Topic Wiki

Roundup Of Routes Where Kosher Meals Are Served By North American Airlines - http://www.dansdeals.com/archives/89484

Here's a google docs where people could input their inflight kashrus experience :
http://kshr.us/KosherMeals 


AA KSML availability:

-Most domestic routes where meals are served (in J or F)
-Flights to Europe or Asia in all classes.
-Flights to Belo Horizonte, Brasilia, Porto Alegre, Recife, Rio de Janeiro, Salvador, Sao Paulo, Brazil in all classes.
-Flights to Asuncion, Paraguay in all classes.
-Flights to Buenos Aires, Argentina in all classes.
-Flights to Santiago, Chile in all classes.
-Flights to Montevideo, Uruguay in all classes.

UA KSML availability:

-EWR-SFO in J
-EWR-LAX in J
-BOS-SFO in J
-Flights between the US mainland or Guam and Hawaii in J or F.
-Flights to Europe or Asia in all classes.
-Flights to Argentina, Brazil, Chile and Peru in all classes.

Please Include:
Airline:
Class:
Route:
Caterer:
Hechsher:
Flight date:
Meal in pics:
Stogel-Hermolis Scale Score (1-10):

Stogel-Hermolis Scale:
1. Inedible, wouldn't feed to a dog. (Stogel [long-life])
2. Disgusting, would only eat if starving
3. Barely edible, would only eat if very hungry
4. Below average, but would eat if hungry (Stogel [fresh-frozen])
5. Average/typical KSML, would eat if hungry (Borenstein?)
6. Above average KSML (Borenstein?)
7. A good KSML, might even eat if not hungry.
8. A very good KSML
9. An excellent KSML, could pass for something served in a decent restaurant.
10. Top of the line KSML, would be happy eating this at a decent restaurant. (Hermolis)


AirlineRouteClassMeal
BALHR-JFKJDinner
BALHR-PRGJBreakfast
CM           TGU-PTY          J              Lunch
CM           PTY-JK          J              Dinner
CO           EWR-TLV          BF              Dinner
COEWR-TLVBFBreakfast
COHNL-EWRBFDinner
COHNL-EWRBFBreakfast
COIAH-HNLBFLunch
COIAH-HNLBFSnack
LHFRA-VCEJSnack
LXORD-ZRHFDinner
LXZRH-TLVYDinner
SNBRU-VCEJBreakfast
SNTLV-BRUJDinner
SNTLV-BRUJBreakfast
TPJFK-LISYDin/Break
TPLIS-JFKYDinner



United Airlines
USA-Australia routes (economy): Koshair, O-U, Hamotzi, CS.
USA-Sydney  (First): Regal - meat and chicken meals.
Australia-USA routes (economy): Lewis Continental, K-A, Hamotzi, CY.
LH EWR-FRA Y Regal Chicken
LH MUC-EWR Y Sohar Hot meat meal and cold sandwich
LH FRA-VIE C Sohar Cold Meal (fish)
OS VIE TLV C VIE Local Co (hechser Rabbi Schwartz) Hot
US TLV PHL C Hamasbia
UA(CO) EWR-TLV Y Regal Beef meal (2010)
SA JNB-CPT-JNB Y Hot Meal from Joburg Beth Din
MN(BA) JNB-VFA Meal from Joburg Beth Din
SQ JFK-FRA Suites very poor Borenstein meal, labeled business class, chicken, no real dishes, very little food.
EK SYD-AKL  F    Lewis, no hot meal.
NZ AKL-LAX  Y    Gray's deli, fish meal.
TK CPT-IST  J/Y    Norries Caterers - CPT Beth Din - Milk Snack (Sandwich & Muffin CPT-JNB leg) Meat Dinner, Milk breakfast
« Last edited by zow on Yesterday at 02:37:01 PM »

Author Topic: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread  (Read 192143 times)

Online ExGingi

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1965 on: January 21, 2019, 01:31:04 PM »
He quoted the IB one, who's website says this:
"All of our products are being carried out under the supervision of the orthodox rabbi of Lugano (Switzerland) Rabbi Ben Zion Rabinowitz"
Correct. I did inquire about the IB KSML ex-MAD.

Thank you for posting the information.

I found their certificate and posted it on a Kashrus whatsapp group to inquire. So far only response was (if you read the certificate you'll see what he means: "A hechsher on the people instead of on the products 🤣"
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline mikebg

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1966 on: January 21, 2019, 02:31:20 PM »
I found their certificate and posted it on a Kashrus whatsapp group to inquire. So far only response was (if you read the certificate you'll see what he means: "A hechsher on the people instead of on the products 🤣"
I think that only applies to the English text. The Hebrew text is quite explicit about the kashrus standard of their products.

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1967 on: January 21, 2019, 02:49:07 PM »
I think that only applies to the English text. The Hebrew text is quite explicit about the kashrus standard of their products.
Calling the Hebrew text "explicit" about the kashrus standard is a stretch IMHO, though it does also mention mashgichim and states that it is למהדרין מן המהדרין as opposed to only Mehadrin in English...
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline moish

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1968 on: January 21, 2019, 03:02:58 PM »
Anyone ever have Emunah catering out of LAX?

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1969 on: January 22, 2019, 09:38:54 AM »
Correct. I did inquire about the IB KSML ex-MAD.

Thank you for posting the information.

