NHL Master Thread

[CS91]

So the Las Vegas expansion is official according to the AP.

When will their first season be? 17-18?

[JT27MP]

Past 2 seasons he was fine in the playoffs, and he was injured much the season this year.
He had 42 goals the previous season I highly doubt he will have another bad season this year.

And yeah, you sound like the typical guy who thinks he's a worthless scrub.

And you make him sound like Wayne Gretzky.

You can sugar coat it as much as you want, this guy is not a good playoff performer, and isn't earning his salary.
Even at $6M its a risk.

But you did mention that if he could go into the same situation as Phil Kessel, it would be ideal.
That could work for Nash.

[CS91]

Wow. I feel like my heart has been ripped out. I'll never forgive you, Bergevin. You're dead to me.

[yuneeq]

Quite possibly the wildest, craziest half hour in league history.

Taylor Hall for Adam Larsson straight up, possibly the worst trade in league history.
Only to be instantly challenged to the title by:
PK Subban getting traded for Shea Weber straight up.

Then Steven Stamkos, the biggest UFA in at least the past decade, gets signed for 8 years to Tampa.

[Got a clue]

Quite possibly the wildest, craziest half hour in league history.

Taylor Hall for Adam Larsson straight up, possibly the worst trade in league history.
Only to be instantly challenged to the title by:
PK Subban getting traded for Shea Weber straight up.

Then Steven Stamkos, the biggest UFA in at least the past decade, gets signed for 8 years to Tampa.

Hall for Larson is unthinkable. I think Subban Weber will be good for both teams

[yuneeq]

Hall for Larson is unthinkable. I think Subban Weber will be good for both teams

Subban is superior right now and still in his prime vs a declining 31 y/o Weber signed for another 10 years at $7.85m. There is literally no way to explain away a trade that sends a better, younger player on a better contract without adding anything else in return.

[Got a clue]

Webber brings much needed leadership

[yuneeq]

Webber brings much needed leadership

Oh my don't you love it when people argue about intangibles?
Especially when the guy they traded away brings those same leadership skills and is a very well liked player (off the ice).
The only leadership change the Habs need is behind the bench and in the front office.

[yuneeq]

Funny thing is that Hall for Subban and Weber for Larsson would be much better trades for the Oilers and Canadiens,
and probably could've been arranged if they picked up the phone.

[CS91]

Subban is superior right now and still in his prime vs a declining 31 y/o Weber signed for another 10 years at $7.85m. There is literally no way to explain away a trade that sends a better, younger player on a better contract without adding anything else in return.

I have no idea how any person with literally anything but air in between his two ears thinks it's a good idea to take on a contract that will last until a player is 41 with an annual cap hit of $7.85mm. Habs got fleeced.

Besides for the fact that this was a terrible hockey trade, it's beyond me how the Canadiens organization can turn their back on the most loved player in the city and someone who has given so much to the community. So he didn't get along with Therrien and Pacioretty? Therrien shouldn't even be employed, and honestly, if Pacioretty really didn't like Subban, then he can go screw himself because I would take PK over him any day.

[JTZ]

Subban is superior right now and still in his prime vs a declining 31 y/o Weber signed for another 10 years at $7.85m. There is literally no way to explain away a trade that sends a better, younger player on a better contract without adding anything else in return.

Not going to agree with the superior part. If I had to pick one for just next year hands down it would be Weber.

[yuneeq]

Not going to agree with the superior part. If I had to pick one for just next year hands down it would be Weber.

So the guy who scores more, drives more possession, and suppresses more shots, is worse right now than the player who almost singlehandedly lost game 7 in the most embarrassing fashion?

Just take a look at the numbers, they don't lie:

http://www.habseyesontheprize.com/2016/6/30/12064258/Pk-subban-shea-weber-trade-montreal-canadiens-nashville-predators-analysis-still-bad

The decline of Weber (from January): http://www.tsn.ca/preds-traded-wrong-defenceman-1.419461

[CS91]

So the guy who scores more, drives more possession, and suppresses more shots, is worse right now than the player who almost singlehandedly lost game 7 in the most embarrassing fashion?

Just take a look at the numbers, they don't lie:

http://www.habseyesontheprize.com/2016/6/30/12064258/Pk-subban-shea-weber-trade-montreal-canadiens-nashville-predators-analysis-still-bad

The decline of Weber (from January): http://www.tsn.ca/preds-traded-wrong-defenceman-1.419461

+1
And I'd argue that Weber's numbers for last season would be worse if not for the fact that he was paired up with Josi.

[JTZ]

So the guy who scores more, drives more possession, and suppresses more shots, is worse right now than the player who almost singlehandedly lost game 7 in the most embarrassing fashion?

You can play with the numbers all you want. I have watched both of them play a lot. Weber is a clone of Duncan Keith and would not trade Keith for two Subbans. Subban leaves his defense out to dry on a lot of his rushes. Not what I want in a defenseman.

Also don't make the mistake on judging a guy on one game. Brower (Blues) had a great playoffs (except Hawks series) and will be rewarded for it. The problem is anyone that gets him will be getting the regular season Brower and not the fluke playoff Brower.   

[JTZ]

And I'd argue that Weber's numbers for last season would be worse if not for the fact that he was paired up with Josi.

So we should expect Subbans numbers to go way up this year? What if they don't?

[yuneeq]

So we should expect Subbans numbers to go way up this year? What if they don't?

If Subban's numbers stay the same he will still have a better year than Weber.
There were signs about Weber slowing down before that disastrous playoff game.
Reminded me of Girardi's unsurprisingly bad playoff game against the Pens.

Weber is no Duncan Keith at all. Keith is a far better playmaker, Weber is a better shooter.
I've been reading comments from Preds fans all year long about how Weber is not as good as he used to be and that Josi is clearly better.

Never mind your ridiculous comments about Subban leaving the defense out to dry.
Great defenseman like Subban, Doughty, Karlsson, and Keith know when to pinch on offense, that doesn't make them bad players, it's a calculated risk that has a net benefit.

So yeah if they get caught in a rush every once in a while, that's the trade off for getting consistently better chances.

[JTZ]

Not sure you will see Keith pinch unless they are down late. Also I can't remember the last shot he blocked.

With Subban I am not talking about pinching. I am talking about the rushes he makes. Maybe they should make him a forward. 

Weber looked tired in the playoffs. Age or just to much ice time? We shall find out.

[yuneeq]

Weber looked tired in the playoffs. Age or just to much ice time? We shall find out.

Just take one look at the Preds defense corps and you'll know it's age.
Josi, Ekholm, Ellis, Weber are all fine players where Weber doesn't need to singlehandedly take over like Keith.

[CS91]

So we should expect Subbans numbers to go way up this year? What if they don't?

They will. You can take it to the bank. This trade will haunt the Canadiens for years. It's Chris Chelios v2.0. Guarantee that PK lifts the cup before the Canadiens do, and he'll be a BIG reason why his team won.

Side Point – If we don't see a MAJOR change in Pacioretty's attitude and leadership, I think the fanbase will be even more infuriated (if that's even possible).

[JTZ]

They will. You can take it to the bank. This trade will haunt the Canadiens for years.

OK I hear ya. Can we get you on record what it means if his numbers don't go up or G-d forbid go down?