Vaccine Discussion Master Thread

[DaasTora]

Overall for the country.

There was a massive drop in hospitalizations and deaths since they introduced the vaccine?
I look at the vaccine as the top reason for that but not the only one. How about you (anyone)?

Isn’t herd immunity a big factor?

[DaasTora]

Not going to get into Covid in general as we are past that.
The vaccine didn't/doesn't work?

Read this?

Some might be from actually getting the vaccine.
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/05/03/health/covid-vaccines-side-effects.html

[imayid2]

https://open.substack.com/pub/thedailyscroll/p/may-20-nonprofit-sponsor-of-sjp-is

→The COVID-19 vaccines had “significant side effects,” according to the former director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. In a Thursday interview, Dr. Robert Redfield, who served as CDC director from 2018 to 2021, told Chris Cuomo:

[The vaccines are] important for the most vulnerable people, those over 60, 65 years of age. They really aren’t that critical for those that are under 50 or younger. But those vaccines saved a lot of lives, but they also—we have to be honest, some people got significant side effects from the vaccine. I have a number of people that are quite ill and they never had COVID, but they are ill from the vaccine. And we just have to acknowledge that.

In the interview, written up at ZeroHedge, Redfield described the American public’s lack of trust in the public health establishment as in part a product of officials’ lack of transparency during the pandemic, including on the subject of vaccine safety. “Those of us who tried to suggest there may be significant side effects from vaccines,” Redfield said, “we kind of got canceled … because they were afraid that that would cause people not to want to get vaccinated.”

[yelped]

So does my doctor. What is the +/- to get the vaccine? Politics. Do you trust your doctor less because of Covid? I just went through prostate cancer and Covid never entered my mind on deciding on what treatment.

Would still like to hear the views if the Covid vaccine is a net positive?

I thought you don't want 27 pages of going in circles? You know what the other position is already. Don't hyperfocus on a single point or metric without looking at the big picture.

[aygart]

I thought you don't want 27 pages of going in circles?

Please stop

[aygart]

Overall for the country.

There was a massive drop in hospitalizations and deaths since they introduced the vaccine?
I look at the vaccine as the top reason for that but not the only one. How about you (anyone)?

The issue here is the lack of nuance.

[aygart]

Isn’t herd immunity a big factor?

That does not seem to have ever happened.

[DaasTora]

Would still like to hear the views if the Covid vaccine is a net positive?

It’s like asking if the war in Gaza is net positive. It definitely is but why can’t you do it responsibly without requiring a “net”? Would you shoot in a stadium with thugs and after killing more murderers than civilians consider it a net positive? Focus on the need. There was no need to force every young healthy person to take the vaccine and that’s definitely not positive. The older generation should take it. So let’s focus on where it’s needed and not have to estimate “net positive” results.

[DaasTora]

That does not seem to have ever been reported by the “experts”.

FTFY

[jj1000]

So does my doctor.

Your doctor pushes it hard for kids?

What is the +/- to get the vaccine?

Plus is a less severe illness. Minus are a variety of things, small or large that have to be weighed for each person vs their personal covid risk factor. For kids, it's statistically negligible and without a long term study on the vaccine, it doesn't make sense for kids to get it.

Do you trust your doctor less because of Covid? 

I trust him more, because of COVID. But he's also my FIL and he also didn't do the CDC or political talking points but rather clinical experience when to came to covid.

I think it's field specific that lost credibility. And the vaccine field, lost a lot.

Would still like to hear the views if the Covid vaccine is a net positive?

I think it's clearly a very good net positive in the short term. Long term, to be determined.

[aygart]

FTFY

Not sure what you are getting at here

[DaasTora]

Not sure what you are getting at here

Since when doesn’t natural immunity protect against viruses? They just ignored it for political reasons.

[Euclid]

Since when doesn’t natural immunity protect against viruses?

Like colds?

[DaasTora]

Like colds?

Are colds dangerous?

[aygart]

Are colds dangerous?

How does herd immunity depend on the severity of the disease?

[DaasTora]

How does herd immunity depend on the severity of the disease?

I was just responding to his question about the cold. Don’t know how that enters the conversation. By every strain of Covid we needed another booster shot for that particular strain while natural immunity for that strain wasn’t recognized. That’s unprecedented. Everyone agrees that a kid that had chickenpox doesn’t need to be vaccinated for it. Why was Covid different?
The flu, another virus that mutates, proves to you how ineffective the vaccines are, and the Covid vaccine that has serious side effects should definitely not been taken so lightly if it’s anyway not that effective.

[aygart]

I was just responding to his question about the cold. Don’t know how that enters the conversation. By every strain of Covid we needed another booster shot for that particular strain while natural immunity for that strain wasn’t recognized. That’s unprecedented. Everyone agrees that a kid that had chickenpox doesn’t need to be vaccinated for it. Why was Covid different?

. Where in the world are you coming from that the natural immunity helped for different strains

[jj1000]

I was just responding to his question about the cold. Don’t know how that enters the conversation. By every strain of Covid we needed another booster shot for that particular strain while natural immunity for that strain wasn’t recognized. That’s unprecedented. Everyone agrees that a kid that had chickenpox doesn’t need to be vaccinated for it. Why was Covid different?

Are you genuinely asking, or do you think you are right and asking these questions to prove a point?

Because from what I am reading you don't understand immunity, vaccines, or viruses fwiw. And I don't mean that in a mean way at all, just stating how it reads.

[DaasTora]

. Where in the world are you coming from that the natural immunity helped for different strains

Since when doesn’t natural immunity protect against viruses?

I meant immunity from strain A for strain A.

[DaasTora]

Are you genuinely asking, or do you think you are right and asking these questions to prove a point?

Because from what I am reading you don't understand immunity, vaccines, or viruses fwiw. And I don't mean that in a mean way at all, just stating how it reads.

Please elaborate.