Topic Wiki

The wiki is divided into groups for "fact" and "opinion." Please feel free to add whichever facts you know and opinions you have. Please try to avoid cluttering the wiki with unnecessary information such as outside links.

Please do not delete anything from this wiki.  If you disagree with an opinion, feel free to post your own. If you disagree with a fact--well, that's your opinion, and feel free to post it under opinions!

Facts
The flu vaccine causes more deaths per year than chicken pox.
The direct injection of RSV immunoglobulin, commonly known as the "RSV vaccine" would prevent 16x more deaths than the flu vaccine does, but is too expensive.
There is a vaccine for the plague, and that is why it is no longer an epidemic.
Ebola is caused by vaccines.
There is a vaccine for autism, but it causes mumps.


Opinions
Vaccines do not contain thimerosal, a known toxin.
If you snuck up on your neighbor's kid and cut open his skull, you would be arrested.  But when brain surgeons do it, and charge hundreds of thousands of dollars, it considered "medicine."
99% of vaccines do not cause autism (HT JJ1000).
Every pedi has seen healthy kids become sick physically & mentally hours after a vax (HT Baryochai)
Vaccines cause cancer, infertility, astma, adhd etc (HT Baryochai)

Poll

Did You Get The Flu Vaccine This Winter?

Yes (Shot)
112 (38.6%)
Yes (Nasal Spray)
5 (1.7%)
No
173 (59.7%)

Total Members Voted: 289

Author Topic: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread  (Read 200514 times)

Offline mmgfarb

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2790 on: May 28, 2019, 11:58:26 AM »
But there is a risk and people do die. No they haven't yet as the measels rates have been low bh but should they expand, yes we will see death's lo aleinu.

This is so idiotic because you are proposing taxing the medical establishment with clearly preventable diseases.

Again go start your own anti vaxxer community and stay far away from us.
I'm not proposing anything. I'm also not an anti-vaxxer.
"JS [is] a fetid cesspool of unvarnished linguistic manure, with lots of useless drivel and post-padding." -Moishebatchy

Offline chevron

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2791 on: May 28, 2019, 11:59:57 AM »
Lol, ever been to CLE? The place is swarming with frum doctors. (Besides for the fact that there are very good reasons that the frum community is not sending their kids to regular colleges.)

I'm just using the material at hand. Most frum doctors are BT or mo and many chasidishe or yeshivish doctors didn't start off that way.

I know 50+ doctors and not one opposes vaccinations.

Rabbi kaminetzky always quotes some doctor as if one guy is the bearer of the medical mesora.

Sure I have strong points and I've seen what the medical establishment has done for some very sick people. It's not perfect but nothing is.

Show us the bodies. Show us the proven death's from MMR.


Offline Boruch999

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2792 on: May 28, 2019, 01:09:22 PM »
That is not at all what I implied, I would appreciate if you would refrain from putting words in my mouth.

Here's what led me to say that.

Even according to people who say it causes autism, it's still rare for it to. Otherwise 99.99% of the population would be autistic. I'd take a chance at autism over a chance of dying.

Again, purely hypothetical as there is zero evidence that they do. It's just as likely that they cause superior intelligence.

He clearly didn't mean to limit it to a chance of dying. I think vegetative brain damage would also work.

And you responded

The argument would be that there's really no risk of dying, especially in America.

to which I responded

There are reportedly 2 people in Israel with irreversible brain damage due to measles.

To which you responded

Are they dead? Autism is also irreversible brain damage. Again, I'm not saying that vaccine causes autism, there's obviously no evidence to support that, I was just coming to answer what I thought was a stupid argument.


I thought that seemed like you were trivializing brain damage.  I apologize if that's not what you meant to convey.

