Topic Wiki

The wiki is divided into groups for "fact" and "opinion." Please feel free to add whichever facts you know and opinions you have. Please try to avoid cluttering the wiki with unnecessary information such as outside links.

Please do not delete anything from this wiki.  If you disagree with an opinion, feel free to post your own. If you disagree with a fact--well, that's your opinion, and feel free to post it under opinions!

Facts
The flu vaccine causes more deaths per year than chicken pox.
The direct injection of RSV immunoglobulin, commonly known as the "RSV vaccine" would prevent 16x more deaths than the flu vaccine does, but is too expensive.
There is a vaccine for the plague, and that is why it is no longer an epidemic.
Ebola is caused by vaccines.
There is a vaccine for autism, but it causes mumps.


Opinions
Vaccines do not contain thimerosal, a known toxin.
If you snuck up on your neighbor's kid and cut open his skull, you would be arrested.  But when brain surgeons do it, and charge hundreds of thousands of dollars, it considered "medicine."
99% of vaccines do not cause autism (HT JJ1000).
Every pedi has seen healthy kids become sick physically & mentally hours after a vax (HT Baryochai)
Vaccines cause cancer, infertility, astma, adhd etc (HT Baryochai)

Poll

Did You Get The Flu Vaccine This Winter?

Yes (Shot)
112 (38.8%)
Yes (Nasal Spray)
5 (1.7%)
No
172 (59.5%)

Total Members Voted: 288

Author Topic: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread  (Read 186435 times)

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1935 on: February 04, 2018, 11:23:58 AM »
Quote from: ExGingi
[Stating things eloquently] seems to be Yehuda57's job around here :)

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1936 on: February 04, 2018, 11:24:40 AM »
Quote from: ExGingi
[Stating things eloquently] seems to be Yehuda57's job around here :)

Offline aygart

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1937 on: February 04, 2018, 11:26:18 AM »
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/fluvaxview/coverage-1516estimates.htm

It's at ~59%
Basically the same as for the year that I quoted. Likely the same this year. Those are pretty strong numbers if the group of 60% account for only 15% of deaths.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline aygart

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1938 on: February 04, 2018, 11:27:11 AM »
How did my reply include your ETA without me seeing it?
Maybe it posted right before you hit quote.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Online henche

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1939 on: February 04, 2018, 11:41:55 AM »
Basically the same as for the year that I quoted. Likely the same this year. Those are pretty strong numbers if the group of 60% account for only 15% of deaths.

Well, you're still working with only 53 ppl in your sample, so lots of small variables could mess up your results, buthe ok.

Now query if theres anything different about the 60 percent of kids who are vaccinated than the 40 percent who aren't.

Might the parents who vaccinate also be more likely to seek medical attention earlier? Are the kids likely to be more healthy generally?


Offline Mordyk

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1940 on: February 04, 2018, 11:47:38 AM »
PLEASE O PLEASE DONT REVIVE THIS THREAD!!
!!!

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1941 on: February 04, 2018, 11:49:59 AM »
PLEASE O PLEASE DONT REVIVE THIS THREAD!!
I can see this getting way overused!!!
I just found a new supply of forks!

Offline aygart

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1942 on: February 04, 2018, 11:52:41 AM »
Well, you're still working with only 53 ppl in your sample, so lots of small variables could mess up your results, buthe ok.

Now query if theres anything different about the 60 percent of kids who are vaccinated than the 40 percent who aren't.

Might the parents who vaccinate also be more likely to seek medical attention earlier? Are the kids likely to be more healthy generally?



http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2017/03/30/peds.2016-4244
http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2017/03/30/peds.2016-4244.full-text.pdf

RESULTS: From July 2010 through June 2014, 358 laboratory-confirmed influenza-associated pediatric deaths were reported among children aged 6 months through 17 years. Vaccination status was determined for 291 deaths; 75 (26%) received vaccine before illness onset. Average vaccination coverage in survey cohorts was 48%. Overall VE against death was 65% (95% CI, 54% to 74%). Among 153 deaths in children with underlying high-risk medical conditions, 47 (31%) were vaccinated. VE among children with high-risk conditions was 51% (95% CI, 31% to 67%), compared with 65% (95% CI, 47% to 78%) among children without high-risk conditions.

You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

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Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1944 on: February 17, 2018, 08:07:44 PM »
https://www.wsj.com/articles/flu-vaccine-less-effective-than-earlier-estimates-1518718596

Didn't read the article (paywall), but are you still ignoring the fact that having the vaccine reduces fatality rates and the severity of symptoms in ~85% of cases even when flu is contracted?

