Author Topic: Interesting Articles...  (Read 957154 times)

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9840 on: February 13, 2019, 03:19:48 PM »
While I agree about free speech being one sided, I don't think that applies here. I assume the hotel is a private business, not government owned. Free speech wouldn't apply.

People who say this are a pet peeves of mine...

The question isn't whether what the hotel (or any other private person) did is illegal. The argument is that it goes against the idea of free speech which is a modern value.

Offline ExGingi

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I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Offline skyguy918

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9842 on: February 14, 2019, 10:08:43 AM »
https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2019-sunrun-solar-panels/?srnd=premium
Pretty clear the guy was sold a terrible deal to being with - everything else is a result of that. They should regulate how this stuff can be marketed, like insurance. You can't illustrate whatever returns you want on WL for example, there are rules governing the illustration process. Same should be done here - the solar companies shouldn't have been able to market their arrangement showing the relative costs with a 4.75% annual utility cost increase if that's unrealistic.

When I bought my solar panels/system, I had to poke and prod for all the details and assumptions, leaving me to recalculate with more conservative assumptions of the future savings before confirming that it was worthwhile.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 10:15:56 AM by skyguy918 »

Offline good sam

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9843 on: February 14, 2019, 10:32:29 AM »
People who say this are a pet peeves of mine...

The question isn't whether what the hotel (or any other private person) did is illegal. The argument is that it goes against the idea of free speech which is a modern value.
You're conflating the value of freedom associated with free speech and requiring private businesses to provide a platform for it, which is tyrrany. It isn't a "modern value" to require private businesses to contract with advertisers whom they deem harmful to their profit margins.
If you don't care why would you comment?
HT: DMYD

Offline ExGingi

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9844 on: February 14, 2019, 11:30:35 AM »
You're conflating the value of freedom associated with free speech and requiring private businesses to provide a platform for it, which is tyrrany. It isn't a "modern value" to require private businesses to contract with advertisers whom they deem harmful to their profit margins.

We know all too well where such tyranny manifests itself. All the way up to the supreme court in the case of "wedding" cakes.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline good sam

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9845 on: February 14, 2019, 11:41:17 AM »
We know all too well where such tyranny manifests itself. All the way up to the supreme court in the case of "wedding" cakes.
Tyrrany in the name of freedom is the worst kind.
If you don't care why would you comment?
HT: DMYD

Offline aygart

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9846 on: February 14, 2019, 11:48:04 AM »
https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2019-sunrun-solar-panels/?srnd=premium
Pretty clear the guy was sold a terrible deal to being with - everything else is a result of that. They should regulate how this stuff can be marketed, like insurance. You can't illustrate whatever returns you want on WL for example, there are rules governing the illustration process. Same should be done here - the solar companies shouldn't have been able to market their arrangement showing the relative costs with a 4.75% annual utility cost increase if that's unrealistic.

When I bought my solar panels/system, I had to poke and prod for all the details and assumptions, leaving me to recalculate with more conservative assumptions of the future savings before confirming that it was worthwhile.
That only helps if the solar salesperson understands the energy bill themselves. Very few do or even realize that they are missing aspects of it. There is one company which discusses aspects of how exactly it will affect the bill with me. Needless to say, that is the only place I would send anyone to do solar. They only do commercial.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9847 on: February 14, 2019, 11:52:22 AM »
That only helps if the solar salesperson understands the energy bill themselves. Very few do or even realize that they are missing aspects of it. There is one company which discusses aspects of how exactly it will affect the bill with me. Needless to say, that is the only place I would send anyone to do solar. They only do commercial.
What do you mean how it will affect your bill?

Offline aygart

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9848 on: February 14, 2019, 12:03:58 PM »
What do you mean how it will affect your bill?
THis is more specific to a commercial bill, but there are some components which are helped by solar and some which are not. Many (most?) solar places just divide the total bill by an amount of kWh and use that to calculate that if the system will generate an amount of kWh then it will save you that amount. This is simply untrue. Some components will remain the same as they were before solar was installed.

This can bring the price per kWh after solar higher than it had been prior. A client of mine bought a building which had a solar contract where they were required to pay the owner of the solar system by calculating the amount of his bill and dividing it by kWh then paying that amount for the solar generation while receiving rent for the roof space. This ended up making him pay for some components multiple times over when the generation was high.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9849 on: February 14, 2019, 12:33:55 PM »
THis is more specific to a commercial bill, but there are some components which are helped by solar and some which are not. Many (most?) solar places just divide the total bill by an amount of kWh and use that to calculate that if the system will generate an amount of kWh then it will save you that amount. This is simply untrue. Some components will remain the same as they were before solar was installed.

This can bring the price per kWh after solar higher than it had been prior. A client of mine bought a building which had a solar contract where they were required to pay the owner of the solar system by calculating the amount of his bill and dividing it by kWh then paying that amount for the solar generation while receiving rent for the roof space. This ended up making him pay for some components multiple times over when the generation was high.
Don't think that's unique to commercial. When I did my analysis, I looked at the only 2 costs on my electric bill that are per/kWh. That should be the true savings per/kWh generated by the system. IIRC it wasn't that far off from what the solar company was quoting, it was more the projected increases to that cost that I had to reassess.

Offline aygart

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9850 on: February 14, 2019, 12:37:40 PM »
Don't think that's unique to commercial. When I did my analysis, I looked at the only 2 costs on my electric bill that are per/kWh. That should be the true savings per/kWh generated by the system. IIRC it wasn't that far off from what the solar company was quoting, it was more the projected increases to that cost that I had to reassess.

For commercial the non-kWh charges can be most of the bill as opposed to residential where there is is typically only the flat customer charge which is non-kWh and therefore you are probably correct that for a house it was not far off from the number they were using.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline zh cohen

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9851 on: February 14, 2019, 02:40:41 PM »
When I did my analysis, I looked at the only 2 costs on my electric bill that are per/kWh. That should be the true savings per/kWh generated by the system. IIRC it wasn't that far off from what the solar company was quoting, it was more the projected increases to that cost that I had to reassess.

Aren't delivery charges calculated by kWh? Does that get less when you have solar panels?

Offline aygart

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9852 on: February 14, 2019, 02:45:51 PM »
Aren't delivery charges calculated by kWh? Does that get less when you have solar panels?
Typically residential accounts are kWh based and commercial are demand based.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline Dan

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9853 on: February 15, 2019, 01:57:59 PM »
I've lost track, is CHI or COL the fake news site? Maybe Shmais should join the public spat too?

http://crownheights.info/communal-matters/633270/r-hecht-micdrop-10-times-worse-the-call-of-the-shofar/
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline ExGingi

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Re: Interesting Articles...
« Reply #9854 on: February 15, 2019, 02:20:20 PM »
I've lost track, is CHI or COL the fake news site? Maybe Shmais should join the public spat too?

http://crownheights.info/communal-matters/633270/r-hecht-micdrop-10-times-worse-the-call-of-the-shofar/
They both have their issues, though I think CHI has a narrower set of issues where they are biased. At least they don't call or hint that they are Chabad, and have the following at the bottom of their front page:

Quote
Disclaimer: This website site is not an official Chabad-Lubavitch website.
Please visit Chabad.org or Lubavitch.com for information on the Chabad-Lubavitch movement.

Whereas collive is and extension of col.org.il which is a total fraud, both calling themselves Chabad, and daring to have an org.il as their TLD when it's a private business.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan