June 03, 2014, 04:06:02 PM »
Does anyone have a pdf of the mehadrin kuntres from before Pesach? There were some pretty damning stories with today's cholov akum.
Yeah, they're a business, but there were some real arguments about major problems that have arisen since Reb Moshe's psak that didn't exist then.
I managed to forget the content.

What kind of problems?  Are there secret pig dairy farms where they milk pigs and then sneak it into our milk?

Offline lunatic

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #244 on: June 03, 2014, 04:13:51 PM »
I've seen stam CS in a local dollar store for 99c. A comparable size CY cream cheese in Lakewood is 4.99.
Its still not  שבער צו זיין איד:)

+1 I got a bargain... 4.59 for Cy cream cheese. Cs was 1.29

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #245 on: June 03, 2014, 04:49:28 PM »
What kind of problems?  Are there secret pig dairy farms where they milk pigs and then sneak it into our milk?
no, DA cows are treif. CS milk does not have supervision over the milking process and therefore they do not separate the DA traif cows from the herd. They rely on dubious uncompleted teshuvos, written by rav hamachshirs that literally had absolutely no choice but to come up with a "heter".... (There was no option to take the OU of thousands of products)
FTR, Rav elyashiv paskend that CS is cholov treifa.

Offline henche

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #246 on: June 03, 2014, 04:58:10 PM »
no, DA cows are treif. CS milk does not have supervision over the milking process and therefore they do not separate the DA traif cows from the herd. They rely on dubious uncompleted teshuvos, written by rav hamachshirs that literally had absolutely no choice but to come up with a "heter".... (There was no option to take the OU of thousands of products)
FTR, Rav elyashiv paskend that CS is cholov treifa.

oh that. That's nothing new. We've known about that for years and years.

I seem to recall some decent posts about it on YWN, if you can get past the OT lunacies. Here, I searched for chalav treifah and found it http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/chalav-stam-no-such-a-thing


Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #247 on: June 03, 2014, 05:03:09 PM »
oh that. That's nothing new. We've known about that for years and years.

I seem to recall some decent posts about it on YWN, if you can get past the OT lunacies. Here, I searched for chalav treifah and found it http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/coffeeroom/topic/chalav-stam-no-such-a-thing

Here is the official OU opinion (looks like they are trying too/very hard...)

http://oukosher.org/blog/consumer-kosher/milk-from-a-possibly-treif-cow/


And the other side:

http://yudelstake.blogspot.com/2007/07/cholov-stam-cholov-akum-cholov-treife.html?m=1

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #248 on: June 03, 2014, 05:11:49 PM »
no, DA cows are treif. CS milk does not have supervision over the milking process and therefore they do not separate the DA traif cows from the herd. They rely on dubious uncompleted teshuvos, written by rav hamachshirs that literally had absolutely no choice but to come up with a "heter".... (There was no option to take the OU of thousands of products)
FTR, Rav elyashiv paskend that CS is cholov treifa.
don't just repeat his nonsense about it being unfinished. Just look in Rav Belsky's sefer
Just because things turned out a certain way doesn't mean you were right.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #249 on: June 03, 2014, 05:54:45 PM »
don't just repeat his nonsense about it being unfinished. Just look in Rav Belsky's sefer
OK. wtvr, the point was that the teshuva originally was marked incomplete.

There was no choice but to be mattir.
Should we rely on the OU's shaas hadchak?

Offline ryg

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Re: Re: Paris Master Thread
« Reply #250 on: June 03, 2014, 09:56:43 PM »
When I lived OOT, I would pay $5.99 for 1/2 gal and $10.99 for a gallon if milk.  American cheese was $28.99 for a brick (108 slices?).  Frozen pizza was $18.99.
And this was 6+ years ago.

These are still the prices today in the smaller out of town communities - I live in Portland, Oregon and a block of American cheese is $27-28.

Offline Armadillo

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #251 on: June 04, 2014, 06:28:42 PM »
Either way the tens of dollars over the course of a year aren't a "hardship" for 95% of folks..
Way to play it down...if the numbers here are true, any decent sized family buying milk in an out of town community would be paying in the vicinity of $500 more a year for CY, not just 'tens' (and that's just for milk)
I definitely know families that $500 would go a long way
(full disclosure: I'm makpid on CY and encourage its use)

Offline Dan

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #252 on: June 06, 2014, 04:17:19 PM »
These are still the prices today in the smaller out of town communities - I live in Portland, Oregon and a block of American cheese is $27-28.
Costco doesn't sell cheese in PDX?

Way to play it down...if the numbers here are true, any decent sized family buying milk in an out of town community would be paying in the vicinity of $500 more a year for CY, not just 'tens' (and that's just for milk)
I definitely know families that $500 would go a long way
(full disclosure: I'm makpid on CY and encourage its use)
We go through a half gallon of milk a week=$169/year at 3.25/bottle.  The non-CY stuff would save perhaps $80/year. (Tens of dollars or TODs is a famous battle cry on the UA FT board.)
Cheese is the same price thanks to Costco.

Also big families (and even small families) here where $500 would make a big difference get free milk from WIC.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline lunatic

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #253 on: June 06, 2014, 04:35:21 PM »
Costco doesn't sell cheese in PDX?
We go through a half gallon of milk a week=$169/year at 3.25/bottle.  The non-CY stuff would save perhaps $80/year. (Tens of dollars or TODs is a famous battle cry on the UA FT board.)
Cheese is the same price thanks to Costco.

Also big families (and even small families) here where $500 would make a big difference get free milk from WIC.

My family is not big, but my son himself drinks 3 gallons a week... aside from the rest of us

Offline henche

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Re: The Rolls Must Be Hamotzi, But The Milk Can Be Cholov Stam
« Reply #254 on: June 06, 2014, 04:36:59 PM »
My family is not big, but my son himself drinks 3 gallons a week... aside from the rest of us

He must be as big as a medium size calf by now