Topic Wiki

The wiki is divided into groups for "fact" and "opinion." Please feel free to add whichever facts you know and opinions you have. Please try to avoid cluttering the wiki with unnecessary information such as outside links.

Please do not delete anything from this wiki.  If you disagree with an opinion, feel free to post your own. If you disagree with a fact--well, that's your opinion, and feel free to post it under opinions!

Facts
The flu vaccine causes more deaths per year than chicken pox.
The direct injection of RSV immunoglobulin, commonly known as the "RSV vaccine" would prevent 16x more deaths than the flu vaccine does, but is too expensive.
There is a vaccine for the plague, and that is why it is no longer an epidemic.
Ebola is caused by vaccines.
There is a vaccine for autism, but it causes mumps.


Opinions
Vaccines do not contain thimerosal, a known toxin.
If you snuck up on your neighbor's kid and cut open his skull, you would be arrested.  But when brain surgeons do it, and charge hundreds of thousands of dollars, it considered "medicine."
99% of vaccines do not cause autism (HT JJ1000).
Every pedi has seen healthy kids become sick physically & mentally hours after a vax (HT Baryochai)
Vaccines cause cancer, infertility, astma, adhd etc (HT Baryochai)

Poll

Did You Get The Flu Vaccine This Winter?

Yes (Shot)
121 (37.6%)
Yes (Nasal Spray)
5 (1.6%)
No
196 (60.9%)

Total Members Voted: 320

Author Topic: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread  (Read 544469 times)

Offline sky121

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2200 on: November 11, 2018, 08:54:04 PM »
The question wasn't really directed at you.
Lol.

Oh ok.


I must have missed something.

Who was it geared for? Or was it davka not geared towards me because of my opinions so far?
"Not all who wander are lost"

Offline mmgfarb

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2201 on: November 11, 2018, 08:58:59 PM »
Lol.

Oh ok.


I must have missed something.

Who was it geared for? Or was it davka not geared towards me because of my opinions so far?
It was for anyone who hasn't already expressed their opinion one way or another.
"JS [is] a fetid cesspool of unvarnished linguistic manure, with lots of useless drivel and post-padding." -Moishebatchy

Online Yehuda57

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2202 on: November 11, 2018, 09:29:54 PM »
Got it. And I understand the concept.

 But I just have a hard time believing that *all* those parents are sending their kids to school still because they davka want their kid to get measles.     

But maybe I'm wrong. Who knows.
Sorry, I think I missed your point. Anti Vax parents send their kids to school during an outbreak because A) they don't believe measles is all that bad. B) they don't believe vaccinations work anyway. C) why not? Not like they worked out the math on the risk/reward and are adjusting based on the current outbreaks or lack thereof

Offline thaber

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2203 on: November 11, 2018, 09:33:00 PM »
Sorry, I think I missed your point. Anti Vax parents send their kids to school during an outbreak because A) they don't believe measles is all that bad. B) they don't believe vaccinations work anyway. C) why not? Not like they worked out the math on the risk/reward and are adjusting based on the current outbreaks or lack thereof
Add to that what I heard from a parent last week that a) who says it's really measles, it's probably misdiagnosed, and b) measles is easily treated with a lot of vitamin C. I kid you not

Online Yehuda57

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2204 on: November 11, 2018, 09:34:46 PM »
Add to that what I heard from a parent last week that a) who says it's really measles, it's probably misdiagnosed, and b) measles is easily treated with a lot of vitamin C. I kid you not
*All* the cases are misdiagnosed? Like the hundreds in Israel, Brooklyn, Lakewood and Rockland County?

Offline thaber

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2205 on: November 11, 2018, 09:35:36 PM »
*All* the cases are misdiagnosed? Like the hundreds in Israel, Brooklyn, Lakewood and Rockland County?
We were specifically discussing the kid who died, but that was his general connotation

Offline sky121

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2206 on: November 11, 2018, 10:22:02 PM »
Add to that what I heard from a parent last week that a) who says it's really measles, it's probably misdiagnosed, and b) measles is easily treated with a lot of vitamin C. I kid you not

Oh gosh.  While it's not impossible to get measles and turn out just fine it's not something I'd imagine any parent wanting their child to risk having and hope they "turn out fine".   
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Offline Dan

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2207 on: November 11, 2018, 10:29:05 PM »

Lots of things are generally safe.


Right off the bat I'm concerned about what metals in your body do to you long term-  (and not just with vaccines- with all products with various metals-  ) and I'd like more research done as to the best way and ages to administer these vaccines - and ultimately I'd just like transparency in the benefits as well as the side effects on your body when taking vaccines especially at such a young age and the changes it makes to your immune system.
 
         Nothing is without some side effect.  That's not a question. And generally we try to make the best decision about anything that goes into our bodies.  And when you put something into your body you're basically saying the benefits outweigh the risks or are worth the side effects.

That's with anything whether it be an Advil, blood pressure medicine, antibiotics, the flu shot, etc . 


