Author Topic: Stocks  (Read 292554 times)

Online ExGingi

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Nov 2015
  • Posts: 6030
  • Total likes: 989
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 7
    • View Profile
  • Location: 770
Re: Stocks
« Reply #3585 on: August 14, 2019, 02:13:44 PM »
anyone heard of this? Had a pretty convincing meeting about it but sounds too good to be true.
http://www.kaizenplan.com/what-is-kai-zen/

Yes. I'm familiar. Don't know why you put it in this thread.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Online hvaces42

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 4218
  • Total likes: 588
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 11
    • View Profile
Re: Stocks
« Reply #3586 on: August 14, 2019, 02:21:42 PM »
anyone heard of this? Had a pretty convincing meeting about it but sounds too good to be true.
http://www.kaizenplan.com/what-is-kai-zen/
Sounds legit "...maintain your current lifestyle in the event of..., premature death" Run for the hills. This smells like a scam. Sounds like a way to just sell you more life insurance so that they earn premiums.

Let me see if I got this a bank finances the premiums so you can buy more insurance...which leads to...you paying more over the long run.

From the website:
The Kai-Zen strategy is simple. Premiums are jointly funded by bank financing and the participant or employer. The bank financing provides the majority of the total contribution to the plan, and the life insurance policy itself is the full security for the loan.  Who pays the bank? This strategy is specifically designed so that the participant is not required to go through financial underwriting or sign any loan documents. So its your typical Term policy that employers offer that requires no underwriting and every employee is eligible for a minimum policy. This is just different because the policy amount is larger.  As an additional protection, Kai-Zenís structure is also set up to protect your benefits in the event of employer bankruptcy.

paging @ExGingi
Fair warning - Any PMs sent in response to forum posts are fair game for ridicule in public.

Online ExGingi

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Nov 2015
  • Posts: 6030
  • Total likes: 989
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 7
    • View Profile
  • Location: 770
Re: Stocks
« Reply #3587 on: August 14, 2019, 03:00:49 PM »
Sounds legit "...maintain your current lifestyle in the event of..., premature death" Run for the hills. This smells like a scam. Sounds like a way to just sell you more life insurance so that they earn premiums.

Let me see if I got this a bank finances the premiums so you can buy more insurance...which leads to...you paying more over the long run.

From the website:
The Kai-Zen strategy is simple. Premiums are jointly funded by bank financing and the participant or employer. The bank financing provides the majority of the total contribution to the plan, and the life insurance policy itself is the full security for the loan.  Who pays the bank? This strategy is specifically designed so that the participant is not required to go through financial underwriting or sign any loan documents. So its your typical Term policy that employers offer that requires no underwriting and every employee is eligible for a minimum policy. This is just different because the policy amount is larger.  As an additional protection, Kai-Zenís structure is also set up to protect your benefits in the event of employer bankruptcy.

paging @ExGingi

In a nutshell, this is an arbitrage play which could work in a low-interest rate environment.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline ushdadude

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Apr 2013
  • Posts: 4313
  • Total likes: 99
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 5
    • View Profile
  • Location: Long Island
Re: Stocks
« Reply #3588 on: August 14, 2019, 03:10:37 PM »
In a nutshell, this is an arbitrage play which could work in a low-interest rate environment.
he claims it works in high interest too because the earnings are higher
If you see something that is 50% off but don't need it, walk away and save yourself 100%

Offline ludmila

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Aug 2012
  • Posts: 5090
  • Total likes: 262
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: IND
  • Programs: Hilton Diamond,Marriott Platinum,SPG Platinum.
Re: Stocks
« Reply #3589 on: August 14, 2019, 05:00:06 PM »
Are there any Jewish classes for stock trading like they have for real estate and other things ?
You do not need classes, they are all a bluff, read Victor Sperandeo's 3 books, you will learn more than any trading classes done by marketers.
I was the Best,still the Best, and will always be the Best.
Pele Good,Maradona Better, George Best.

Offline mlml

  • DansDeals Copper Elite
  • *
  • Join Date: Dec 2015
  • Posts: 3
  • Total likes: 0
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
Re: Stocks
« Reply #3590 on: August 19, 2019, 11:46:16 AM »
anyone heard of this? Had a pretty convincing meeting about it but sounds too good to be true.
http://www.kaizenplan.com/what-is-kai-zen/

Yeh sure, I'm very familiar with it, I have one for the last 5 years, It has outperformed expectations, and it would work even if interest rates go up.
 (I'm in finance and many years ago I had a life Insurance license and was involved in insurance) If you have any questions about it you can ask me.   

Online ExGingi

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Nov 2015
  • Posts: 6030
  • Total likes: 989
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 7
    • View Profile
  • Location: 770
Re: Stocks
« Reply #3591 on: September 05, 2019, 03:43:27 AM »
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-09-04/michael-burry-explains-why-index-funds-are-like-subprime-cdos?srnd=premium

One more voice (out of just a few, as far as I am aware) calling out the risk of index investing.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline mimb

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite
  • ****
  • Join Date: Mar 2015
  • Posts: 348
  • Total likes: 6
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Programs: AA, United, Delta, AMEX, CHASE UR, SPG
Re: Stocks
« Reply #3592 on: September 05, 2019, 09:28:30 AM »
I think Howard Marks of Oaktree also had concerns on index funds. The question becomes what alternative can we invest in if we want market diversity?

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-09-04/michael-burry-explains-why-index-funds-are-like-subprime-cdos?srnd=premium

One more voice (out of just a few, as far as I am aware) calling out the risk of index investing.

Offline yos9694

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Silver Elite
  • *****
  • Join Date: Aug 2012
  • Posts: 681
  • Total likes: 14
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 6
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: Not Brooklyn
Re: Stocks
« Reply #3593 on: September 05, 2019, 01:43:20 PM »
Not disagreeing that there are risks with index investing, but the parallels to CDO/CMO are weak and exaggerating the risks. The index funds are by definition broadly diversified and NOT tranched. So while there are weakly traded companies in the mix in an index fund they are not the majority of holdings. With sector funds and other even narrower bundled instruments the comparison may get stronger.

My own worry is where index investing and robo investing intersect, because if a large number of portfolios are all following the same algorithms and they all try to rebalance at once it could have a spiraling effect. Luckily I don't think robo investing has caught on nearly as well as it was hyped to do.