The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live

[Kabrams1618]

My children use their free time to build Eretz Yisrael instead of going to the mall.

[Dan]

chocolate emporium in cleveland is closing tommorow. They are all out of the soft serve cy ice cream.
Will miss having them, although I was not a big customer.

Kinneret has soft serve, not really going to miss CE. 
I do miss their old location when they actually had real ice cream to choose from.

[CS1]

Why not CA where the summers aren't torture?

+1
And where the schools are of high quality...

[ual902]

Why not CA where the summers aren't torture?

 Depending where in CA, Pico\ La Brea are so UN-affordable unless you have a  nice trust fund and besides the Jew areas in LA are becoming more and more ghetto like Brooklyn, maybe the Valley, Orange County or SAN might be an option.

[Dan]

+1
And where the schools are of high quality...

That's debatable. And they're quite pricy.

[efflpetzel]

Depending where in CA, Pico\ La Brea are so UN-affordable unless you have a  nice trust fund and besides the Jew areas in LA are becoming more and more ghetto like Brooklyn, maybe the Valley, Orange County or SAN might be an option.

+1

You have to be millionaire to live a comfortable Jewish life in LA, not to mention keeping up with the joneses

[Dan]

Is LA that much more expensive than Brooklyn? Not like Brooklyn is cheap living and both have high taxes.
At least LA gives you great year-round weather as opposed to miserable NYC summers and miserable NYC winters.

[MC]

Is LA that much more expensive than Brooklyn? Not like Brooklyn is cheap living and both have high taxes.
At least LA gives you great year-round weather as opposed to miserable NYC summers and miserable NYC winters.

Probably not, but there are no cheaper places a little outside La with Jewish communities the way there are outside Brooklyn (throughout NY). So it's in or out. And most young couples choose out as soon as they realize they'll never afford a home.

[Dan]

Probably not, but there are no cheaper places a little outside La with Jewish communities the way there are outside Brooklyn (throughout NY). So it's in or out. And most young couples choose out as soon as they realize they'll never afford a home.

Valley?

[MC]

Valley?

It's definitely gaining popularity

[zale]

LA has the best weather/jewish community combo but has more than its fair share of other major issues.

Can you name a few?

HIs issue is no community.  Let's build one!

What if the Japs decide to attack? 

[Dan]

Can you name a few?

I'll just repost this from my FB wall:


Daniel Eleff
December 25, 2013
Finally met a frum person in LA who was able to understand the various reasons to not to live in LA.
Everyone else here gives me this crazy look like I am completely out of my mind before slowly backing away from me.
16 28Like · · Promote · Share

 
    David S My guess is that he's an impostor and probably really WASN'T from L.A.
    December 25, 2013 at 7:36am · Like

    Mendel K Dan ur fighting a lost battle. Just get over it.
    December 25, 2013 at 10:01am · Like

    Blima T Where did you find this person? Definitely a transplant who hasn't been here long enough.... Took me 5 years to get over that. And I totally see why people don't live here, I just don't think is chose to live in snow and cold for those minor details......
    December 25, 2013 at 10:32am · Like · 1

    Reuven G affordable living is not a "minor detail"
    December 25, 2013 at 11:57am · Like

    Daniel Eleff Actually it was a local born and bred girl, had the whole LA debate walking back with a couple young couples after the Elon Gold show walking back to the hotel.
    December 25, 2013 at 12:43pm · Like

    Daniel Eleff Pros: Weather, restaurants. OK those can't be overstated, it's freaking awesome. Puts Miami to utter shame.
    Cons: Crazy.

    As in crazy house prices, crazy income tax, crazy grocery and cost of living prices, crazy people, crazy billboards that you don't want your kids to see, crazy street parking regulations, and really really crazy traffic.
    Oh, and if you want to call a store to ask a question or see if they carry something you need to learn another language. Seriously
    December 25, 2013 at 12:48pm · Like · 6

    Blima T It's all perspective..... I justify my house price by thinking I paid for the pool and climate/location, not the house itself, the income tax kills me, and yes TOTALLY sucks!! The billboards I count as a pro.... Saves me from having to explain things to my kids, so I can avoid those awkward conversations
    December 25, 2013 at 12:51pm · Like · 2

    Mordechai L Daniel Eleff not to mention no culture, little architecture, amazing ability to have so few craft breweries when it's located between giants like San Diego and San Francisco.
    December 25, 2013 at 12:52pm · Like

    Aaron E Con. The big one.
    December 25, 2013 at 12:55pm · Like

    Daniel Eleff  Blima you're hysterical. But in all seriousness am I wrong thinking CLE kids are a whole lot more innocent than LA/NY kids?
    Sure once we grow up it all equalizes, but it seems like there's just more of that sublime state of childhood innocence when I see and talk to CLE kids.
    December 25, 2013 at 12:55pm · Like

    Tova N Hahahaha, Blima!
    December 25, 2013 at 12:56pm · Like

    Daniel Eleff CLE actually has some fantastic craft breweries now. Great culture, museums, fanatical sports fans, etc. And Cedar Point
    And a house is $150K, a really nice house is $300K, and a 10 bedroom mansion with an elevator is $750K.
    Beachwood is so safe and clean with such a low cost of living...Really don't find that in other jewish communities.

