Author Topic: Messianism among Lubavitch  (Read 144921 times)

Offline Dan

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1320 on: July 27, 2017, 09:37:10 AM »
As we discussed up thread, and as is discussed in the video. It's not just esoteric quotes that caused this... - it's the actions, it's the whole "mori chomi shlita" hanhoga. Etc etc. Much much more.
You're repeating the same stuff from earlier in this thread that's been asked and answered. Ad nauseam.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1321 on: July 27, 2017, 09:38:34 AM »
You're repeating the same stuff from earlier in this thread that's been asked and answered. Ad nauseam.
Right. I'll stop here

Offline jj1000

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1322 on: July 27, 2017, 09:40:14 AM »
What is the cancer exactly? Can you define it and the problem with it?
Also numerous court battles and likely millions of dollars of legal fees is clearly allowing something to grow right?
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Offline Dan

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1323 on: July 27, 2017, 09:42:03 AM »
Also numerous court battles and likely millions of dollars of legal fees is clearly allowing something to grow right?
TBH I don't follow those or read the chabad news sites. But what ever came out of all of that?
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline jj1000

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1324 on: July 27, 2017, 09:46:00 AM »
TBH I don't follow those or read the chabad news sites. But what ever came out of all of that?
Maybe Exgingi can weigh in, but he's prob on the defending side :P
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Offline MeirS

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1325 on: July 27, 2017, 09:54:49 AM »
TBH I don't follow those or read the chabad news sites. But what ever came out of all of that?
this. Not sure if much more, or if there's any ideal solution to the issues at hand.

likely millions of dollars of legal fees spent


Offline aygart

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1326 on: July 27, 2017, 10:23:04 AM »
What is the cancer exactly? Can you define it and the problem with it?
I just want to get one thing clear since both you and others have written thing which seem to be cotradictory and I must be misunderstanding some nuance of it. Do you agree or deny that there are some extreme fringes of Lubavitch who have gone to extremes which seem to be apikursus or very close to it?
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline jj1000

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1327 on: July 27, 2017, 10:36:52 AM »
I just want to get one thing clear since both you and others have written thing which seem to be cotradictory and I must be misunderstanding some nuance of it. Do you agree or deny that there are some extreme fringes of Lubavitch who have gone to extremes which seem to be apikursus or very close to it?
There are people who call themselves Lubavitch that are like that, sure ;)
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Offline Dan

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1328 on: July 27, 2017, 10:45:34 AM »
I just want to get one thing clear since both you and others have written thing which seem to be cotradictory and I must be misunderstanding some nuance of it. Do you agree or deny that there are some extreme fringes of Lubavitch who have gone to extremes which seem to be apikursus or very close to it?
I was in a Litvish mosad for 9 years and heard all about how Chabad isn't Judaism.

I then spent 8 years in Chabad mosdos, some anti-meshichist, some meshichist, and I've never encountered anyone or anything that could remotely be construed as apikorsos.

I've always heard rumors of a few wacko "elokistim" that live in Tzfas. But if such people do exist, they are the .0001% loons that exist in every walk of life.

Most people take issue with the belief that the Rebbe could be moshiach, not of 3 loons in Tzfas. And people who think that there is any connection to apikorsus c"v or Shabsai Tzvi (who blatantly violated halacha) are simply ignorant of actual halacha.
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Offline aygart

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1329 on: July 27, 2017, 10:58:51 AM »
There are people who call themselves Lubavitch that are like that, sure ;)
I now what that wink is about. You said it yourself and there is no need for me to.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline aygart

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1330 on: July 27, 2017, 11:04:21 AM »
I was in a Litvish mosad for 9 years and heard all about how Chabad isn't Judaism.
From what I have seen of mainstream Chabad that sounds ridiculous
Shabsai Tzvi (who blatantly violated halacha)
The issues with Shabsai Tzvi were already before then.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline jj1000

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1331 on: July 27, 2017, 11:06:45 AM »
I now what that wink is about. You said it yourself and there is no need for me to.
you asked what seemed a really broad question. I'm answering that elokistim think they are Lubavitvh but that's in their mind they really are not Lubavitch. I can share a video with you of them and it'll prob help understand.
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Offline AsherO

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1332 on: July 27, 2017, 12:15:01 PM »
I've a few litvish friends who love mussar and said they would happily commit suicide right now if they knew they would get into gan Eden after. That's a bit loony to me too.  But it's just an offshoot of musar right?

I smell a frum suicide cult, these guys are ripe for recruitment (we can then merge this thread with the silent killer thread).
PGF24BMGS

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1333 on: July 27, 2017, 01:46:37 PM »
I've a few litvish friends who love mussar and said they would happily commit suicide right now if they knew they would get into gan Eden after. That's a bit loony to me too.  But it's just an offshoot of musar right?
What does mussar have to do with suicide and gan Eden?
I'm so confused. You definitely are hanging out with the wrong crowd.

Offline thaber

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #1334 on: July 27, 2017, 04:45:08 PM »
it's shocking that they don't have untouched beards, which is a basic requirement to be a Chabad chosid.
And likely a diorisah according to the tzemach tzedek iirc
They're more Satmar than those shaved dudes are Lubavitchers.
You guys are definitely due a visit to LA, but after those statements maybe bring body armor
The issues with Shabsai Tzvi were already before then.
IIRC that's when he lost mainstream backing.
What does mussar have to do with suicide and gan Eden?

+1. Mussar is not depressing, it's uplifting. Common Hasidic misconception :)