Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread

[yelped]

So it seems

Nothing changed from this picture.

[imayid2]

Nothing changed from this picture.

You made it sound like it’s a daas yachid and only he held that way

[yelped]

You made it sound like it’s a daas yachid and only he held that way

Still pretty similar...

But could be that is my Chassidish bias affecting me.

[yitzgar]

I'd say you'd be surprised how common this is outside the US in regards to CY and in the US in regards to yoshon, but I don't think @Yehuda57 will be surprised

Color me surprised. Do you know about any hechsherim that don't do this with regards to yoshon?

[moko]

Color me surprised. Do you know about any hechsherim that don't do this with regards to yoshon?

you mean not makpid on keilim or not makpid on dirty keilim?
Many aren't makpid on the latter

[yitzgar]

you mean not makpid on keilim or not makpid on dirty keilim?
Many aren't makpid on the latter

Dirty keilim. I meant can you list hechsherim that you know are makpid.

[Yehuda57]

Is that what the hechsher actually says though? Call up Rabbi Yoffe - he's quite accessible. The owner does not equal the hechsher.

I didn't say that. *You* made a defense like that upthread. Once again, this is not about whether or not *I* would eat there. I have been to Lakewood once in my life.

Someone raised a question about the CY status of an establishment, saying (IIRC) there are many CS menu items, and as such even the CY items/equipment are being prepared/washed with the CS items, and if one is particular about that, one should ask a rav before eating there. The owner's angry, defensive, misleading response notwithstanding, one shouldn't need to call the rav hamachshir to know what's up. The hechsher on the wall of the establishment should be abundantly clear: is it CY entirely, is it DE, is it CY only on some items, etc.

I don't know what it says on the hechser. What I do know is that these concerns were met by arguments about what level of issur/minhag CY or CY keilim is, and what percentage of the Lakewood community holds what. All that is irrelevant. What should matter is what the hechsher says. And *if*, and that is a massive if, as it seems from this thread, the hechsher says it is entirely CY without making mention of DE or other kulos, and the store clearly serves items that are either DE or CS outright without such a warning from the hechsher, IMHO that calls into question their reliability for all aspects of the establishment's hechsher.

I am no halachic expert by any means. I say this from second-hand knowledge of messes happening from exactly this kind of setup, where frum people are catering to chumras or minhagim that they themselves don't adhere to, and end up playing games, which in turn leads to playing bigger games with the "standard" rules of the hashgacha.

I'd say you'd be surprised how common this is outside the US in regards to CY and in the US in regards to yoshon, but I don't think @Yehuda57 will be surprised

[TheAsh]

I don't know what it says on the hechser. What I do know is that these concerns were met by arguments about what level of issur/minhag CY or CY keilim is, and what percentage of the Lakewood community holds what. All that is irrelevant. What should matter is what the hechsher says. And *if*, and that is a massive if, as it seems from this thread, the hechsher says it is entirely CY without making mention of DE or other kulos, and the store clearly serves items that are either DE or CS outright without such a warning from the hechsher, IMHO that calls into question their reliability for all aspects of the establishment's hechsher.

The teudah clearly lists what is CY, CS, and DE.

[Yehuda57]

The teudah clearly lists what is CY, CS, and DE.

Based on having to make a list like that, people who are makpid on keilim (and how many that is is irrelevant) would not eat in such a store. This leads to the next problem that the store itself (based, again, on this thread) advertises as being entirely CY. If a hechsher allows a store to advertise a standard that their own teudah doesn't claim, that is a pretty big issue.

[avromie7]

Based on having to make a list like that, people who are makpid on keilim (and how many that is is irrelevant) would not eat in such a store. This leads to the next problem that the store itself (based, again, on this thread) advertises as being entirely CY. If a hechsher allows a store to advertise a standard that their own teudah doesn't claim, that is a pretty big issue.

Did they advertise as fully CY? Maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen such an ad.

[Yehuda57]

Did they advertise as fully CY? Maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen such an ad.

Advertise doesn't just mean a paid slot in a magazine, I mean if they tell people in any capacity. I'm not going to go through this thread to find the quotes, but upthread people were saying that is what they understood from the owners, plus that response letter was EXTREMELY misleading - at best.

[imayid2]

Did they advertise as fully CY? Maybe I missed it, but I haven't seen such an ad.

I’m pretty sure they had written in their ad “חלב ישראל” in the past. From what I’ve heard they recently changed it.

Someone’s reading DDF…

[imayid2]

The teudah clearly lists what is CY, CS, and DE.

Besides for the cones which aren’t labeled DE.

[TheAsh]

Based on having to make a list like that, people who are makpid on keilim (and how many that is is irrelevant) would not eat in such a store. This leads to the next problem that the store itself (based, again, on this thread) advertises as being entirely CY. If a hechsher allows a store to advertise a standard that their own teudah doesn't claim, that is a pretty big issue.

Agreed. That is problematic. (I personally think thar KCL should make a chalav stam option, which would take away the various other hechsherim used there, especially the shaky LKO or perhaps have KVH/KofK/Mehlman  take it over - I know KVH has mashgichim in the area for the stop and shop, and the other hechsherim all certify various things in the area.)

[yfr bachur]

Another proof that it's considered a chumra here is that almost nobody attempts to use chalav yisrael baby formula lechatchila. Everyone uses regular Enfamil without batting an eye.

or they that rely on R' Moshes heter for children when getting cholov yisroel is very difficult, but hold that ikar d'dina its asur.

[imayid2]

or they that rely on R' Moshes heter for children when getting cholov yisroel is very difficult, but hold that ikar d'dina its asur.

If it would be אסור מעיקר הדין they would not feed it to their children.

[mgarfin]

Como Pizza, in Lake Como, PA
https://www.comopizza.com/about-our-pennslyvana-location

I called and asked for the Hechsher/supervision and was told it's under the rabbi of Nesher.

Does anyone have more info?

[MOISHELE02]

I’m checking out a tour that I maybe want to go, they have the hashgach of rabbi moshe halaivi rubinstein, i never heard of him, and i tried to google his name but there’s nothing online, does anyone know who this is or he lives ? Is it cholov yisroel? Or where i can contact information?

[JMHO]

I’m checking out a tour that I maybe want to go, they have the hashgach of rabbi moshe halaivi rubinstein, i never heard of him, and i tried to google his name but there’s nothing online, does anyone know who this is or he lives ? Is it cholov yisroel? Or where i can contact information?

Ask the tour operator for contact info?

[TheAsh]

Como Pizza, in Lake Como, PA
https://www.comopizza.com/about-our-pennslyvana-location

I called and asked for the Hechsher/supervision and was told it's under the rabbi of Nesher.

Does anyone have more info?

I believe they mean the head rabbi of Camp Nesher, a Modern Orthodox camp in the area. They must believe it is reliable, as Lake Como caters for quite a few of the camps in the area (Nesher, Moshava etc). Not sure who that is though.