    I guess my question is whether the weather really makes it worth putting up with all the cons. I guess for most people it is.
    December 25, 2013 at 12:59pm · Edited · Like · 2

    Tova N Kids, in general, are exposed to more garbage these days, no matter the location. Our generation grew up more wholesome because times were slightly less corrupted then.
    December 25, 2013 at 1:00pm · Like · 1

    Daniel Eleff Ban the internet
    December 25, 2013 at 1:01pm · Like · 1

    Blima T Plenty of innocent kids here in LA. The big con is financial, but that's not putting a price on the pros that are priceless! Agree that the big one is a con, and frankly even a little one isn't too pleasant, but that's another price to live somewhere where you get to see this while walking on a dec morning......
    Blima T's photo.
    December 25, 2013 at 1:01pm · Like · 2

    Blima T It's the kids with nothing else to do that get into real trouble. Here at least they get to play sports outdoors yr round. If your outdoorsy you can't beat it. Can bike mountains, trails, along the beach.....you get the point
    December 25, 2013 at 1:02pm · Like

    Daniel Eleff True, true.
    December 25, 2013 at 1:03pm · Like

    Ellie B Daniel Eleff, so what do you think about our shack
    December 25, 2013 at 1:04pm · Like

    Daniel E Talking to several of the young couples here who just live paycheck to paycheck to pay the $3,000 monthly rent check just boggles my mind.

    In CLE nobody could give a crap if you drive a fancy car, it's meaningless. In LA it feels like there's pressure to have one, even if you're broke.
    December 25, 2013 at 1:04pm · Like · 2

    Daniel Eleff It's funny, my blood pressure is lower thanks to the weather here but as soon as I get into a car and sit in standstill traffic it goes right back up again. And then to find parking without a permit sign, etc.

    I think it's nearly as big of a con as the financial aspect. So good to land in CLE and get on the 480/271 and know I'll drive those 30 miles in 25 minutes.
    December 25, 2013 at 1:06pm · Like · 1

    Daniel Eleff Listen I'm really torn, I do love LA. But I think just visiting once or twice a year to break up the winter gives me enough of a taste to enjoy it without dealing with the year-round cons.
    December 25, 2013 at 1:07pm · Like

Blima T But what do you eat every day? I guess you're lucky both your mom and wife are great cooks and hostesses. I don't think I could survive somewhere where my family was dependent on food I had to make from scratch.......
December 25, 2013 at 1:11pm · Edited · Like · 3

Daniel Eleff My wife is an insane baker and cooker. Like, the best.

But I've also been known to use 4,500 Avios and go to Chicago or NYC for a meal and fly back home

Chef Dave in CLE is also a nice new option to have.
December 25, 2013 at 1:12pm · Edited · Like · 4

Chaya G LOL guys!!! Hahaha billboards are a plus!
December 25, 2013 at 1:46pm · Like · 1

Sarah R What's chef Dave?
December 25, 2013 at 11:54pm · Like

Estie B Daniel Eleff.. you mean you can't find a deal on the LA permit parking?!
December 26, 2013 at 11:42am · Like

Dan S What's Chef Dave? I would love to move to Cleveland just for the cost of living but it's hard to get a job with a full beard unless your a doctor lawyer, you own your own business or you work at a school. Trust me I've looked.

[CS1]

I'll just repost this from my FB wall:
December 25, 2013 -    <  <  Are you serious? When you were in LA for DDSLA, I was thinking that it would be a great place for you and your family:
Blima T Where did you find this person? Definitely a transplant who hasn't been here long enough.... Took me 5 years to get over that. And I totally see why people don't live here, I just don't think is chose to live in snow and cold for those minor details...... <  <  It's not minor; it's a big deal for young children to have to be indoors for a long time...
    ....
    Daniel Eleff Actually it was a local born and bred girl, had the whole LA debate walking back with a couple young couples after the Elon Gold show walking back to the hotel.

    Daniel Eleff Pros: Weather, restaurants. OK those can't be overstated, it's freaking awesome. Puts Miami to utter shame.
    Cons: Crazy.
    Blima T It's all perspective..... I justify my house price by thinking I paid for the pool and climate/location, not the house itself, the income tax kills me, and yes TOTALLY sucks!! The billboards I count as a pro.... Saves me from having to explain things to my kids, so I can avoid those awkward conversations
    ^  ^ Exactly -- those prices are for the climate, parks, water, and great weather.

