NBA Finals 2012

[YudiG]

Which teams will be there?

[mercaz1]

miami will be there if bosh is healthy for when they play boston
thuder vs the lakers and then thunder vs the spurs will be great

[jj1000]

I hope it is Heat and Spurs so I can watch Lebum get swept by them again.

[YankyDoodle]

I hope it is Heat and Spurs so I can watch Lebum get swept by them again.

you probably weren't too happy the first time though!

I think it's the thunders year. (although the spurs are killing it right now.) Either one will beat the Celtics pretty handily.

[skyguy918]

As of now it looks like we're headed for Spurs-Thunder and Heat-Celtics for the conference finals (obviously the East is far from set yet). What I love about that we'll automatically have a nice contrast in the finals. The Spurs and Thunder are perfect examples of teams that drafted and developed their teams instead of trying to buy them. OKC's top 4 players were all drafted by the Thunder. The Spurs are even more home-grown, with an astonishingly low 5 players on their 15 man roster that have ever played for another NBA team (Danny Green, Stephen Jackson, Matt Bonner, Boris Diaw, and Patty Mills).

Contrast those home grown 'Big 3's with the East. Miami is the model du jour of acquiring established talent, starting with Lebron and Bosh. But before them came the Celtics who brought in Garnett and Allen via trade to go with Pierce and eventually Rondo.

[Shmelly]

So sick of people talking about the brilliant master job OKC has done. Their entire team was built with top 5 picks and a ton of luck - KD fell in their lap at 2 cuz Oden was taken 1st, Westbrook fell in their lap at 4 cuz Mayo went 3rd, and Harden fell in their lap at 3 cuz Thabeet went 2nd. They got Perkins by trading Jeff Green, who they took 5th. Yeah they took Ibaka with a late 1st - even Isiah Thomas got lucky with a late 1st once in a while.

To compare them to the job that the Spurs have done without the benefit of a lottery pick in 15 years is criminal.

[skyguy918]

So sick of people talking about the brilliant master job OKC has done. Their entire team was built with top 5 picks and a ton of luck - KD fell in their lap at 2 cuz Oden was taken 1st, Westbrook fell in their lap at 4 cuz Mayo went 3rd, and Harden fell in their lap at 3 cuz Thabeet went 2nd. They got Perkins by trading Jeff Green, who they took 5th. Yeah they took Ibaka with a late 1st - even Isiah Thomas got lucky with a late 1st once in a while.

To compare them to the job that the Spurs have done without the benefit of a lottery pick in 15 years is criminal.

Okay, first of all, it seems like you're responding to my comment, despite the fact that your point is unrelated to mine. I'm pointing out the contrast between the Spurs/Thunder and the Heat/Celtics. In the aspect that those 2 groups differ, the Thunder belong with the Spurs. The fact that in many other ways the path to their current rosters differs doesn't take away from the point.

Second of all, I agree that what the Spurs front office has done is light years ahead of what OKC has done. It's much harder to stay great than it is to become great in the NBA. Having said that, the list of teams that have had the same (or better) opportunities as the Thunder and botched them is quite long. It's still not easy to put together a great team, even if you have a solid stretch of high lottery picks. Your list of all the 'luck' that they've had in the draft is a joke. If the players drafted ahead of the Thunder's picks were questionable picks, reaches that didn't pan out, then you have a leg to stand on. But Oden was not a questionable pick, everyone thought he'd be a franchise center. Beasly and Mayo were expected to go that high, in fact most people at the time thought 4 was too high for Westbrook. Thabeet was supposed to be another franchise center, and again Harden at 3 was considered a gamble. The fact that other players were busts and the Thunder's were not does not make their success any less impressive.

[damaxer91]

Okay, first of all, it seems like you're responding to my comment, despite the fact that your point is unrelated to mine. I'm pointing out the contrast between the Spurs/Thunder and the Heat/Celtics. In the aspect that those 2 groups differ, the Thunder belong with the Spurs. The fact that in many other ways the path to their current rosters differs doesn't take away from the point.

Second of all, I agree that what the Spurs front office has done is light years ahead of what OKC has done. It's much harder to stay great than it is to become great in the NBA. Having said that, the list of teams that have had the same (or better) opportunities as the Thunder and botched them is quite long. It's still not easy to put together a great team, even if you have a solid stretch of high lottery picks. Your list of all the 'luck' that they've had in the draft is a joke. If the players drafted ahead of the Thunder's picks were questionable picks, reaches that didn't pan out, then you have a leg to stand on. But Oden was not a questionable pick, everyone thought he'd be a franchise center. Beasly and Mayo were expected to go that high, in fact most people at the time thought 4 was too high for Westbrook. Thabeet was supposed to be another franchise center, and again Harden at 3 was considered a gamble. The fact that other players were busts and the Thunder's were not does not make their success any less impressive.

