Topic Wiki

Links to kosher symbol lists. Each list is obviously only as reliable as its source

cRc: http://www.crcweb.org/agency_list.php

KosherQuest: https://kosherquest.org/kosher-symbols/

Approved alcoholic drinks from the Rabbanut.  http://www.jerusalemkoshernews.com/wp-content/uploads/%D7%9E%D7%A9%D7%A7%D7%90%D7%95%D7%AA-%D7%97%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%A4%D7%99%D7%9D-%D7%9E%D7%90%D7%95%D7%A9%D7%A8%D7%99%D7%9D.pdf

These are NOT Orthodox: https://sites.google.com/site/nonorthodoxkosher/home (even though some may look legit)


Informative post regarding Kashrus Agencies
Every hashgacha has +&-.


You can also submit any kashrus questions at
https://www.askcrc.org/ask
https://oukosher.org/ask-kosher-question/
https://www.star-k.org/ask-rabbi choose General Consumer Kashrus Questions in the Subject/Topic Dropdown list
https://www.ok.org/contact/ choose Kosher in the Attention Dropdown list



Author Topic: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread  (Read 940983 times)

Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2200 on: May 10, 2019, 02:59:09 PM »
The OU definitely has some very good things about their standards, procedures, and transparency, but they are far from perfect.


2. Local food establishment supervision. This is a totally different story. The OU does have the standards and procedures, but in these cases it is much more dependent on the local Mashgiach and the owner of the establishment. I don't know what their standards and procedures are, but I'm sure they are quite transparent and can be asked. In this area they are not necessarily better or worse than others, they just have their standards. It's not common to have a dual supervision on a food establishment, but it's likely that in places where those exist, the OU might be relying on the other supervision for mashgiach hiring and oversight.

My father runs an NY area establishment under the OU and a Chasidishe hechser (one of the "good" ones if I am not mistaken), and he is the one who told me that the Chassidesher hechsher visits 2x a year, whereas the OU runs the show on approving new ingredients, making sure that new mashgichim are approved, and the coordinator doing inspections several times a month.

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2201 on: May 10, 2019, 03:06:00 PM »
If OU does not have a harder time  than chassidishe hechsherim finding a shochet with Yiras Shamayim because basing authenticity on things like amount of times one goes to the mikvah isn't objective, why did you write that it would be an extremely long stretch to think that anyone that really cares about Glatt Kosher meat would rely on the OU for that

Your words seem rather contradictory.
How about because (for example) the OU certifies fish without simonim and without a mashgiach temidi, something that Rav Belski decried as wrong?

I once had a lengthy conversation with a certain Dayan regarding what kind of a Rov should be appointed for a kehilla. One of the themes that Dayan stressed over and over was, that in today's day and age, the Rov should be a meikel (לאחרים) but not a kal.

I can see many people seeing the fish issues as crossing the line ודיו לבא מן הדין להיות כנדון.

« Last Edit: May 10, 2019, 04:21:45 PM by ExGingi »
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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2202 on: May 10, 2019, 03:30:08 PM »
How about because (for example) the OU certifies fish without simonim and without a mashgiach temidi, something that Rav Belski decried as wrong?
Fish ≠ meat. I do not eat OU tuna fish for this reason, but they definitely have big people to rely on. I know R' Belsky didn't eat OU tuna, AFAIK that's pretty much the only product with an OU that he didn't eat.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline Shkop

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2203 on: May 10, 2019, 04:25:21 PM »
How about because (for example) the OU certifies fish without simonim and without a mashgiach temidi, something that Rav Belski decried as wrong?
I have no idea but that is not what your comment was about. You were discussing מעשה השחיטה and responded that chassidishe hechsherim look for things like mikveh, dress code, and shaving. You wrote also that it would be an extremely long stretch to think that anyone that really cares about Glatt Kosher meat would rely on the OU for that

To me, saying that it's pretty much impossible for someone who cares about Glatt Kosher to rely on OU for the reasons you supplied is wild. That said, I think you agree, but at the same time have a somewhat similar mentality, hence that statement.

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Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2204 on: May 10, 2019, 04:42:57 PM »
Gotta love that "glatt kosher" and "empire" being used together. Of course empire isn't glatt kosher, because no chicken is (or all kosher chicken is).

I also just learned daf yoni Chullin. I must have missed the sugya on the length of the shochets beard and whether if he only goes to the mikvah on Friday is his shechita ok bdieved.
« Last Edit: May 10, 2019, 04:47:01 PM by shaulyaakov »

Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2205 on: May 10, 2019, 05:23:14 PM »
I think what is meant about meat is that people who take chasidus seriously shouldn't eat ou meat. That's fine, but let's not automatically conflate chasidus with kasharus. I'm sure there are legitimate questions about the OU, as I am sure there are legitimate questions about crown heights kasharus.

Offline palm tights

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2206 on: May 10, 2019, 05:35:50 PM »
What about this hechsher?

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2207 on: May 10, 2019, 05:40:05 PM »
Is this a hechsher?

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2208 on: May 10, 2019, 05:47:28 PM »
How about because (for example) the OU certifies fish without simonim and without a mashgiach temidi, something that Rav Belski decried as wrong?

I once had a lengthy conversation with a certain Dayan regarding what kind of a Rov should be appointed for a kehilla. One of the themes that Dayan stressed over and over was, that in today's day and age, the Rov should be a meikel (לאחרים) but not a kal.

