Vaccine Discussion Master Thread

[avromie7]

https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/1484691/life-threatening-coalition-attempting-to-form-in-lakewood-new-jersey-tens-of-thousands-at-risk.html

Got to love this comment:

kavod Habriot
March 8, 2018 12:40 pm at 12:40 pm
“Hey Lakewood! There’s no reason for you to panic parents for absolutely no reason. First of all what is unsafe for vaccinated kids to sit in a class with a few unvaccinated kids? If they are vaccinated than nothing should happen to them. Right? Doesn’t that make sense? Also, Nobody ever dies from the Measles… It’s Like saying the kid died from a big cold. They die from the horrible vaccine that consists of the most disgusting and unsafe ingredients that you can’t even imagine. We have more sick children out than ever before. The Children’s hospitals are packed. Whats Going On? Why? Arent, they vaccinated? Obviously, there’s something very wrong with our corrupt system. If you do some research you will find out that there’s a whole world out there that’s against this vaccination scam. It seems that in our neighborhoods we have to do whatever we are told to do because otherwise…. The doctors are making so much money & kickbacks from the pharma companies like you cant imagine. Yes, even the big doctors in LW wont admit it to you. How many patients do they all have? Try to do the math? Its gonna take a while. There’s plenty of reason for any smart or concerned parent to do some research before they load up their child’s bloodstream with all sorts of medication and drugs. Yes, The FDA website says vaccination is medication. Does Hashem bring down an unperfect baby to the world? Does he not know what he’s doing? Or are we taking a precious little baby and drugging them up because of all the pressures from others? Don’t fall for people or State/Government systems that have an agenda. It’s your Child! He may be okay after his vaccination today. However ho do you know it cant harm him in 20 years from now? Do Research!!!”

Why let the facts get in the way?

Here's another jem.

People who use vaccinations show that they lack complete emunah in Hashem’s refuah. True ma’aminim will avoid vaccinations and medicines in general. Ani Hashem rofecha, ani vlo malacha, ani vlo rofeh.

[yzj]

Here's another jem.

People who use vaccinations show that they lack complete emunah in Hashem’s refuah. True ma’aminim will avoid vaccinations and medicines in general. Ani Hashem rofecha, ani vlo malacha, ani vlo rofeh.

How do they justify going to alternative medicine doctors. I know of one lady in town who has lines out the door of anti- vaccine patients coming for adjustments and the like. What happened to Ani vilo rofeh?

[avromie7]

How do they justify going to alternative medicine doctors. I know of one lady in town who has lines out the door of anti- vaccine patients coming for adjustments and the like. What happened to Ani vilo rofeh?

That aside, they missed one little point - hishtadlus

[yitzgar]

Oh please. these ywn comments are just trolls

[yzj]

Oh please. these ywn comments are just trolls

If they are they are paraphrasing similar statements I’ve heard from true believers over the years.

[churnbabychurn]

Parents of retarded children. Nebach. We should never know the pain of a retarded child... But it doesn't give them the right to hurt everyone else.
It's a lack of emuna.

People have a natural inability to accept that their child is not perfect. So they created a hoax to make them feel better.

My kid is normal, the Dr damaged him.

[Mordyk]

[yzj]

Dear Friends,
B’siyata D’shmaya we have formed The Vaccine Coalition, a Coalition of Non-Vaccinating Parents in Lakewood, New Jersey.
This coalition was founded by R’ Malkiel Kotler shlit”a, R’ Shmuel Meir Katz shlit”a and R’ Refael Szmerla shlit”a, and it aims to address the current pressing issue of schools rejecting or dismissing non-vaccinated children. It will also be available to help non-vaccinating parents in Lakewood in any area we feel we can, as well as to provide support of ‘strength in numbers’ to pro-vaccine choice Lakewood families.
This coalition depends on a collective voice and will not be launched until we reach a minimum of 250 families. If you live in Lakewood and have made a decision not to vaccinate your children, we encourage you to please take a few moments to sign up to join the coalition, for your benefit, and for the benefit of all other Lakewood families like yourselves.
 By joining the coalition you agree to have your name and personal information added to our private database. Your information will never be released to a third party without your permission. If the coalition should find it absolutely necessary to release your name in the course of assisting it's members you may receive an email requesting your permission.  Any such instance will be authorized by the Rosh Hayeshiva R’ Malkiel Kotler shlit”a beforehand.
The success of this endeavor is contingent on enlisting as many non-vaccinating families as possible. Please take the time to reach out to your friends and family who don’t vaccinate and encourage them to join.

