NHL Master Thread

[yuneeq]

If a player does not have the guarantee attitude I would not want them playing for me.

No one on the Rangers had that attitude and that worked out well for them.
OTOH, I thought Ovechkin was extremely cocky for making such a guarantee.
His team just blew a 3-1 series lead, he was pointless in 4 straight games, and he pretends like he could just will the team to a win, when historically he's a big failure in big games.

You know when Messier made his famous guarantee, he actually scored a hat trick to seal it.

[Got a clue]

No one on the Rangers had that attitude and that worked out well for them.
OTOH, I thought Ovechkin was extremely cocky for making such a guarantee.
His team just blew a 3-1 series lead, he was pointless in 4 straight games, and he pretends like he could just will the team to a win, when historically he's a big failure in big games.

You know when Messier made his famous guarantee, he actually scored a hat trick to seal it.

Ovi did come out playing like a monster though.. To be honest, I thought they were gonna score in OT off a scramble- they def had more chances in the extra session due to the long change

[springles]

that game was unbelievable, cant beat a game 7 ot win at home.  MSG was rocking (other than for a few brief minutes after ovi's goal which is to be expected).  Lots of interesting story lines for NYR-TB. 
Really annoying that 4 out of 7 games are on shabbos or yom tov

[springles]

No one on the Rangers had that attitude and that worked out well for them.
OTOH, I thought Ovechkin was extremely cocky for making such a guarantee.
His team just blew a 3-1 series lead, he was pointless in 4 straight games, and he pretends like he could just will the team to a win, when historically he's a big failure in big games.

You know when Messier made his famous guarantee, he actually scored a hat trick to seal it.

The difference between winning and losing...
If Caps win last night then ovi's guarantee is just as big as messier's.  He came out and played great early and got the goal.  Afterward the rangers defense mostly shut him down but you arent going to get many hat tricks against Hank.  And to be fair Messier's 3rd was an empty netter that he would never have even attempted had there not been a penalty. 

[yuneeq]

The difference between winning and losing...
If Caps win last night then ovi's guarantee is just as big as messier's.  He came out and played great early and got the goal.  Afterward the rangers defense mostly shut him down but you arent going to get many hat tricks against Hank.  And to be fair Messier's 3rd was an empty netter that he would never have even attempted had there not been a penalty.

That's exactly the point.
You don't make guarantees against the best game 7 goalie in history.
It's not ovis fault for not winning, but guaranteeing a win was pretty stupid.
Kinda like how he was an idiot for chirping "all series long, all series long!" And then going a 4 game pointless streak.

[springles]

That's exactly the point.
You don't make guarantees against the best game 7 goalie in history.
It's not ovis fault for not winning, but guaranteeing a win was pretty stupid.
Kinda like how he was an idiot for chirping "all series long, all series long!" And then going a 4 game pointless streak.

so then why wasnt messier's guarantee stupid?  The only reason was that he won.  And in hockey there are many times when you do everything you can but your team loses.  I want my team to be confident that they can win, i honestly dont care if they verbalize that confidence to the media or not.  I dont think that girardi was playing defense and said "oh, ovechkin guaranteed a win, let me try extra hard now to stop him."  The guarantee doesnt change anything on the ice. 

[judahk88]

so then why wasnt messier's guarantee stupid?  The only reason was that he won.  And in hockey there are many times when you do everything you can but your team loses.  I want my team to be confident that they can win, i honestly dont care if they verbalize that confidence to the media or not.  I dont think that girardi was playing defense and said "oh, ovechkin guaranteed a win, let me try extra hard now to stop him."  The guarantee doesnt change anything on the ice.

Of course it does.

[ChaimMoskowitz]

Some of these posts are just to funny. You would think some of you never watched hockey in your life and only go by stats. 

[yuneeq]

so then why wasnt messier's guarantee stupid?  The only reason was that he won.  And in hockey there are many times when you do everything you can but your team loses.  I want my team to be confident that they can win, i honestly dont care if they verbalize that confidence to the media or not.  I dont think that girardi was playing defense and said "oh, ovechkin guaranteed a win, let me try extra hard now to stop him."  The guarantee doesnt change anything on the ice.

When Messier made his guarantee, the Rangers were behind, not in middle of collapsing like the Caps.
Messier was able to score his way to the win, netting 3 goals.
He also was a proven winner with 4 or 5 rings at the time.
And it was in an era when goals were easily scored, where one of the best players of all time could nearly score at will.

