The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live

[Dan]

Not personaly, but I'll walk you through why you might get that opinion:
followed by:
It's not that I'm a kanoi, or Israeli! (I'm not either  )
I've been trying very hard to write in a language that expresses the point I would like to make without calling out specific people, or groups.
It's just that when the point is made that when a non-local who may have done his best to do his research, calls something that locals do not consider mehadrin, "Mehadrin", is reminded of this by other (local) users on the forum, and insists on asking posters who post about shops with consensus level 1 hechsherim, if they ever tried his favorite carefully researched level 3 hechsher joint, and how it's the best there is...

This isn't deepest darkest Peru where we need to rely on all kinds of kulos to be able to eat (out).
There are many high-level kashrus, quality restaurants and takeouts all over the city...
It's true that it's important to know who/what to rely on bshas hadchak but why push the borderline acceptable as lechatchila??
(A friend of mine once went to a certain city in Gush Dan with his wife (he had some sort of meeting), relying on a particular restaurant which had a hechsher he ate. When he got there he found that the place was closed for a family simcha of the owner. He asked me to go into R' Kuber, and ask him in which of the other options he found he could eat, which hechsher, fish meat, milk etc... R' Kuber said that this is bshas hadchak and therefore he should order the grilled fish in a store with a particular hechsher, and if not... (I don't remember all the exact details)

You can say the same thing for any American hechsher. Plenty of restaurants better than OU, but who are you to draw the line for someone else?

I'm sure someone else will say that you shouldn't eat out, period. Or only Landau or Rubin. And I respect that, but don't put your standards on others who spoke to their own LOR.

[yfr bachur]

You can say the same thing for any American hechsher. Who are you to draw the line for someone else?

I'm sure someone else will say that you shouldn't eat out, period. Or only Landau. And I respect that, but don't put your standards on others who spoke to their own LOR.

I'm not drawing the line for you. Eat where you want, understanding your influence.
We got that you like craft and anthony's when you posted that the first time.
@ExGingi reminded you that "Mehadrin" is a loaded term.
The conversation continued and a number of posters posted places with consensus L1 hechsherim that they thought were good (or at least passable)
Why the need to come back and push your favorite "Mehadrin" place?

[bochur22]

You can say the same thing for any American hechsher. Plenty of restaurants better than OU, but who are you to draw the line for someone else?

I'm sure someone else will say that you shouldn't eat out, period. Or only Landau or Rubin. And I respect that, but don't put your standards on others who spoke to their own LOR.

LOR is fine, but for me I've seen enough local politics that in general I don't view Israeli Rabbonim as objective on Kashrus. (American- Israeli Rabbonim are definitely less prone to this I think)
The latest one I've heard was a freshie who was told Rubin isn't fine, but Belz is a top-tier Hechsher. Good for him, not for me.

[Dan]

I'm not drawing the line for you. Eat where you want, understanding your influence.
We got that you like craft and anthony's when you posted that the first time.
@ExGingi reminded you that "Mehadrin" is a loaded term.
The conversation continued and a number of posters posted places with consensus L1 hechsherim that they thought were good (or at least passable)
Why the need to come back and push your favorite "Mehadrin" place?

Same reason I recommend to eat at Le Marais for the best value steakhouse in the country, despite it only being OU.

The onus is on you to have a LOR, not on me for recommending a kosher restaurant!

It's fair game for you to post a PSA that it doesn't have a top notch hechsher, but not to preach about not eating there because there are other options with even better hechsherim.

[yfr bachur]

LOR is fine, but for me I've seen enough local politics that in general I don't view Israeli Rabbonim as objective on Kashrus. (American- Israeli Rabbonim are definitely less prone to this I think)
The latest one I've heard was a freshie who was told Rubin isn't fine, but Belz is a top-tier Hechsher. Good for him, not for me.

The freshie was lost.
"Politics" is an excuse not to care and eat what you want.
It take some effort, but you can usually figure out what's just "Politics" and what sticks
A litvishe not eating landau, a belzer not eating eida, a lunavitcher not eating shearis = politics (aside from shchita, maybe)
Landua, Rubin, Sheairis, Eida being consensus better while CCPT and BDTZ Rupshitz being the bottom of the barrel...not politics

[yfr bachur]

Same reason I recommend to eat at Le Marais for the best value steakhouse in the country, despite it only being OU.

