Author Topic: Horrific Mental Health Related Tragedy In Lakewood  (Read 34457 times)

Offline zale

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #80 on: June 27, 2024, 12:51:40 PM »
I read the full police report and I'm no longer convinced in the family's doing enough or the bare minimum even.
The report goes into gruesome details that I don't understand why she wasn't in a psych ward.

How can a family allow a woman with a psychosis history to work daily in a day care??? They hid the facts from the day care?

I didn't read the whole report, but I agree with you 100%

This is never out of the blue.

Offline imayid2

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #81 on: June 27, 2024, 02:17:15 PM »
This organization has a nice setup helping couples with mental health struggles by helping to subsidize the prohibitive costs involved.
https://vnasu.org/
(I am not affiliated but I know some Rabbanim involved.)

Offline TheAsh

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #82 on: June 27, 2024, 03:37:37 PM »
Based on these numbers, such stories should occur in 1 out of every 200,000 births, and it clearly is not happening at that rate within our community. There is a very good chance that this is due to a mix of high awareness of mental health issues and the excellent communal support infrastructure.

There also might he a high rate genetic selection, and the fact that those with issue are more likely to sleep around something anathema in our community
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Offline TheAsh

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #83 on: June 27, 2024, 03:39:14 PM »
I read the full police report and I'm no longer convinced in the family's doing enough or the bare minimum even.
The report goes into gruesome details that I don't understand why she wasn't in a psych ward.

How can a family allow a woman with a psychosis history to work daily in a day care??? They hid the facts from the day care?

If there is one thing I would urge the community to change, its to remove the stigma of reporting to CPS. I'm aware of more than one mandated reporter who lost their job or was asked to leave after reporting.

This woman should not have had custody.
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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #84 on: June 27, 2024, 04:17:17 PM »
Based on these numbers, such stories should occur in 1 out of every 200,000 births, and it clearly is not happening at that rate within our community. There is a very good chance that this is due to a mix of high awareness of mental health issues and the excellent communal support infrastructure.
And the lack of narcotics usage.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #85 on: June 27, 2024, 04:21:10 PM »
If there is one thing I would urge the community to change, its to remove the stigma of reporting to CPS. I'm aware of more than one mandated reporter who lost their job or was asked to leave after reporting.

This woman should not have had custody.
If CPS was actually out to help you would have a fair point.

Who should have reported her? As a neighbor, I never heard anyone say anything about her being unfit to care for her children, no one in the neighborhood got that impression.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline TheAsh

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #86 on: June 27, 2024, 05:48:34 PM »
If CPS was actually out to help you would have a fair point.

Who should have reported her? As a neighbor, I never heard anyone say anything about her being unfit to care for her children, no one in the neighborhood got that impression.

Not you. Any of the medical professionals who dealt with this case.

Again, it could be it was reported. It's possible, likely even,  that this tragedy was essentially unpreventable.
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Online zh cohen

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #87 on: June 27, 2024, 05:51:14 PM »
If there is one thing I would urge the community to change, its to remove the stigma of reporting to CPS.

If there is one thing that would reduce the stigma of reporting to CPS, it would be for CPS to stop being so terrible...

Offline aygart

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #88 on: June 27, 2024, 06:06:55 PM »
Not you. Any of the medical professionals who dealt with this case.

Again, it could be it was reported. It's possible, likely even,  that this tragedy was essentially unpreventable.
The bigger question is if, considering what seems to be a long history of issues, she should have had children in the first place. It was definitely not the standard Lakewood family with her husband 13 years older than her and away in Virginia on business for over a month.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline aygart

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #89 on: June 27, 2024, 06:09:36 PM »
There also might he a high rate genetic selection, and the fact that those with issue are more likely to sleep around something anathema in our community
And the lack of narcotics usage.

I don't know enough of the science to know if these are a factor in postpartum psycosis specifically or if they are part of
infanticide data, not specifically infanticide due to psychosis
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline jye

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #90 on: June 27, 2024, 06:26:12 PM »
The bigger question is if, considering what seems to be a long history of issues, she should have had children in the first place. It was definitely not the standard Lakewood family with her husband 13 years older than her and away in Virginia on business for over a month.
There are inaccuracies in the media.

