Author Topic: Messianism among Lubavitch  (Read 148436 times)

Offline Dan

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #720 on: January 16, 2013, 06:33:00 PM »
you sure or did the also mention his shver?
Lies, lies, and more lies.
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Offline Dan

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #721 on: January 16, 2013, 06:34:12 PM »
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Dan

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #722 on: January 16, 2013, 06:40:24 PM »
Basically he used to imply that;
A His shver is still around
B: His shver is the Nosi/Moshiach
C:that he (himself) is the Nosi/Moshiach
He caused all the confusion among all his chassidim, some think he's still alive, all think he's moshiach, and a few think he's more powerful than a mere human...
He consistently confused the masses with (what some believe to be nonsense and gibberish) about secret worlds and mystical concepts way above the pay-grade of the average chossid. This caused many to become enchanted and solidified his power base.
A. His shver was his Rebbe and he lived on through his teachings.
B. His Shver was his Nosi/Manhig Hador and thus his moshiach. No chiddush there.
C. He never implied that.  However as Side Incomer has already proven, chassidim hold their Rebbe to be the Nosi/Manhig HaDor and that is the Moshiach of that generation.
This is nothing new and not specific to Chabad!


He caused no such confusion  Secret worlds? It's called basic kaballah and chasidus.  Any chosid worth his salt can tell you about the worlds Aztilus, Briya, itzira, and Asiya.  About Atik Yomin and Aruch Anpin. About Makif and Sovev. About Atzmus Ain Sof.  What the hell does that have to do with this?

No sane person thinks him to be anything more than human.  Chassidim beleive their leader can be moshiach, I know, that was apparently a shocker to many of you today and I sincerely thank SI for stepping forward from the other side of the chasidic fence to confirm that.

Your lies are getting really pathetic.
Instead of continuing this thread any further (for what purpose is beyond me, you'll convince noone of anything) maybe do something more constructive than try to tear down a holy person with silly lies. 
Stop wasting time worrying about what other people are thinking!
« Last Edit: January 16, 2013, 06:44:35 PM by Dan »
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline whYME

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #723 on: January 16, 2013, 06:41:08 PM »
On the plus side, we're really scraping the bottom of the barrel by now with the taanos against lubavitch. We're all the way down to nitpicking on how the Rebbe was called up to the torah...

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #724 on: January 16, 2013, 06:51:52 PM »
A. His shver was his Rebbe and he lived on through his teachings.
B. His Shver was his Nosi/Manhig Hador and thus his moshiach. No chiddush there.
C. He never implied that.  However as Side Incomer has already proven, chassidim hold their Rebbe to be the Nosi/Manhig HaDor and that is the Moshiach of that generation.
This is nothing new and not specific to Chabad!


He caused no such confusion  Secret worlds? It's called basic kaballah and chasidus.  Any chosid worth his salt can tell you about the worlds Aztilus, Briya, itzira, and Asiya.  About Atik Yomin and Aruch Anpin. About Makif and Sovev. About Atzmus Ain Sof.  What the hell does that have to do with this?

No sane person thinks him to be anything more than human.  Chassidim beleive their leader can be moshiach, I know, that was apparently a shocker to many of you today and I sincerely thank SI for stepping forward from the other side of the chasidic fence to confirm that.

Your lies are getting really pathetic.
Instead of continuing this thread any further (for what purpose is beyond me, you'll convince noone of anything) maybe do something more constructive than try to tear down a holy person with silly lies. 
Stop wasting time worrying about what other people are thinking!
I agree, lock it.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #725 on: January 16, 2013, 06:54:05 PM »
Lies, lies, and more lies.

OMG LISTEN TO WHEN THEY CALL HIM UP AT 1:00
I was right!

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #726 on: January 16, 2013, 06:55:46 PM »
Lies Lies Lies? Yaamod Moreinu verabeinu Horave yosef Yitzchak. 

Offline whYME

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #727 on: January 16, 2013, 06:56:17 PM »
OMG LISTEN TO WHEN THEY CALL HIM UP AT 1:00
I was right!
??? If you need your hearing checked I know some good audiologists.

Offline chaimmayer

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #728 on: January 16, 2013, 06:56:32 PM »
btw whats "gimmel tamuz"?
Depends who you ask.  Some will say it's the day the Rebbe left the hospital :P

Offline Dan

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #729 on: January 16, 2013, 06:56:50 PM »
OMG LISTEN TO WHEN THEY CALL HIM UP AT 1:00
I was right!
Lies Lies Lies? Yaamod Moreinu verabeinu Horave yosef Yitzchak. 

Are you joking?
They said "יעמוד אדונינו מורנו ורבינו בן הרב לוי יצחק"

Remind me to stay far away from whatever it is that you're on.  Just goes to prove how people with an agenda will twist anything.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline chaimmayer

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #730 on: January 16, 2013, 06:57:59 PM »
there are many who wear/chant the yechi slogan

you are saying they are all meshichists?
Yes! like all of crown heights!

Offline Dan

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #731 on: January 16, 2013, 06:58:40 PM »
Depends who you ask.  Some will say it's the day the Rebbe left the hospital :P
Who?  Find me one person.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline chaimmayer

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #732 on: January 16, 2013, 06:59:01 PM »
Wow! This thread sure is active, I go out for an hour and  I miss 5 pages.

I just wanted to address 1 very valid point which was raised:Relying on your own judgement is indeed very dangerous, that is why the Rebbe (tried) to prevent that from happening. In the years between 5748 (when the Rebbetzin passed away) and 5752 (When he had his stroke) the Rebbe was very intensively preparing for a time when he would no longer be around physically (of course Chassidim refused to realize that and only woke up when it was too late).

One of the things that the Rebbe spoke about a lot in those years, was for the Chassidim to stop relying on him for their questions and instead appoint a 'Mashpia' who would be their mentor in all things Ruchnius. This system has been in place for generations before but in the years before Gimmel Tammuz the Rebe got really intensive about it. Calling it a Bakashah Nafshis for every Chossid to appoint a Mashpia with whom he can consult in matters of Avodas Hashem.

Chassidim nowadays do not rely on their own judgement and understanding of texts, each Chossid has (in addition to his Rov, Rosh Yeshivah etc.) a Mashpia. As you mentioned the texts are very inconclusive to someone trying to make it out on his own but we don't get our Hashkafah directly from the texts alone.
Or just put your request in the iggros to get your answer

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #733 on: January 16, 2013, 06:59:09 PM »
definitely did not say Ben, mumbled the "Levi" part and called him harav yitzchok

Offline moish

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Re: Messianism among Lubavitch
« Reply #734 on: January 16, 2013, 07:02:47 PM »
im not well versed with who mashiach is supposed to be,

but can anyone tell me how ani rochev al chamor falls into the scheme of things?
bump

there are many who wear/chant the yechi slogan

you are saying they are all meshichists?
and bump