Author Topic: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live  (Read 788900 times)

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2320 on: May 22, 2016, 01:01:19 PM »
In any OOT community it's not nearly as big an issue.

So is passion for restaurants and flying luxuriously not considered materialism? Isn't CLE a place where that emanates from?  ;)
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2321 on: May 22, 2016, 01:07:03 PM »
So is passion for restaurants and flying luxuriously not considered materialism? Isn't CLE a place where that emanates from?  ;)
That is one individual not a culture.
Feelings don't care about your facts

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2322 on: May 22, 2016, 01:09:15 PM »
That is one individual not a culture.
I guess you must be right, which explains why MS is so easy for him ;)
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Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2323 on: May 22, 2016, 01:09:25 PM »
So is passion for restaurants and flying luxuriously not considered materialism? Isn't CLE a place where that emanates from?  ;)
He flies luxuriously OUT of CLE for good food.
I'm fine with that.

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2324 on: May 22, 2016, 01:12:48 PM »
He flies luxuriously OUT of CLE for good food.
I'm fine with that.

But where was the breeding ground for that materialism? [Not sure what's the appropriate emoji to go along with that is]
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2325 on: May 22, 2016, 01:13:18 PM »
He flies luxuriously OUT of CLE for good food.
I'm fine with that.
With the current massive population influx, I'd say within 5 years there will be NYC style kosher groceries and restaurants, so you may have missed the boat already...
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2326 on: May 22, 2016, 01:21:04 PM »
With the current massive population influx, I'd say within 5 years there will be NYC style kosher groceries and restaurants, so you may have missed the boat already...
To quote Milton Friedman "Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon".

Applied to the current discussion I might phrase it "Materialism is always and everywhere a cultural educational problem".

The huge following of DDMS begins with materialism. It transcends geography and time (age groups).

Based on my personal culture and education, I think that my pressure is AGAINST a fancy car.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2327 on: May 22, 2016, 02:52:46 PM »
I have been in Brooklyn my whole life but I wouldn't mind moving.
But, when you have kids in school and they are happy it makes it much more difficult to think about relocating..

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2328 on: May 22, 2016, 03:00:55 PM »
I have been in Brooklyn my whole life but I wouldn't mind moving.
But, when you have kids in school and they are happy it makes it much more difficult to think about relocating..

+1000

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2329 on: May 22, 2016, 03:52:51 PM »
I have been in Brooklyn my whole life but I wouldn't mind moving.
But, when you have kids in school and they are happy it makes it much more difficult to think about relocating..

I would say that for many people here that is a primary concern.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2330 on: May 22, 2016, 07:43:27 PM »
To quote Milton Friedman "Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon".

Applied to the current discussion I might phrase it "Materialism is always and everywhere a cultural educational problem".

The huge following of DDMS begins with materialism. It transcends geography and time (age groups).

Based on my personal culture and education, I think that my pressure is AGAINST a fancy car.
I don't think you understand materialism as it is being discussed here.

Outside of the Chabad yeshiva world were materialism is looked at as anything to do with gashmiyus.

Most people look at it as keeping up with the Jones's attitude. When talking about OOT people generally live comfortably and are happy with what they have. As opposed to an attitude found in many major Jewish cities where people want to not just live comfortably but also want to have the newest car, gadget, clothes, etc.

No one is saying that people from the Midwest are beinonim from Tanya they are saying that they live a life not dependent on what everyone else is doing.

Your attitude needs some serious checking how you talk about other individual people.

Your starting to become the Chabad  version of CBC (no offense CBC).
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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2331 on: May 23, 2016, 12:43:40 AM »
First and foremost I would like to clarify that anything I write here is written with a light heart, with no intention to criticize anyone. I write based on my thoughts and observations, and try never to get personal or negative. If anyone took anything I wrote otherwise, I sincerely apologize.

I don't think you understand materialism as it is being discussed here.
I must have forgotten that English is not the primary language of these forums, but rather a language with many similarities, yet profoundly different  ;D

As per Google:
maˇteˇriˇalˇism
məˈtirēəˌlizəm/
noun
1. a tendency to consider material possessions and physical comfort as more important than spiritual values.

Outside of the Chabad yeshiva world were materialism is looked at as anything to do with gashmiyus.
I can't speak for "the Chabad yeshiva world", but I could bring a quote of what I consider the "Kitzur Shulchan Oruch" of being a Lubavitcher http://chabadlibrary.org/books/default.aspx?furl=/admur/hymym/8/30 and I wonder if anyone reading this for the first time would contend that this השקפה is unique to Chabad or Lubavitch.

Most people look at it as keeping up with the Jones's attitude. When talking about OOT people generally live comfortably and are happy with what they have. As opposed to an attitude found in many major Jewish cities where people want to not just live comfortably but also want to have the newest car, gadget, clothes, etc.

No one is saying that people from the Midwest are beinonim from Tanya they are saying that they live a life not dependent on what everyone else is doing.
I absolutely don't see any of this being a function of where one lives, which is what prompted me to bring the Milton Friedman quote above.