    Daniel Eleff  Blima you're hysterical. But in all seriousness am I wrong thinking CLE kids are a whole lot more innocent than LA/NY kids?
    Sure once we grow up it all equalizes, but it seems like there's just more of that sublime state of childhood innocence when I see and talk to CLE kids.
    ^  ^ Important. Good point.  ^  ^

    Daniel Eleff CLE actually has some fantastic craft breweries now. Great culture, museums, fanatical sports fans, etc. And Cedar Point
    And a house is $150K, a really nice house is $300K, and a 10 bedroom mansion with an elevator is $750K.
    Beachwood is so safe and clean with such a low cost of living...Really don't find that in other jewish communities.

    I guess my question is whether the weather really makes it worth putting up with all the cons. I guess for most people it is.
      ^  ^  Yes! A lot of pros to that.  ^  ^

    Tova N Kids, in general, are exposed to more garbage these days, no matter the location. Our generation grew up more wholesome because times were slightly less corrupted then.
       ^  ^ To me, that's the biggest con and why we did not move there. However, the schools have improved over the years. Helps to counteract a lot of that. And nowadays, there's a lot of 'globalization', so as parents that area is where we will need to spend much of our time and attention. To combat the negative influences, and reinforce, praise, accentuate, and promote our positive way of life and living. 

    Blima T Plenty of innocent kids here in LA. The big con is financial, but that's not putting a price on the pros that are priceless! Agree that the big one is a con, and frankly even a little one isn't too pleasant, but that's another price to live somewhere where you get to see this while walking on a dec morning......
    Blima T's photo.  << Would like to see that...  mine has snow...   >>    'white'

    Blima T It's the kids with nothing else to do that get into real trouble. Here at least they get to play sports outdoors yr round. If your outdoorsy you can't beat it. Can bike mountains, trails, along the beach.....you get the point
   
    Daniel Eleff True, true.
    Daniel E Talking to several of the young couples here who just live paycheck to paycheck to pay the $3,000 monthly rent check just boggles my mind.
  ^ ^ Yes, that would be challenge #2.  The number one would be good Chinuch..  From what I've heard that's top quality now

    In CLE nobody could give a crap if you drive a fancy car, it's meaningless. In LA it feels like there's pressure to have one, even if you're broke.
    ^ ^ I like cars, but that would not be a need, at all.  Last on the list.  ^ ^

    Daniel Eleff Listen I'm really torn, I do love LA. But I think just visiting once or twice a year to break up the winter gives me enough of a taste to enjoy it without dealing with the year-round cons.
   
Blima T But what do you eat every day? I guess you're lucky both your mom and wife are great cooks and hostesses. I don't think I could survive somewhere where my family was dependent on food I had to make from scratch.......

Daniel Eleff My wife is an insane baker and cooker. Like, the best.   <<      >> 

Estie B Daniel Eleff.. you mean you can't find a deal on the LA permit parking?!   <  <  He won't need that -- Self-employed

Dan S What's Chef Dave? I would love to move to Cleveland just for the cost of living but it's hard to get a job with a full beard unless your a doctor lawyer, you own your own business or you work at a school. Trust me I've looked.  < <  Even with a beard, Dan can work almost anywhere -- And, he can also be Self-Employed

^  ^ blue ^ ^ , my comments to his fb comments

[MC]

Comparing LA to CLE, the financial aspect is huge. Comparing it to Brooklyn or other major Jewish hubs, don't know if the margin of difference is nearly as wide.
However, the fact that other places don't have these billboards... now that's compelling. I remember coming back from Israel and being shocked. A year away from them made me realize just how bad they really are! I definitely vote to keep kids innocent.

[Yehoshua]

Comparing LA to CLE, the financial aspect is huge. Comparing it to Brooklyn or other major Jewish hubs, don't know if the margin of difference is nearly as wide.
However, the fact that other places don't have these billboards... now that's compelling. I remember coming back from Israel and being shocked. A year away from them made me realize just how bad they really are! I definitely vote to keep kids innocent.

Maybe it's just me, but although the billboards are obtrusive to begin with they are a lot less so as you get used to them just being part of the background.

[MC]

Maybe it's just me, but although the billboards are obtrusive to begin with they are a lot less so as you get used to them just being part of the background.

But do you get used to them as being part of the scenery or do you just get desensitized?

[Dan]

do you just get desensitized?

That. IMHO.
Anyone coming from CLE, where there are none, is rightfully shocked.
I do believe kids are lot less innocent in bigger cities than they are in smaller towns.

You say the cons are the price of "climate, parks, water, and great weather"
But CLE has plentiful awesome water and parks and I don't know the difference between climate and weather.

Sure the weather is great.  I'm just not sure it's worth the price.

[Yehoshua]

But do you get used to them as being part of the scenery or do you just get desensitized?

Probably desensitized, but I'd say the same thing for people living in South Florida with how people dress pretty much all year just walking around (LA is not all year, just more than other, more northern parts of the country.

[Dan]

True.
Even more so in SYD or GIG.

[mb1]

I'm moving to Miami.New Jersey is getting way too much snow for my liking.

Why not CA where the summers aren't torture?

LA is a much bigger move from NJ.
And summers in NJ are no picnic either.