Author Topic: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult  (Read 36321 times)

Offline sky121

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #30 on: March 03, 2012, 10:28:05 PM »
On a side note there is an old joke that goes something like this:

A man is walking down the street when he passes his neighbor Mrs. So and So taking a walk.  He keeps walking and runs into Mr. So and So. He says "Hey I just saw your wife walking a few minutes ago."  Mr. So and So replies "Yeah, we're taking a walk together."

They tell this joke about Ger chassidim and it's based on many Gerrers who walk exactly like this with their wives down the street.  A fellow from Eretz Yisroel who is a Gerrer recently told me his Rebbe told him that he shouldn't do this anymore because of a lot of problems there have been in the community lately with woman not feeling treated with respect and love and seeking it from outside places.

I do believe that a lot of the ways women are treated in Judaism can make it easy for them to feel belittled and can make it easy for men to get the idea that they are in some way "greater" than their wives (which is obviously not the case. )

"Not all who wander are lost"

Offline sky121

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #31 on: March 03, 2012, 10:31:00 PM »
I am not hasidic. But I know many of them. And you have no right saying they don't treat women well. Why don't we go on a tour of Williamburg or Monroe And ask the women if they are happy in their marriages. You will find the happiest women who don't feel the need to flaunt their bodies to the rest of the world and are happy in their community.

I didn't say they don't treat women well. I said " a lot of the ways women are treated".

           For example: Women having to sit in the back of the bus. Or the practice of a lot of Chassidish men travling to be with their Rebbes for differing Yomim Tovim.
Or just the fact that there can't be any women pictures in the Hamodia.

None of these things are bad per se but could lead women to feeling less than great.
Of course there are happy women in happy marriages out there.
"Not all who wander are lost"

Offline Cashman

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #32 on: March 03, 2012, 10:39:29 PM »
I didn't say they don't treat women well. I said " a lot of the ways women are treated".

           For example: Women having to sit in the back of the bus. Or the practice of a lot of Chassidish men travling to be with their Rebbes for differing Yomim Tovim.
Or just the fact that there can't be any women pictures in the Hamodia.

None of these things are bad per se but could lead women to feeling less than great.
On the contrary. I will go point by point.

              Women in back of bus: Most women enjoy it. They can talk freely with other women without having men in between them

              Practice of going to Rebbe: It has been happening for hundreds of years and hasidic women expect it from their husbands to go.

               And women being in newspapers: That was a decision made by great torah leaders Such as R Shach the Steipler the Chazon Ish And the Bais Yisroel and i am not someone to argue with such leaders
             

Offline HelpMe

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #33 on: March 03, 2012, 10:42:47 PM »
Women in back of bus: Most women enjoy it. They can talk freely with other women without having men in between them
WOW!
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Offline sky121

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #34 on: March 03, 2012, 10:44:10 PM »
On the contrary. I will go point by point.

              Women in back of bus: Most women enjoy it. They can talk freely with other women without having men in between them

              Practice of going to Rebbe: It has been happening for hundreds of years and hasidic women expect it from their husbands to go.

               And women being in newspapers: That was a decision made by great torah leaders Such as R Shach the Steipler the Chazon Ish And the Bais Yisroel and i am not someone to argue with such leaders
             

Again, no one is arguing with any of these practices. Or saying they are bad or wrong.
 I am saying these are examples of things that one could see how a woman might end up feeling 'degraded' in Jewish culture.

"Not all who wander are lost"

Offline sky121

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #35 on: March 03, 2012, 10:48:33 PM »
WOW!


When my wife and I are in Israel she has no problem sitting in the back of the bus when she's traveling herself on the Mehadrin buses (separate seating.) When we're together we like to SIT together.

         She DOES have problems when Men ask her to sit in the last row of the bus while she's pregnant because they don't want to sit near another guy and want an empty seat.  Yes, that has happened to her.  But that is a different story.
The point is she really doesn't mind it much. It would be easier if women were in the front since they are the ones usually holding babies and kids and have to trek towards the back of the bus through the row of men trying not to bump into them while the bus is flying down the road.

