Author Topic: Olam Haba For Sale  (Read 38918 times)

Offline real-brisker

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #120 on: November 01, 2013, 10:55:29 AM »

Offline Moshe123

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #121 on: November 01, 2013, 11:30:31 AM »

Offline chaimmayer

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #122 on: November 01, 2013, 12:09:46 PM »
I one heard r' berel wein say that you can never have the זכור of Shabbos without the שמור and vice versa.
If you try like the reform to have just the geshmake parts of Shabbos without any thou shal nots it won't last.
Also if someone tries to keep the שמור and has no appreciation for the זכור then for him Shabbos isn't geshmak, it's a prison.
Very true!

Offline AJK

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #123 on: November 01, 2013, 12:28:44 PM »
How does the second line jive with af al pi shelo lishma, shemitoch shelo lishma, bah lishma?
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Offline Centro

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #124 on: November 01, 2013, 12:43:36 PM »
How does the second line jive with af al pi shelo lishma, shemitoch shelo lishma, bah lishma?
Not with an opposite intention.

Offline AJK

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #125 on: November 01, 2013, 01:36:14 PM »
Who said anything about opposite intention?

Also if someone tries to keep the שמור and has no appreciation for the זכור then for him Shabbos isn't geshmak, it's a prison.
2015: 116K bkd | 1.6M brnd | F: OZ,NH,AA,EK | J: UA,CA,TK,DL,TN,AF,VA | LIH,NRT,ROR,PEK,CNS,BOB,MEL,TLV & Pacific Hopper

Offline Moishebatchy

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #126 on: November 02, 2013, 11:46:34 AM »
Who said anything about opposite intention?

I guess that line can be amended somewhat to say that "someone who actively resents Shabbos", as opposed to just not appreciating the beauty of it, lives in a prison.

Offline Mocha

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #127 on: November 02, 2013, 11:54:35 PM »
It's only Berel Wein, I wish that was the only question I had on his droshos... :-X
Wth is that supposed to mean?

Offline yuneeq

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #128 on: November 02, 2013, 11:59:32 PM »
@AJK One thing has nothing to do with the next. Even if he will eventually be lishma later on, right now his lack of appreciation kills his enjoyment of shabbos.
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Offline elikay

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #129 on: November 03, 2013, 12:06:45 AM »
How does the second line jive with af al pi shelo lishma, shemitoch shelo lishma, bah lishma?
CMIIW but I think that is specifically about Talmud Torah.

Offline jj1000

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #130 on: November 03, 2013, 12:15:18 AM »
Wth is that supposed to mean?
haha
CMIIW but I think that is specifically about Talmud Torah.
I'll correct you it is for Torah and mitzvos see Pesachim 50b.

I wonder if your schooling stressed limud Torah a lot and that's why you thought it was only about Torah.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2013, 12:18:38 AM by jj1000 »
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Offline Galitzyaner

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #131 on: November 03, 2013, 12:19:32 AM »

Offline meshugener

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #132 on: November 03, 2013, 12:35:08 AM »
I didn't think it was funny at all.
I need to learn you a lesson in respecting gedolim/robbonim.
Too much lately from you, galitz.

Nothing personal I hope. If yes let me know so we can go nuclear.
Love me or hate me. I still love you.

Offline jj1000

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #133 on: November 03, 2013, 12:38:16 AM »
What's so funny?!
I didn't think it was funny at all.
I need to learn you a lesson in respecting gedolim/robbonim.
Too much lately from you, galitz.

Nothing personal I hope. If yes let me know so we can go nuclear.
This is what's funny.

There are some gedolim that some of us look at with reverence and respect while others think they are terriblepeople serving an agenda.

I think it's sad, but it is a reality so I choose to take it with jest when I see a heated conversation brewing.
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Offline Galitzyaner

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #134 on: November 03, 2013, 12:45:47 AM »
I didn't think it was funny at all.
I need to learn you a lesson in respecting gedolim/robbonim.
??? Need to learn me a lesson??  English please?!
Nothing personal I hope. If yes let me know so we can go nuclear.
What do you mean by that?
This is what's funny.

There are some gedolim that some of us look at with reverence and respect while others think they are terriblepeople serving an agenda.

I think it's sad, but it is a reality so I choose to take it with jest when I see a heated conversation brewing.
So Berel Wein became a gadol? Really?! :o
I don't think any one of them are "terrible" people ch"v.

Offline Menachem613

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #135 on: November 03, 2013, 12:50:49 AM »
Subscribed. 

Offline elikay

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #136 on: November 03, 2013, 01:12:24 AM »
I wonder if your schooling stressed limud Torah a lot and that's why you thought it was only about Torah.
Thanks :)
I actually seemed to remember that it applied to both. I remember a pshat which seemingly applies to Talmud Torah, hence my "CIIMW".

Offline hocker

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #137 on: November 03, 2013, 02:56:04 AM »
I wonder if your schooling stressed limud Torah a lot and that's why you thought it was only about Torah.
מוחה!

Offline chaimmayer

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #138 on: November 03, 2013, 03:10:50 PM »
How does the second line jive with af al pi shelo lishma, shemitoch shelo lishma, bah lishma?
I don't know the answer to that but I think he was speaking in the short term like our friend in the article i.e. someone who is trying to keep the shabbos but has no appreciation for it.  Yes in the long term it may bring him to even enjoy it but in the short term it is torture.
(Someone told me on shabbos that he knows someone who says that they are not shomer shabbos but they are zocher shabbos :o.)

CMIIW but I think that is specifically about Talmud Torah.
The gemara that JJ1000 quoted does mention specifically torah and motzvos but the rambam in hilchos talmud torah 3:5 and again in hilchos teshuva 10:5 only mentions torah and not mitzvos.
I actually seemed to remember that it applied to both. I remember a pshat which seemingly applies to Talmud Torah, hence my "CIIMW".
Correct!
In the famous introduction of the eglai tal - where he writes that Torah is meant to be learnt with a geshmak and if you don't you are missing an integral part of the mitzvah- he makes a pshetal out of the fact that the Rambam only mentions torah nad not other mitzvos.

Offline good sam

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Re: Olam Haba For Sale
« Reply #139 on: November 03, 2013, 07:48:48 PM »
Dude is in this video @3:12

[ Invalid YouTube link ]
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