And even if only effective 30%, what are the risks of the vaccine?
Quote from: ExGingi
[Stating things eloquently] seems to be Yehuda57's job around here :)

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1945 on: March 08, 2018, 07:31:49 AM »
PLEASE O PLEASE DONT REVIVE THIS THREAD!!
Dear Friends,
B’siyata D’shmaya we have formed The Vaccine Coalition, a Coalition of Non-Vaccinating Parents in Lakewood, New Jersey.
This coalition was founded by R’ Malkiel Kotler shlit”a, R’ Shmuel Meir Katz shlit”a and R’ Refael Szmerla shlit”a, and it aims to address the current pressing issue of schools rejecting or dismissing non-vaccinated children. It will also be available to help non-vaccinating parents in Lakewood in any area we feel we can, as well as to provide support of ‘strength in numbers’ to pro-vaccine choice Lakewood families.
This coalition depends on a collective voice and will not be launched until we reach a minimum of 250 families. If you live in Lakewood and have made a decision not to vaccinate your children, we encourage you to please take a few moments to sign up to join the coalition, for your benefit, and for the benefit of all other Lakewood families like yourselves.
 By joining the coalition you agree to have your name and personal information added to our private database. Your information will never be released to a third party without your permission. If the coalition should find it absolutely necessary to release your name in the course of assisting it's members you may receive an email requesting your permission.  Any such instance will be authorized by the Rosh Hayeshiva R’ Malkiel Kotler shlit”a beforehand.
The success of this endeavor is contingent on enlisting as many non-vaccinating families as possible. Please take the time to reach out to your friends and family who don’t vaccinate and encourage them to join.

To join, please visit www.vaccinecoalition.org. Alternatively you can join by emailing vaccinecoalition@gmail.com or call/ text 732-806-7739

Online jj1000

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1946 on: March 08, 2018, 07:46:14 AM »
Dear Friends,
B’siyata D’shmaya we have formed The Vaccine Coalition, a Coalition of Non-Vaccinating Parents in Lakewood, New Jersey.
This coalition was founded by R’ Malkiel Kotler shlit”a, R’ Shmuel Meir Katz shlit”a and R’ Refael Szmerla shlit”a, and it aims to address the current pressing issue of schools rejecting or dismissing non-vaccinated children. It will also be available to help non-vaccinating parents in Lakewood in any area we feel we can, as well as to provide support of ‘strength in numbers’ to pro-vaccine choice Lakewood families.
This coalition depends on a collective voice and will not be launched until we reach a minimum of 250 families. If you live in Lakewood and have made a decision not to vaccinate your children, we encourage you to please take a few moments to sign up to join the coalition, for your benefit, and for the benefit of all other Lakewood families like yourselves.
 By joining the coalition you agree to have your name and personal information added to our private database. Your information will never be released to a third party without your permission. If the coalition should find it absolutely necessary to release your name in the course of assisting it's members you may receive an email requesting your permission.  Any such instance will be authorized by the Rosh Hayeshiva R’ Malkiel Kotler shlit”a beforehand.
The success of this endeavor is contingent on enlisting as many non-vaccinating families as possible. Please take the time to reach out to your friends and family who don’t vaccinate and encourage them to join.

To join, please visit www.vaccinecoalition.org. Alternatively you can join by emailing vaccinecoalition@gmail.com or call/ text 732-806-7739
Do people lose respect for gedolim that agree to stuff like this? Or is it a, they just don't know science how the world works outside torah type thing, but for torah related stuff they are still a gadol?

Famous question with the rambam and medicine, just wondering practically about now a days.
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Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1947 on: March 08, 2018, 07:48:16 AM »
Do people lose respect for gedolim that agree to stuff like this? Or is it a, they just don't know science how the world works outside torah type thing, but for torah related stuff they are still a gadol?
Very complicated.. but let's not make "gedolim" out of rabonim and a Rosh yeshiva.

Offline Mordyk

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1948 on: March 08, 2018, 07:52:12 AM »
Dear Friends,
B’siyata D’shmaya we have formed The Vaccine Coalition, a Coalition of Non-Vaccinating Parents in Lakewood, New Jersey.
This coalition was founded by R’ Malkiel Kotler shlit”a, R’ Shmuel Meir Katz shlit”a and R’ Refael Szmerla shlit”a, and it aims to address the current pressing issue of schools rejecting or dismissing non-vaccinated children. It will also be available to help non-vaccinating parents in Lakewood in any area we feel we can, as well as to provide support of ‘strength in numbers’ to pro-vaccine choice Lakewood families.
This coalition depends on a collective voice and will not be launched until we reach a minimum of 250 families. If you live in Lakewood and have made a decision not to vaccinate your children, we encourage you to please take a few moments to sign up to join the coalition, for your benefit, and for the benefit of all other Lakewood families like yourselves.
 By joining the coalition you agree to have your name and personal information added to our private database. Your information will never be released to a third party without your permission. If the coalition should find it absolutely necessary to release your name in the course of assisting it's members you may receive an email requesting your permission.  Any such instance will be authorized by the Rosh Hayeshiva R’ Malkiel Kotler shlit”a beforehand.
The success of this endeavor is contingent on enlisting as many non-vaccinating families as possible. Please take the time to reach out to your friends and family who don’t vaccinate and encourage them to join.

To join, please visit www.vaccinecoalition.org. Alternatively you can join by emailing vaccinecoalition@gmail.com or call/ text 732-806-7739
Disgusting.

Online jj1000

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Re: Vaccine Discussion Master Thread
« Reply #1949 on: March 08, 2018, 08:09:22 AM »
Very complicated.. but let's not make "gedolim" out of rabonim and a Rosh yeshiva.

So no longer "gedolim", got it. ;)
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