"Not all who wander are lost"

Offline Cashman

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #36 on: March 03, 2012, 10:50:04 PM »
WOW!
Yes sir they think different then you. They don't enjoy mingling with men.

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #37 on: March 03, 2012, 10:57:09 PM »
Yes sir they think different then you. They don't enjoy mingling with men.
Here is a solution. How about we let them sit in the front.
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Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #38 on: March 03, 2012, 11:02:25 PM »
Yes sir they think different then you. They don't enjoy mingling with men.

And if they have the opportunity, you think they would run from it? Some would. But I think some wouldn't.
The fact that are so sheltered IMO makes it so much worse when they "escape" if everyone would be a little more open minded from The beginning I dont think just bec you went off the derech you would get a shot of being on the view or dr. Phil.
There are plenty of other people with a really messed up family situation that can use Dr. Phil's help a lot more.

The one part that really got me. Was when she said she has plenty of Rabbis on her side. But they are afraid to say anything bec they would be accused of having an affair.
That sounds like total BS. If I truly knew the whole story and I was on her side then I would have no busha saying so.
But then again remember this is just one side of the story. And only 40 minutes worth at that.

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #39 on: March 03, 2012, 11:02:38 PM »
Here is a solution. How about we let them sit in the front.
You know that's a problem by them because men are not supposed to look at women for a extensive period of time. Your problem is that you think they sit in the back because they treaty women like 2nd class citizens which is a total farce.

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #40 on: March 03, 2012, 11:04:53 PM »
And if they have the opportunity, you think they would run from it? Some would. But I think some wouldn't.
The fact that are so sheltered IMO makes it so much worse when they "escape" if everyone would be a little more open minded from The beginning I dont think just bec you went off the derech you would get a shot of being on the view of dr. Phil.
There are plenty of other people with a really messed up family situation that can use Dr. Phil's help a lot more.

The one part that really got me. Was when she said she has plenty of Rabbis on her side. But they are afraid to say anything bec they would be accused of having an affair.
That sounds like total BS. If I truly knew the whole story and I was on her side then I would have no busha saying so.
But then again remember this is just one side of the story. And only 40 minutes worth at that.
I agree with you about them being a little more open minded and that goes for both men and women. But I do not think that hasidim treat women like second class citizens

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Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #41 on: March 03, 2012, 11:05:05 PM »
You know that's a problem by them because men are not supposed to look at women for a extensive period of time. Your problem is that you think they sit in the back because they treaty women like 2nd class citizens which is a total farce.

Can you not control yourself?
Really. REALLY? Looking at the top of the back of their wigs are really a big prob according to you!

Offline HelpMe

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #42 on: March 03, 2012, 11:06:49 PM »
You know that's a problem by them because men are not supposed to look at women for a extensive period of time. Your problem is that you think they sit in the back because they treaty women like 2nd class citizens which is a total farce.
You are right. Maybe you can explain this to the blacks.  ::)
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Offline sky121

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Re: Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #43 on: March 03, 2012, 11:07:17 PM »
. Was when she said she has plenty of Rabbis on her side. But they are afraid to say anything bec they would be accused of having an affair.
That sounds like total BS. If I truly knew the whole story and I was on her side then I would have no busha saying so.


I agree with you that it sounded like she was lying but everything aside there are many times where Rabbis agree with people but don't speak out. We live in a world of politics. So while she may be lying that thought is not so far fetched.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2012, 11:10:24 PM by sky121 »
"Not all who wander are lost"

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Model Mom Calls Her Religion a Cult
« Reply #44 on: March 03, 2012, 11:08:55 PM »
I agree with you about them being a little more open minded and that goes for both men and women. But I do not think that hasidim treat women like second class citizens

I never said anything about second class citizens.
But in today's sick and crazy world it most deff is time to open ones mind.
Bec if you open it yourself you are going to end up going way to far IMO.

When I was in Israel I really enjoyed sitting in the back of the bus though. I got to relax no one bothered me.

The ones making the big deal I think would make a big deal about anything. But once they say something I feel like the ones in the front of the bus should be the "big kids" and not make a fuss and give up their seat.