Online aygart

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You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline chevron

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2794 on: June 05, 2019, 05:56:36 PM »
https://www.thelakewoodscoop.com/news/2019/06/first-look-dr-rich-roberts-releases-24-page-brochure-gedolim-letters-on-vaccinations.html#more-207970

The comments on that article and others and just reading this;

https://www.vosizneias.com/324592/2019/06/05/brooklyn-ny-orthodox-conspiracy-anti-vaccination-rally-led-by-a-hollywood-producer-and-a-rabbi-who-quotes-gospel-of-luke/

Is why it's impossible to reason with anti vaxxers. They rail about a huge conspiracy, blast the health establishment as being complicit and incompetent etc etc..

Good luck treating your diseases at home.

Offline Boruch999

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« Last Edit: August 13, 2019, 08:54:37 AM by Boruch999 »

Offline ~King Lake~

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2796 on: August 13, 2019, 09:21:36 AM »
https://www.timesofisrael.com/el-al-flight-attendant-dies-4-months-after-contracting-measles-on-plane-from-ny/

BD"E
I'm waiting for that idiots to say that she died because she took the shot and not because she had measles...
I'm going crazy, wanna come along?

Offline sb5917

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Online avromie7

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2798 on: August 13, 2019, 10:38:36 AM »
y was she not vaccinated ?
Why is the same stupidity repeated so many times in this thread?
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline chinagel

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2799 on: August 13, 2019, 10:42:14 AM »
Why is the same stupidity repeated so many times in this thread?
Please make this your signature.

Offline Boruch999

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2800 on: August 13, 2019, 11:11:10 AM »
y was she not vaccinated ?
She was. She did not get the booster.

Online shwarmabob

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2801 on: August 13, 2019, 11:51:23 AM »
mother of 3 kids. bd"e

Offline shaulyaakov

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2802 on: August 13, 2019, 02:47:44 PM »
When people call out those with public profiles who discourage vaccines, this is why.

Offline henche

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2803 on: November 11, 2019, 02:22:23 PM »
I have a new chiddush, relevant here.

Causation does not equal correlation. We all know that correlation can be coincidence and doesn't equal causation.  My hearah is that not every causation relationship happens frequently enough that it can be shown with large random sample statistics.

For example, some people are allergic to latex.  However, if you took a million people at random, and exposed them to latex, I'm betting that the increase in allergic reactions versus the number in the general population would not be statistically significant. If you don't believe that for latex, it is definitely true for some more rare allergies.

So how do you know if you're allergic to latex? With non-random non-scientific, anecdotal evidence that you touched latex and got hives.

This is all to say that the fact that vaccines do not increase Bad Thing rates on a population-wide scale in a statistically significant manner doesn't indicate that it never causes Bad Thing to anyone.  It does indicate that we probably shouldn't be too concerned that it will cause Bad Thing in any specific person, but if someone observed it causing Bad Thing that isn't contradicted.   

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #2804 on: November 11, 2019, 03:13:15 PM »
I have a new chiddush, relevant here.

Causation does not equal correlation. We all know that correlation can be coincidence and doesn't equal causation.  My hearah is that not every causation relationship happens frequently enough that it can be shown with large random sample statistics.

For example, some people are allergic to latex.  However, if you took a million people at random, and exposed them to latex, I'm betting that the increase in allergic reactions versus the number in the general population would not be statistically significant. If you don't believe that for latex, it is definitely true for some more rare allergies.

So how do you know if you're allergic to latex? With non-random non-scientific, anecdotal evidence that you touched latex and got hives.

This is all to say that the fact that vaccines do not increase Bad Thing rates on a population-wide scale in a statistically significant manner doesn't indicate that it never causes Bad Thing to anyone.  It does indicate that we probably shouldn't be too concerned that it will cause Bad Thing in any specific person, but if someone observed it causing Bad Thing that isn't contradicted.   
No person is 10% allergic to latex, but if 10% of the population is allergic then the individual anecdotal evidence would be to show that they are part of that 10%. If 0% of the population is allergic to oxygen then any anecdotal evidence would need to be interpreted in a manner disregarding a connection to an oxygen allergy.

Regarding the vaccines, if someone claims a side effect which there is no statistically significant connection it will lead us to infer that it is most likely unconnected to the vaccine or possibly even that it never happened.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.