Online Euclid

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #91 on: June 27, 2024, 06:28:01 PM »
The bigger question is if, considering what seems to be a long history of issues, she should have had children in the first place. It was definitely not the standard Lakewood family with her husband 13 years older than her and away in Virginia on business for over a month.
I think he's younger than her

Offline aygart

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #92 on: June 27, 2024, 06:33:18 PM »
I think he's younger than her
I saw somewhere placing him at 40 but it could be wrong
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline aygart

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #93 on: June 27, 2024, 06:33:48 PM »
There are inaccuracies in the media.
Should've know
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline zale

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #94 on: June 27, 2024, 06:41:57 PM »
The bigger question is if, considering what seems to be a long history of issues, she should have had children in the first place. It was definitely not the standard Lakewood family with her husband 13 years older than her and away in Virginia on business for over a month.

The even bigger question is, how can a school hire someone with a history of severe mental illness, thereby putting children in danger?

Offline Mordyk

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #95 on: June 27, 2024, 06:52:27 PM »
The even bigger question is, how can a school hire someone with a history of severe mental illness, thereby putting children in danger?
This is huge.  And if the school didn't know, how did the family allow since they for sure knew of her history.  Scary to think what would be if she would have had this episode in school

Offline TheAsh

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #96 on: June 27, 2024, 06:56:33 PM »
If there is one thing that would reduce the stigma of reporting to CPS, it would be for CPS to stop being so terrible...

Lakewood is nowhere near as bad as NY, and even if CPS did a perfect job, what do you think all the abusive parents will say? That CPS was right!? CPS is doomed to have a bad reputation.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2024, 07:03:20 PM by TheAsh »
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Offline ExGingi

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #97 on: June 27, 2024, 06:59:24 PM »
Most frum practitioners do not take any insurance. Lower and middle income households are effectively priced out of decent care. No one is refused quality cancer treatment because of inability to afford it. For some reason, mental health care is treated differently.

It isn't just frum practitioners. Any practitioner with a bit of reputation doesn't take any insurance. If one is lucky, they will have insurance that covers out-of-network (something non-existent in the NY individual market which was created by Obamacare). And even when one has out-of-network benefits, deductibles and co-insurance come into play, as well as UCR (unless the practitioner is experienced enough to bill each session under several codes to get the entire fee covered).

Mental health is also something very hard to evaluate. Is it only the patient (or the patient and their family) and the practitioner? Would it not be more appropriate to have a team of at least two professionals evaluating the care and effectiveness of treatment? Also with psychiatric meds there's always trial and error for the right med (the one that will have the desired effect with minimal side effects which can vary from patient to patient), a ramp-up adjustment period (where initial effect might be adverse) and getting to the right dosage.

I am aware of extreme cases where youngsters are sent to programs that cost tens of thousands of dollars trying to help them.

I don't think this is something that will be solved within our communities (which in a way are better off due to charitable efforts that help in some cases). This is a national (if not global) problem, and needs rethinking of how mental health is made available and managed.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #98 on: June 27, 2024, 07:49:40 PM »
I saw somewhere placing him at 40 but it could be wrong
Think they confused his age with the landlord's age.

Also, i would assume that he was away on a previous trip in May and then was away for a different trip in June. More likely than being away since May. 

Online avromie7

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Re: Horrific Tragedy In Lakewood
« Reply #99 on: June 27, 2024, 07:53:49 PM »
The bigger question is if, considering what seems to be a long history of issues, she should have had children in the first place. It was definitely not the standard Lakewood family with her husband 13 years older than her and away in Virginia on business for over a month.
I'm pretty sure he was away since June 24 not May 24.
I saw somewhere placing him at 40 but it could be wrong
Not even close. I'd be shocked of he's much over 30, if even that old.
Think they confused his age with the landlord's age
That makes sense.

All this is way you can't trust the media. Even when they try to get the facts, they're bound to get enough wrong that you can come to so many unfounded conclusions.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.