And in case you didn't realize, YOUR explanation of the מעלות of Midwesterners seems to confirm my understanding of materialism (which you say is not a trait of Midwesterners).

The only difference between us seems to be that you might see lack of (or reduced) materialism as a trait of Midwesterners, whereas I see it as something independent of geography. (And to the extent it is dependent on the surroundings, it is just a matter of time. Just look at today's Lakewood compared to a decade or two ago).

Your attitude needs some serious checking how you talk about other individual people.
I will again apologize to the בעל אכסניא and/or anyone who might have been offended by anything I said. Whatever I write here is written with a light heart, and while I do realize that it might come across as a שטאך, I would have never written it if I would think it would be taken offensively, rather than something said amongst friends.

Your starting to become the Chabad  version of CBC (no offense CBC).
I haven't been around long enough to understand what you are referring to.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2332 on: May 23, 2016, 04:04:55 AM »
First and foremost I would like to clarify that anything I write here is written with a light heart, with no intention to criticize anyone. I write based on my thoughts and observations, and try never to get personal or negative. If anyone took anything I wrote otherwise, I sincerely apologize.
I must have forgotten that English is not the primary language of these forums, but rather a language with many similarities, yet profoundly different  ;D

As per Google:
maˇteˇriˇalˇism
məˈtirēəˌlizəm/
noun
1. a tendency to consider material possessions and physical comfort as more important than spiritual values.
I can't speak for "the Chabad yeshiva world", but I could bring a quote of what I consider the "Kitzur Shulchan Oruch" of being a Lubavitcher http://chabadlibrary.org/books/default.aspx?furl=/admur/hymym/8/30 and I wonder if anyone reading this for the first time would contend that this השקפה is unique to Chabad or Lubavitch.
I absolutely don't see any of this being a function of where one lives, which is what prompted me to bring the Milton Friedman quote above.

And in case you didn't realize, YOUR explanation of the מעלות of Midwesterners seems to confirm my understanding of materialism (which you say is not a trait of Midwesterners).

The only difference between us seems to be that you might see lack of (or reduced) materialism as a trait of Midwesterners, whereas I see it as something independent of geography. (And to the extent it is dependent on the surroundings, it is just a matter of time. Just look at today's Lakewood compared to a decade or two ago).
I will again apologize to the בעל אכסניא and/or anyone who might have been offended by anything I said. Whatever I write here is written with a light heart, and while I do realize that it might come across as a שטאך, I would have never written it if I would think it would be taken offensively, rather than something said amongst friends.
I haven't been around long enough to understand what you are referring to.
Your quote shows the difference in our definitions. I can assure you if you take a poll here most people will agree living in a small apartment in Brooklyn doesn't make you holier than having a house with a backyard in Cleveland. Even though you have less physical advantages in an apartment.

When you don't know someone and you criticize what they do in an online forum it does not come off as light-hearted and definitely not as a friend.

Certain members have strong beliefs of how to be frum and what that means and they feel a need to let other members know what they are doing wrong vd"al.
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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2333 on: May 23, 2016, 09:54:01 AM »
I was just discussing this with someone the other day.
How to translate materialism. A car shows the outside world something about yourself. But say you remodel your kitchen even though it was fully functioning just old, is that materialistic?
Seems to be yes even though it's not for others.
Either way, this should get a new thread imo

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2334 on: May 23, 2016, 11:53:19 AM »
I was just discussing this with someone the other day.
How to translate materialism. A car shows the outside world something about yourself. But say you remodel your kitchen even though it was fully functioning just old, is that materialistic?
Seems to be yes even though it's not for others.
Either way, this should get a new thread imo
+1
that part needs a new thread, however when choosing a place to live and deciding that it's better for your family to live in a 4 BR, 2 BA, single family home with a backyard and good local chinuch over a small 3 BR, 1 BA apt in Brooklyn with no yard and cramped, low-quality schools, then that's not materialism. It's going somewhere better for your family to learn and grow.

In fact, it's the opposite of materialism, as the jobs may not pay as well, and there are less Kosher restaurants and amenities. We trade in some of that for the benefit of our family's chinuch/upbringing.
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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2335 on: May 23, 2016, 12:01:56 PM »


low-quality schools
I smell an out of towner. 

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2336 on: May 23, 2016, 12:04:35 PM »
I smell an out of towner. 
Well it can't be that you disagree, having moved to Israel and refusing to move back.  ;)

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2337 on: May 23, 2016, 12:07:21 PM »
Well it can't be that you disagree, having moved to Israel and refusing to move back.  ;)
Overall quality of life here is significantly better in my opinion. If there is any reason that I would move back to the treife Medina it would be for chinuch.

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2338 on: May 23, 2016, 12:10:02 PM »
Overall quality of life here is significantly better in my opinion. If there is any reason that I would move back to the treife Medina it would be for chinuch.
But in that situation, would it be chinuch in NYC, davka not NYC, or it doesn't make a difference?

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Re: The Pros And Cons Of Where You Live
« Reply #2339 on: May 23, 2016, 12:12:19 PM »
@cs1, Brooklyn has many schools to choose from so I'm not sure how you could say low quality.