Poll

A Poll to decide if a poll should be taken.

Yes, we should take a poll to see people's opinion on TC.
8 (16.3%)
No, we should not take a poll to see people's opinion on TC.
7 (14.3%)
I never vote in polls.
5 (10.2%)
Maybe we should first take a poll to determine if this poll should be taken.
29 (59.2%)

Total Members Voted: 49

Author Topic: Tent City Lakewood  (Read 67367 times)

Offline Baruch

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #260 on: June 06, 2014, 11:23:20 AM »
Pretty sure that would work against you...
lol

Offline Alex Libman

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #261 on: June 08, 2014, 02:26:43 PM »
This reply is brought to you by...

Wednesday's Tent City Photo Album - Bulldozer Bullies, Police Harassment, and the Rally Against Injustice At Tent City:



And this video from Wed, made by our friends at CopBlock:




Hey libman, let me tell you a little secret. We don't mind "wasting" our tax money to get you and the rest of tent city out of here! I am so happy that's what it's being used for.

Who's "we"?  Are you a monarch using the royal pronoun, or do you have a delusion that everyone who pays taxes agrees with you?

I'm a fan of logical optimization for performance, so let's start with the most obvious: your "we" doesn't include me.  I'm a tax resister, but I still inevitably pay some taxes when I want to buy healthy food, or when I occasionally buy booze, etc.  (I know, I should grow my own greenhouse kale, catch / farm my own fish, and distill my own moonshine - someday I will...)  Homeless people do pay taxes - sales tax, sin taxes, corporate tax and all the other taxes built into everything you buy, gasoline tax for our generators, etc, etc, etc.  Many Tent City residents were once middle class, and I can think of several who were (multi)millionaires - and of course they've paid plenty of taxes then.  And many people who are middle class or even millionaires today may end up in a Tent City someday - I am fighting for their benefit as well.

Your "we" doesn't include a lot of other people too.  According to a recent poll, only a small minority of NJ residents want TC bulldozed!  And I would venture that many in that minority are not thinking for themselves, but are a part of that moocher voting block that is out to get us, so they could get this land in yet another crony land deal that Lakewood is becoming famous for.  Our NGO was actually offered ownership of this land before the said voting block interfered.

Of course the Township Committee has been swearing on every Torah in Lakewood that this land is an "environmentally protected no-cut zone", and will remain undeveloped...  We all know that's a lie - this land will be given to political cronies, trees will be cut down, and another taxpayer-supported boondoggle will be built, reminiscent of the neighboring Blueclaws Stadium...

Our mathematically illiterate Deputy Mayor was just quoted as saying that "residents are upset because their taxes keep going up".  This also debunks your claim, and he is of course absolutely backwards about the financial consequences.  Gee, let's bulldoze a private charity that helps the homeless without using taxpayer money, put a few homeless in motel rooms for propaganda value, and throw the rest out onto the streets - that'll lower the taxes!  Fact: bulldozing TC will hurt taxpayers on every level!

Because of the bulldozing plans, Ocean County Superior Court has ordered Lakewood to provide "one year free housing" for 122 people on the 2013-05-01 census - a small subset of the current and future homeless who would be affected by Tent City's destruction.  Only myself and at most a handful other people on that census have refused housing on principle.  That is at very least $1,500,000 million in rent costs alone, but you know how much government inefficiency and waste will inevitably be involved.  Most of these bums can't pay utility bills, so that's extra.  Etc, etc, etc.  Lakewood has largely reneged on this contractual obligation - there will be lawsuits about this, and Lakewood will probably end up paying more as the result.  But that's only the prelude.

It will then cost the government millions of dollars to enforce the unconstitutional anti-homeless laws in light of the upcoming civil disobedience and court battles.  Such laws have been successfully overturned in other cities, and they didn't have a dedicated libertarian political / legal / media machine that I am now devoted to building in Lakewood.  I put up a $50 tent, perhaps in the middle of Town Square, and they'll spend $50,000 bulldozing me, arresting me, fighting me in court, etc.  Then: rinse, repeat.  And it won't be just me: I'm building a BIG TENT coalition, with co-belligerents from both "right" and "left" joining this libertarian cause.  Yes, this is vengeance - if bulldozing Tent Cities is easy, then more Tent Cities will get bulldozed.  By the time the Lakewood Tent Party is through, the government will very seriously regret bulldozing Tent City, and no other town will want to make the same mistake again!

And even all this is merely the tip of a MUCH bigger iceberg of the financial consequences of bulldozing Tent Cities - the natural economic consequences of more homeless people now also being tentless will be very severe.  Municipal governments will pay for more people sleeping in the streets without access to shower or portajohns, more homeless hanging out at the library all day, more "crimes of desperation", more trespassing, more forest fires for lack of sober oversight and fire extinguishers, declining property values, etc, etc, etc.  County, State, and Federal governments will pay for higher hospital costs from people living on the streets without tents, etc, etc, etc.

Tent Cities and letting homeless NGO's homestead remote plots of so-called "public land" is the only viable solution to the growing economic problem.  Stupid, handicapped, and dysfunctional people will always be among us, and the market value of mindless labor will only continue to decline - the minimal cost of living needs to decline with it, with voluntary charity and mutual aid helping to fill the gap.

NJ already ranks as one of the worst states in overall freedom, tax competitiveness, property taxes, government credit rating, etc.

NJ is like a star athlete with good genes who smokes and drinks heavily, but is still able to perform well - for a while...  NJ has a lot of "old money" momentum, benefits of population density, being in between two major global Alpha Cities, etc.  But these benefits are starting to run out.  Benefits of the Internet, virtual reality, delivery drones, self-driving cars and other transportation innovations, etc are gradually making big cities obsolete.  More and more businesses, brains, investment capital, and jobs are leaving!