+1 Good Analysis

Though Thabeet was considered a risk at the time because of his unpolished college game

[Shmelly]

They had the #2 pick in a year where where KD was the concensus 2nd best player. Had they had #2 a year later they get Thabeet. They had the #4 pick when Love or Westbrook was considered the 4th best player - they couldn't have screwed that up. They had the #3 pick when Harden was the concensus 2nd or 3rd best player (not sure why you said he was a gamble, it was universally agreed that he was a top 3 player in that draft and immediately NBA ready). Did the Raptors screw up by taking Bargnani? Or the Bucks by taking Bogut? Some drafts are better than others, and the Thunder were in the right place at the right time in every draft. That's not great front office work, that's luck.

[Shmelly]

I personally thought Thabeet would never amount to anything, having watched him numerous times in college. Guess I'm smarter than Chris Wallace. Oh wait, I would know that anyway.

[mercaz1]

who will win- spurs or thunder

[skyguy918]

Some drafts are better than others, and the Thunder were in the right place at the right time in every draft. That's not great front office work, that's luck.

Totally disagree. If you consistently pick what turns out to be the best player available at your pick that's a major component of great front office work. If you can do that with lottery picks you'll have a contender. Obviously it's infinitely more impressive to build a contender with late picks, and that's why I said they still don't compare to SA. Even SA needed luck to get where they are. They were a playoff team until Robinson went down for the 1996 season, which they finished with the 3rd worst record. Yet they got the #1. This doesn't take anything away from their accomplishments, especially with their astonishing successes with later picks in the years that followed.

They got Perkins by trading Jeff Green, who they took 5th.

Actually Boston drafted Green, traded him away in the Ray Allen deal, and got him back for Perkins.


Anyway, going OT for a sec, I was just looking at the wiki page for the lottery and I found some crazy things I never knew. Apparently, in 1993 (Shaq) Orlando had the worst chance of winning the lottery (1 in 66). After they won the NBA changed the weighting to give the best non-playoff team an even lower chance at the #1. Another crazy thing I found is that when they expanded with Toronto and Vancouver, the agreement was that neither could have the #1 in their first 3 drafts. That came back to haunt the Raptors in 1996 and the Grizzlies in 1998 when each won the lottery but were given the 2nd pick instead.

[Shmelly]

Actually Boston drafted Green, traded him away in the Ray Allen deal, and got him back for Perkins.

Correct, Boston drafted Green, but it was after they had traded his draft rights to Seattle.

Another crazy thing I found is that when they expanded with Toronto and Vancouver, the agreement was that neither could have the #1 in their first 3 drafts. That came back to haunt the Raptors in 1996 and the Grizzlies in 1998 when each won the lottery but were given the 2nd pick instead.

That's messed up.

[moish]

lakers next year.

As for this year.....

GO KINGS!!!

[Shmelly]

lakers next year.

As for this year.....

GO KINGS!!!

Weird, I coulda sworn they didn't make the playoffs. Although Cousins is a beast so I guess they coulda snuck in when I wasn't paying attention.

[moish]

Weird, I coulda sworn they didn't make the playoffs. Although Cousins is a beast so I guess they coulda snuck in when I wasn't paying attention.

clearly, you didnt understand

[skyguy918]

clearly, you didnt understand

Either that or he was just assuming that since this thread is called NBA finals and not NHL finals, you must have been referring to the Sacramento Kings and not the LA Kings.

[YankyDoodle]

Either that or he was just assuming that since this thread is called NBA finals and not NHL finals, you must have been referring to the Sacramento Kings and not the LA Kings.

True but the fact that he referenced the Lakers would make it a fair assumption that he is not a Sacramento fan... And the Kings are writing a great story!

[skyguy918]

True but the fact that he referenced the Lakers would make it a fair assumption that he is not a Sacramento fan... And the Kings are writing a great story!

So start a new thread, call it NHL finals, or get creative with it.

[Shmelly]

Either that or he was just assuming that since this thread is called NBA finals and not NHL finals, you must have been referring to the Sacramento Kings and not the LA Kings.

Exactly my point, thank you. There's no sarcasm font.