Also and this is just a side note- because you asked-  I do have concerns over some of the vaccines specifically. Like the HPV virus for example.
        I don't know enough. But I feel like I should have the right to ask. That's all.

And I ultimately believe that most people still choose to give most vaccines even if they had more information.



What boggles my mind the most is those that don't even know what they are vaccinating for.  Even if you trust the doctor, don't you ask? Just for knowledge sake.  What's this shot for... etc . I just feel like when your 2 year old is getting over 20 vaccines by that age it seems odd to not even ask.

The same way if you were in the hospital and your kid was getting treatment for something you'd ask. What's this? What's it for? What's it do..etc.   


I really think those on both sides of the extreme have made it hard to have discussions about these things.

But if you're lucky you find a good doctor that is respectful and knowledgeable and answers to the best of their ability.
Vaccines are not new. They have bee studied for generations. My 90 year old grandfather worked with Dr Salk to create the polio vaccine. We quickly forget the problems that they solved.

At any rate, what you have against HPV in particular? I hate to say it, but this is 2018...
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Offline sky121

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2208 on: November 11, 2018, 10:56:27 PM »
Vaccines are not new. They have bee studied for generations. My 90 year old grandfather worked with Dr Salk to create the polio vaccine. We quickly forget the problems that they solved.

At any rate, what you have against HPV in particular? I hate to say it, but this is 2018...

Vaccines are not new. They have bee studied for generations. My 90 year old grandfather worked with Dr Salk to create the polio vaccine. We quickly forget the problems that they solved.

At any rate, what you have against HPV in particular? I hate to say it, but this is 2018...

First off- very cool that your grandfather worked with Dr. Salk. Would love to hear more about that.

Not forgotten- especially in my family where my father lost his 6 year old cousin to polio just about a week before the vaccine was discovered. Though I do agree most people have no clue about how much damage many of these diseases caused and that's not even including the numbers that died.

Heck, many doctors I've spoke to have told me they have never seen many of these diseases.
Baruch Hashem.



The idea is that whatever risks are involved with vaccines are still worth it.     And I'm not specifically talking about peoples concerns that it has caused autism in kids etc but more long term effects on everyone who gets them.

With the HPV vaccine for example I worry that perhaps the risk don't outweigh the benefits because of the lower risks of developing the cancer and the other methods we have currently to reduce the risks etc. But again- this is without me having done a lot of research on the matter nor have I spoken to my doctor about this. Just throwing out a thought of mine.  Def do not know enough about this yet.
My main argument is just the right to ask. To discuss. To have concerns and conversations.
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Offline sky121

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2209 on: November 11, 2018, 11:13:42 PM »
Was the Penn and Teller video on vaccines posted on this thread? Always thought that was a pretty good video..
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Offline aygart

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2210 on: November 11, 2018, 11:16:29 PM »
*All* the cases are misdiagnosed? Like the hundreds in Israel, Brooklyn, Lakewood and Rockland County?
Why does that make less sense than the rest of their overall shita?
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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2211 on: November 11, 2018, 11:46:32 PM »
Why does that make less sense than the rest of their overall shita?
Easier to ignore past research than today's facts staring you in the face

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2214 on: November 12, 2018, 02:50:48 PM »
Serious question, if I put together an article for DDMS from some family who are doctors just presenting some history and info about vaccines.

My grandfather did preliminary research for Jonas Salk on the Polio vaccine, and I think it can be very informative.

Good idea or terrible idea?

Probably has never been a better time than the present with all these terrible headlines in the news bashing the orthodox community.
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Offline mmgfarb

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2215 on: November 12, 2018, 02:51:40 PM »
"JS [is] a fetid cesspool of unvarnished linguistic manure, with lots of useless drivel and post-padding." -Moishebatchy

Offline davidrotts63

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2216 on: November 12, 2018, 02:56:33 PM »
If you are ready for controversy and YWN like comments, go ahead.
(Quit) pulling out the flowers, and watering the weeds. -Peter Lynch

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2217 on: November 12, 2018, 02:57:47 PM »
Serious question, if I put together an article for DDMS from some family who are doctors just presenting some history and info about vaccines.

My grandfather did preliminary research for Jonas Salk on the Polio vaccine, and I think it can be very informative.

Good idea or terrible idea?

Probably has never been a better time than the present with all these terrible headlines in the news bashing the orthodox community.
Please do it, but don't allow any comments.

Offline Definitions

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2218 on: November 12, 2018, 02:59:05 PM »
Serious question...
If you published it already I wouldn't complain. But since you're asking if you should, I don't think you should. It's just not the right place for it. I would gladly read it here though

Or if you can find a deal that's related to vaccines and put a link to it in there :)
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Offline zh cohen

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2219 on: November 12, 2018, 03:02:38 PM »
Read the whole thread:
https://twitter.com/OJPAC/status/1061856960256057344

There are verifiable numbers about the percentage of these communities that don't vaccinate. I don't remember where I saw them, but they do not compare favorably to the general public.