The onus is on you to have a LOR, not on me for recommending a kosher restaurant!

It's fair game for you to post a PSA that it doesn't have a top notch hechsher, but not to preach about not eating there because there are other options with even better hechsherim.

It's literally less than 20 posts from the first time you recommend to the second time you push it on posters posting about L1 hechsher places.
i'll ask them for you:
Hey @Sam 77 @bochur22 You guys eat rabbanut mehadrin? Is eating in the center of town (ben yehuda, agripass) on your radar?
I don;t need to ask @ExGingi he's already given what he thinks.

[JMHO]

And the handle being on the wrong side of the toilet...

Handle? You mean buttonS!

[Dan]

It's literally less than 20 posts from the first time you recommend to the second time you push it on posters posting about L1 hechsher places.
i'll ask them for you:
Hey @Sam 77 @bochur22 You guys eat rabbanut mehadrin? Is eating in the center of town (ben yehuda, agripass) on your radar?
I don;t need to ask @ExGingi he's already given what he thinks.

Good for them? Not sure what your point is.

[jj1000]

It's literally less than 20 posts from the first time you recommend to the second time you push it on posters posting about L1 hechsher places.
i'll ask them for you:
Hey @Sam 77 @bochur22 You guys eat rabbanut mehadrin? Is eating in the center of town (ben yehuda, agripass) on your radar?
I don;t need to ask @ExGingi he's already given what he thinks.

Asking someone what Hashgachas they eat in Israel is worse than asking a woman her age and weight.

And this is why we haven't had an Israel TR on DDMS in, what's it been 10+ years? @Dan

[bochur22]

"Politics" is an excuse not to care and eat what you want.
It take some effort, but you can usually figure out what's just "Politics" and what sticks
A litvishe not eating landau, a belzer not eating eida, a lunavitcher not eating shearis = politics (aside from shchita, maybe)
Landua, Rubin, Sheairis, Eida being consensus better while CCPT and BDTZ Rupshitz being the bottom of the barrel...not politics

I eat the 4 "Consensus betters" because it's easy in JLM and most of the places nearest to me (Kiryas Sanz/ Belz) are Badatz anyways.
Outside of JLM I use Rabbi Weiner's list.

[bochur22]

The freshie was lost.

The freshie ate his first week here by his cousin, who is a Rosh Yeshiva in a (prominent) Israeli Yeshiva. But still, apparently involved in politics.

[ExGingi]

Uh. Probably one of the top deterrents. Along with Israeli CS.

Does that mean Non-CY or Non Customer-Service (in which case it is a misnomer)?

[JMHO]

Uh. Probably one of the top deterrents. Along with Israeli CS.

No, it is making a very strong case against living in Israel.

This, and the lack of elongated toilet seats.

And because in our eyes, we seemed like grasshoppers to them

[mevinyavin]

 

[Sam 77]

It's literally less than 20 posts from the first time you recommend to the second time you push it on posters posting about L1 hechsher places.
i'll ask them for you:
Hey @Sam 77 @bochur22 You guys eat rabbanut mehadrin? Is eating in the center of town (ben yehuda, agripass) on your radar?
I don;t need to ask @ExGingi he's already given what he thinks.

No and No

[yos9694]

And because in our eyes, we seemed like grasshoppers to them

The kashrus discussion comments are about living in EY in a state of golus, not any issues with EY itself c"v

[Dan]

The kashrus discussion comments are about living in EY in a state of golus, not any issues with EY itself c"v

Exactly. And nowhere is golus more evident than the kashrus, politics, and general machlokes of it all.

[moko]

Exactly. And nowhere is golus more evident than the kashrus, politics, and general machlokes of it all.

and therefore to heck with it all and eat whatever you want

[Dan]

and therefore to heck with it all and eat whatever you want

Uh. Nobody said that.
But everyone is very much, "anyone more machmir is a nut and everyone less machmir is frei as the wind."

[moko]

Uh. Nobody said that.
But everyone is very much, "anyone more machmir is a nut and everyone less machmir is frei as the wind."

I have factual knowledge in my town of many people completely disregarding serious Kashrus concerns nad being wilfully ignorant in the name of "it's all politics ".
I agree that unfortunately there is politics in Kashrus and probably know it way better than anyone else on the forums (I'm confident saying that without knowing everyone)
But it's definitely not all politics and many people intentionally remain willfully ignorant.