I found their certificate and posted it on a Kashrus whatsapp group to inquire. So far only response was (if you read the certificate you'll see what he means: "A hechsher on the people instead of on the products 🤣"
Someone on a Kashrus whatsapp group I am on just visited the operation, and his initial report is that it is not recommended. Two issues mentioned were meat from an unrecognized certifier, and lack of procedural oversight.

So is that explicitly Mehadrin, or מהדרין מן המהדרין?
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1970 on: January 22, 2019, 09:43:56 AM »
Someone on a Kashrus whatsapp group I am on just visited the operation, and his initial report is that it is not recommended. Two issues mentioned were meat from an unrecognized certifier, and lack of procedural oversight.

So is that explicitly Mehadrin, or מהדרין מן המהדרין?
Ouch. Thanks for the tip. Is that all they serve ex-MAD?
(Quit) pulling out the flowers, and watering the weeds. -Peter Lynch

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1971 on: January 22, 2019, 09:51:52 AM »
Ouch. Thanks for the tip. Is that all they serve ex-MAD?
How should I know. Wasn't it you who posted the pictures? I will find out (possibly) in about two weeks.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1972 on: January 22, 2019, 09:55:10 AM »
How should I know. Wasn't it you who posted the pictures? I will find out (possibly) in about two weeks.
Was just trying to figure out, cuz I have some more flights booked with them.
(Quit) pulling out the flowers, and watering the weeds. -Peter Lynch

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1973 on: January 22, 2019, 09:56:05 AM »
Calling the Hebrew text "explicit" about the kashrus standard is a stretch IMHO, though it does also mention mashgichim and states that it is למהדרין מן המהדרין as opposed to only Mehadrin in English...

Report did indicate that there is a "משגיח תמידי" there. However that משגיח was more like a נאמן כשרות, someone to make sure that things are what they are supposed to be, but not someone really experienced and knowledgable to be able to call some shots when needed.

What raised my suspicion was that an operation in Milan, where there is a globally recognized Kashrus organization (Rabbis Garelik and Hazan), would go to Lugano (which is not that far away, but across a border) for a Hechsher.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline aygart

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1974 on: January 22, 2019, 11:03:30 AM »
Report did indicate that there is a "משגיח תמידי" there. However that משגיח was more like a נאמן כשרות, someone to make sure that things are what they are supposed to be, but not someone really experienced and knowledgable to be able to call some shots when needed.

What raised my suspicion was that an operation in Milan, where there is a globally recognized Kashrus organization (Rabbis Garelik and Hazan), would go to Lugano (which is not that far away, but across a border) for a Hechsher.
With an 84 year old Rav Hamachshir living in Jerusalem most of the time.

My contact for european hechsherim told me that it really depends on who is the real administrator and that information has not been very forthcoming.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1975 on: January 22, 2019, 12:33:32 PM »
With an 84 year old Rav Hamachshir living in Jerusalem most of the time.

My contact for european hechsherim told me that it really depends on who is the real administrator and that information has not been very forthcoming.

Yes. After I posted I meant to go back and put a qualifier on the Lugano location, to indicate that it can barely even be considered from Lugano.

Are you implying age discrimination?  ;)

I really hope this raises some awareness to the hollow marketing terms "Mehadrin" and "מהדרין מן המהדרין". Whenever I see those (especially if they come without some substantial claim of standards such as PY, CY, etc.), I get suspicious, and I wish that so would many others.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1976 on: January 23, 2019, 12:58:17 AM »
Sorry if this has already been posted, but had trouble finding...

Any info on AIr Canada ex yyz to Tlv and ex Tlv to yyz in J ?

Thanks

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1977 on: January 23, 2019, 01:10:10 AM »
Anyone know if QR offers ksml ex JFK? I seem to remember seeing they do offer however an online rep claims they dont offer

Offline mikebg

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1978 on: January 23, 2019, 03:58:20 AM »
What raised my suspicion was that an operation in Milan, where there is a globally recognized Kashrus organization (Rabbis Garelik and Hazan), would go to Lugano (which is not that far away, but across a border) for a Hechsher.
A lot has got to do with "kashrus marketing". I'll give an example: Carmel wines in Israel are under Rav Rubin's hechsher. However, those sold in the UK (maybe elsewhere as well) are under the round chug chasam sofer hechsher. There is only one production, all under Rav Rubin's hechsher, which is undoubtedly in the top league of kashrus, way ahead of the round chug hechsher. So why do the export bottles have a different hechsher? Because it had been perceived by Carmel Wines that it was more well known outside Israel (I believe it may have changed recently though).

Likewise, outside the small group who know a lot abot kashrus, the "Biale Rebbe of Lugano" makes a much bigger impression on the "chareidi man in the street" than Rav Garelik/Hazan in Milan.

I know that in the USA if one were to be objective the OU is probably the best kashrus around, but still loads of chareidim go looking for fancy looking symbols with names of rabbonim which are usually very long and difficult to pronounce ... (and who often subcontract to the OU anyway ...).

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Re: KSML (Kosher Airline Meals) Master Thread
« Reply #1979 on: January 23, 2019, 08:21:21 AM »



I know that in the USA if one were to be objective the OU is probably the best kashrus around, but still loads of chareidim go looking for fancy looking symbols with names of rabbonim which are usually very long and difficult to pronounce ... (and who often subcontract to the OU anyway ...).
Definitely what the OU wants you to think. Kashrus marketing.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.