I can see many people seeing the fish issues as crossing the line ודיו לבא מן הדין להיות כנדון.



I don't think that the OU following a psak of R Soloveitzik is a great example or a shock
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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2209 on: May 10, 2019, 06:00:14 PM »
It's not about a harder time, it's about what they might consider in evaluating it (which is really not something objective, though some use objective standards as a screening test, such as mikvah, dress code, shaving, etc.). Just ask CBC.
My bar mitzva rebbe z"l was an ish tumim, a holy holy man, a chusid, and a mashgiach for Empire in the chicken plant. My former neighbor, who is presently a shoichet for Empire is the same. The rules they have in hiring shochtim are in accordance with every chasidishe shecita out there. They go as far as not allowing the wives of shochtim to drive etc. My other former neighbor, was also a shoichet, at Agri, 20 years ago...Let me not tell you the level of yiddishkeit...forget about his wife...     
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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2210 on: May 10, 2019, 06:10:43 PM »
My bar mitzva rebbe z"l was an ish tumim, a holy holy man, a chusid, and a mashgiach for Empire in the chicken plant. My former neighbor, who is presently a shoichet for Empire is the same. The rules they have in hiring shochtim are in accordance with every chasidishe shecita out there. They go as far as not allowing the wives of shochtim to drive etc. My other former neighbor, was also a shoichet, at Agri, 20 years ago...Let me not tell you the level of yiddishkeit...forget about his wife...   

Without responding to anything else you wrote, CMIIAW but don't both Agri and Empire have OU?
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2211 on: May 10, 2019, 06:59:52 PM »
My bar mitzva rebbe z"l was an ish tumim, a holy holy man, a chusid, and a mashgiach for Empire in the chicken plant. My former neighbor, who is presently a shoichet for Empire is the same. The rules they have in hiring shochtim are in accordance with every chasidishe shecita out there. They go as far as not allowing the wives of shochtim to drive etc. My other former neighbor, was also a shoichet, at Agri, 20 years ago...Let me not tell you the level of yiddishkeit...forget about his wife...   
Can't tell if you are joking about wives of shochtim at empire not being allowed to drive. If that's true, then people should protest.

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2212 on: May 11, 2019, 04:49:32 PM »
What about this hechsher?

CRC holds it good.

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2213 on: May 11, 2019, 10:10:57 PM »
Can't tell if you are joking about wives of shochtim at empire not being allowed to drive. If that's true, then people should protest.
Didn't sound like he was joking to me.
Only the shochtim you'll protest for? What about the rest of the chassidishe communities that hold the same?
Like it or not that's what they hold is right.
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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2214 on: May 11, 2019, 10:23:32 PM »
My bar mitzva rebbe z"l was an ish tumim, a holy holy man, a chusid, and a mashgiach for Empire in the chicken plant. My former neighbor, who is presently a shoichet for Empire is the same. The rules they have in hiring shochtim are in accordance with every chasidishe shecita out there. They go as far as not allowing the wives of shochtim to drive etc. My other former neighbor, was also a shoichet, at Agri, 20 years ago...Let me not tell you the level of yiddishkeit...forget about his wife...   
Keep in mind that there are some large chassidishe hechsherim which use the empire plant but choose from the shochtim
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Offline hvaces42

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2215 on: May 11, 2019, 10:34:05 PM »
Without responding to anything else you wrote, CMIIAW but don't both Agri and Empire have OU?
Agri under Rubashkin...not now.
Can't tell if you are joking about wives of shochtim at empire not being allowed to drive. If that's true, then people should protest.
Not a joke at all. You can protest all you want. Start in a little town in Orange County called Palm Tree...see how far you get.
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Offline hvaces42

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2216 on: May 11, 2019, 10:35:08 PM »
Keep in mind that there are some large chassidishe hechsherim which use the empire plant but choose from the shochtim
I'm talking about Empire employees.
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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2217 on: May 11, 2019, 10:46:39 PM »
My bar mitzva rebbe z"l was an ish tumim, a holy holy man, a chusid, and a mashgiach for Empire in the chicken plant. My former neighbor, who is presently a shoichet for Empire is the same. The rules they have in hiring shochtim are in accordance with every chasidishe shecita out there. They go as far as not allowing the wives of shochtim to drive etc.

Good for your rebbe and chasidish shchita but vetting shochtim based on whether or not their wives drive is pretty nuts. I'm curious about the "etc." there. What else do they require of the shochtim? That their wives shave their heads bald?
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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2218 on: May 11, 2019, 11:05:53 PM »
Can't tell if you are joking about wives of shochtim at empire not being allowed to drive. If that's true, then people should protest.
100 percent true.
Rav Belsky used to speak about this and how the whole chasidishe shechita is a joke and has nothing to do with kashrus. It might be true that you arent allowed to vote either but that Im not sure about.

THe only thing that chassidishe shecita did was take away the possibility of any non shtreimel wearing mikvah going jew to get a job as a shoichet.

Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: Kosher, Kashrus and Hechsherim Master thread
« Reply #2219 on: May 11, 2019, 11:13:17 PM »
Didn't sound like he was joking to me.
Only the shochtim you'll protest for? What about the rest of the chassidishe communities that hold the same?
Like it or not that's what they hold is right.
I don't like it, and it's objectively wrong and based zero in sources.