And it was vs an unproven rookie goalie.

Eta: In modern hockey the best players in the league can't guarantee anything. The teams are too even and the scoring is way down. Wow so Ovi, scored a goal? That's called being dominant nowadays, and that doesn't guarantee you win games. Back in the day if Gretzky, Lemuiex, or Messier made a guarantee, that would one of the few situations where making a guarantee is acceptable for me and not just a distraction.

[springles]

Of course it does.

what does it change? Do the players try harder because they made a guarantee? Does the other team play harder? If so then I would have an issue with their effort without the guarantee.  In a game 7 of the playoffs there should not be the need for extra motivation. 

[yuneeq]

Some of these posts are just to funny. You would think some of you never watched hockey in your life and only go by stats. 

I haven't seen any stats posts since my useless stats about Lundqvist repeatedly being a monster in Game 7s. But yeah, stats mean nothing.
Same reason why I don't like having proven 50 goal scorers on my team, because #statsareuseless

[springles]

When Messier made his guarantee, the Rangers were behind, not in middle of collapsing like the Caps.
Messier was able to score his way to the win, netting 3 goals.
He also was a proven winner with 4 or 5 rings at the time.
And it was in an era when goals were easily scored, where one of the best players of all time could nearly score at will.

And it was vs an unproven rookie goalie.

Eta: In modern hockey the best players in the league can't guarantee anything. The teams are too even and the scoring is way down. Wow so Ovi, scored a goal? That's called being dominant nowadays, and that doesn't guarantee you win games. Back in the day if Gretzky, Lemuiex, or Messier made a guarantee, that would one of the few situations where making a guarantee is acceptable for me and not just a distraction.

I dont really disagree with this.  Its a different game with less scoring.  But thats part of my point in that ovechkin's goal is not all that different from messier's hat trick (to me that 3rd goal wasnt a case of him stepping up to fulfill his guarantee although it certainly adds to the legacy of his guarantee).  If caps win then the story in Washington is about how Ovechkin backed up his guarantee with the goal and no one looks at the guarantee as stupid. 

[springles]

Some of these posts are just to funny. You would think some of you never watched hockey in your life and only go by stats. 

what posts in particular?

[ChaimMoskowitz]

what posts in particular?

About goalies. They are just to funny. You would think nobody is playing defense.

Look at what the Hawks did to two out of three best goalies this year. Maybe the Hawks forgot to read their stats. 

[skyguy918]

If a player does not have the guarantee attitude I would not want them playing for me.

so then why wasnt messier's guarantee stupid?  The only reason was that he won.  And in hockey there are many times when you do everything you can but your team loses.  I want my team to be confident that they can win, i honestly dont care if they verbalize that confidence to the media or not.  I dont think that girardi was playing defense and said "oh, ovechkin guaranteed a win, let me try extra hard now to stop him."  The guarantee doesnt change anything on the ice. 

I guess I fall somewhere in between here. Do I want players to have a really confident attitude? Of course. But as far as the quote I bolded above, do I want them expressing it in the media? Absolutely not.

[Yehuda57]

About goalies. They are just to funny. You would think nobody is playing defense.

Look at what the Hawks did to two out of three best goalies this year. Maybe the Hawks forgot to read their stats. 

You want cool stats? Here is a cool "stat:"

5/13/13: Henrik 35 saves, Rangers win Game 7
5/13/14: Henrik 35 saves, Rangers win Game 7
5/13/15: Henrik 35 saves, Rangers win Game 7

What does that stat tell you how about how good Henrik is? Very little. But it's still fun.

[ChaimMoskowitz]

What does that stat tell you how about how good Henrik is? Very little. But it's still fun.

I like fun so lets have some. How many game 7 Cup finals has he won? So if I understand correctly if they would of made it to game 7 last year he would have won it? Maybe someone should have let him known that when you suck in first five games you won't make it to game seven. 

[Got a clue]

I like fun so lets have some. How many game 7 Cup finals has he won? So if I understand correctly if they would of made it to game 7 last year he would have won it? Maybe someone should have let him known that when you suck in first five games you won't make it to game seven. 

Wait so Henrick sucked in the finals last year?? Last I checked we lost 3 games in OT with a lot of bad puck luck/calls going against us

[ChaimMoskowitz]

Wait so Henrick sucked in the finals last year?? Last I checked we lost 3 games in OT with a lot of bad puck luck/calls going against us

We have a winner! 

[Got a clue]

We have a winner! 

Yes really sucky indeed..