To join, please visit www.vaccinecoalition.org. Alternatively you can join by emailing vaccinecoalition@gmail.com or call/ text 732-806-7739

Rabbi Szmerla put out a book justifying the halachic basis for Kinesiology, dowsing, energy fields etc. Talmidim of Rav Belsky Z”L recently put out a Sefer of his well know pesakim assuring these techniques. Many who originally gave hashkafos to Rabbi Szmerlas Sefer later retracted. It’s ironic to see people dismissing proven science to put their faith and hishtadlus into disproven techniques..

https://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/general/1308773/alternative-medicine-halacha-review.html

https://www.google.com/amp/www.5tjt.com/alternative-medicine-the-sefer/amp/

[avromie7]

Parents of retarded children. Nebach. We should never know the pain of a retarded child... But it doesn't give them the right to hurt everyone else.
It's a lack of bitachon.

People have a natural inability to accept that their child is not perfect. So they created a hoax to make them feel better.

My kid is normal, the Dr damaged him.

FTFY

[yuneeq]

It's ironic all the people that hate visiting traditional doctors are in the the alternative doctors office all the time and always need crazy cocktails of alternative meds. They're always sick and always taking medicine when regular families rarely go to the doctor or take medicine.
IME.

[yesitsme]

According to our religion it's prohibited to immunize, why? well there are no two people with the same reasoning, the health inspector laughs his head off when he reads all interesting pshetlech how the Torah prohibits immunization.

unfortunately I heard of one that had home birth didn't vaccinize and they nebach lost their child a few months later.

While I believe that everyone should vaccinate I think they should educate the parents why and when the children should take the vaccines, for example here in new York the health department has rules from what age you can take the shot and how many days between one shot and the other in order to be recognized as a valid shot, not all doctors follow the guidelines and you child needs to take the same shot again.

The health department guidelines that regulate the schools differ then the guidelines from headstart turns out that headstart makes you take shots that the health dep doesn't recognize.

If you take shot x at the age x you only need 2 doses otherwise 4, why shouldn't the parents know more about the subject? Everyone follows blindly what the dr says, Each of my children have taken shots that the health department has invalidated, why poke your kids for nothing?

[elit]

If in fact they are behind this, it's hard not to lose some respect.
Yes we can still respect their Torah related teachings, but a Rov should be trusted for other issues as well.
(I speak for myself).

I agree

Parents of retarded children. Nebach. We should never know the pain of a retarded child... But it doesn't give them the right to hurt everyone else.
It's a lack of emuna.

People have a natural inability to accept that their child is not perfect. So they created a hoax to make them feel better.

My kid is normal, the Dr damaged him.

you can say that with a little more sensitivity

[avromie7]

you can say that with a little more sensitivity

I don't think there's a lack of sensitivity in his post. It's the unfortunate truth.

[davidrotts63]

I don't think there's a lack of sensitivity in his post. It's the unfortunate truth.

To someone not yet being radical (as banning vaccines, because their kid is sick), you definitely could say it more sensitively, but at this point, that may be the only way

[churnbabychurn]

I agree


you can say that with a little more sensitivity

I know it's harsh. But being pc about it will not being out the truth.

These nebach parents are trying to sway public opinion. If they are not properly called out so the that everyone understands where the meshugas comes from, the results can be bad.

Virtually all of the militant antivaxers have a kid somewhere on the spectrum...

[davidrotts63]

I know it's harsh. But being pc about it will not being out the truth.

These nebach parents are trying to sway public opinion. If they are not properly called out so the that everyone understands where the meshugas comes from, the results can be bad.

Virtually all of the militant antivaxers have a kid somewhere on the spectrum...

I for the most part stand corrected

To someone not yet being radical (as banning vaccines, because their kid is sick), you definitely could say it more sensitively, but at this point, that may be the only way

Still a little unsure.

[eyj]

Interesting how the DDF crowd which tends to be somewhat more worldly and educated seems to skew pro vaccination, while the antis tend to be more insulated, and less educated in the secular sense. Same crowd that snaps up all the high priced vitamin cocktails that are marketed with the pictures of the kids with the cute Peyos....

[yitzgar]

Interesting how the DDF crowd which tends to be somewhat more worldly and educated seems to skew pro vaccination, while the antis tend to be more insulated, and less educated in the secular sense. Same crowd that snaps up all the high priced vitamin cocktails that are marketed with the pictures of the kids with the cute Peyos....

Do you mean to imply that only anti vaxxers take vitamins?

[Yehuda57]

Interesting how the DDF crowd which tends to be somewhat more worldly and educated seems to skew pro vaccination, while the antis tend to be more insulated, and less educated in the secular sense. Same crowd that snaps up all the high priced vitamin cocktails that are marketed with the pictures of the kids with the cute Peyos....

In the secular world the anti-vaxers have a higher education level than average. Me thinks you're leaping a bit there.

[Mordyk]

I agree


you can say that with a little more sensitivity

-1.  You must say it as it is. The dangers of some of the sicknesses coming back is to scary for us to be politically correct