These jobs are going to places like India, where there are fewer government laws against cheap living.  And, if they're staying in this country, those jobs are going to places like Texas, which have a bit more economic freedom, lower taxes, and where they embrace innovative cost-cutting ideas like ours!

Bulldozing Tent City is a stupid move that NJ cannot afford to make!  They should recognize our Homesteading Rights, so that our NGO could sell this land and buy land for a homeless camp somewhere else.


And all this garbage how it's not detrimental to my neighborhood, it's a load of bull!

Again:



The burden of proof remains on you.


I'm breathing your bonfires or whatever is going on there a whole winter. Please pack your crap up and move out!

I've repeatedly said that complaints about smoke are as close as Tent City haters come to a coherent argument (even though no scientific evidence of harm was yet presented).  I've taken this so seriously that I've tried to go that past winter without heat, like Rev Steve Brigham does, but I got sick around mid-December and had to use a propane heater until mid-March. 

Propane is what we've been using from the beginning, but then the government ordered us to switch to wood-burning stoves, which is where all the smoke was coming from.  In November 2013 they tried to ban wood-burning stoves, giving us no advance warning, but we didn't have the funds to make the switch back to propane.  They were putting people's lives in serious danger, and the Ocean County Superior Court put a restraining order on Lakewood to prevent them from harassing us.

Had the government been acting in good faith instead of sabotaging us, we could have solved the smoke problem a long time ago!

Offline Alex Libman

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #262 on: June 08, 2014, 06:43:34 PM »
This reply is brought to you by...

Thursday's Tent City Photo Album - Bulldozer Bullies, Police Harassment, and the Rally Against Injustice At Tent City:




What someone will do to live for a cause. You're interesting and probably a little cooky, but i admire your persistence.

I have other interesting things I could be doing with my life: software development, academics, entrepreneurship, etc.  But libertarian philosophy and activism has made everything else seem meaningless in comparison.

What's the point of making money if you are merely a slave on a plantation, keeping only a fraction of what you make and the Powers That Be can take the rest too if you disobey them...  What's the point of contributing to scientific and technological progress if your contributions will be used toward ends that abhor you...

A life of reason, virtue, and courage is the greatest accomplishment that I can imagine.


But is your long term goal to have allot of such tent city's nation wide?

My long-term goal is immortality and conquest of the universe through science.  But first thing's first.  Unless humanity abandons the delusion of centralized government, it may fall into a high-tech Big Brother dystopia from which it may never recover!

I'm at Tent City because I think this is a most important issue for libertarians.  I've focused most of my thought and activism on what many consider to be the "Achilles' heel" of a libertarian / free market capitalist society - what is to happen to the "bums" who fail to pull their economic weight. 

If there is enough voluntary charity to put everyone in a mansion with ten Cadillacs - great.  But there isn't.  The poor need to live within their means, which, as Tent City demonstrates, is not so bad.  So, yes, we need well-managed Tent Cities in every county where there is a need, competing with each-other for patronage in a free market.  That is the best solution to poverty I have found.  I do not condemn the poor to conditions in which I couldn't live myself, as over the past year I have fully demonstrated.


What is there for the poor to gain? The chance of maybe having a heater?

No one is forced to come to our Tent City.  People come here because they have no better place to go.  The Welfare State, which spends $62,000 / year per family below the poverty line, has failed them.  They say it's a heaven compared to the homeless shelter in Atlantic City, which is an over-crowded part-time prison that is far more dangerous and degrading than Tent City.  Some also appreciate being close to the Lakewood Industrial Park, Downtown Lakewood, the Bus Terminal, etc.


Seems like it would be better to use your knowledge to help these poor and downtrodden people integrate back into society using real jobs and dignity.

Exactly.  That should be our goal.  In a free market, charitable institutions such as ours would compete for donations and support on the basis of merit.  Most donors want their money to accomplish something they can be proud of, so they'll want to see a track record of rehabilitating the homeless, teaching them what "public schools" have failed to teach them, instilling discipline and self-esteem, and helping them become happy self-sufficient independent people.

Unfortunately the government is sabotaging all this, and you can see the devastating results.  Corrupt self-serving bureaucrats create zoning laws, minimum lot sizes, prohibition on multi-family buildings in single family zones, and a thousand other things that make more and more people homeless, and make it impossible for charities to provide them with basic housing.  The government is hoarding huge quantities of land, to which it has no rational claim of property but only brute force, supposedly in the name of the "public", and it's keeping the public from using it! 

There also are more direct and deliberate examples of sabotage from the Powers That Be here in Lakewood.  We call the police on a bad person who shouldn't be here, and they shake hands with him and try to evict an instead!  Minister Steve tries to evict a drug dealing trouble-maker by disabling their tent, and the Powers That Be arrest Minister Steve and frivolously drag him through the courts for over a year!  All this scares away large donors and volunteers who could have been a part of our Tent City's rehabilitation and education services.

All of my energy has gone into battling for Tent City's survival, and the same could be said of most other supporters as well.

The Welfare State is a racket that wastes money, creates complacency and resentment, and keeps people dysfunctional and poor.


In conclusion: you are NOT helping anyone.

You are entitled to your opinion.  People who choose to come to Tent City for help and stay here, and the people who voluntarily contribute to our cause may disagree.


You have a fantasy of creating a lawless camp ...

I have a fantasy of solving the problem of poverty, which is the most common remaining excuse for expansion of statist tyranny.

Any "lawlessness" at Tent City comes from the government and their refusal to recognize our Rights.  I think that, in a free marketplace, it would be rather hard to find donors for a "lawless camp".  The marketplace naturally causes bad ideas to shrink and good ideas to proliferate.  Camps that have the most effective rules will succeed.


... made up of individuals who believe in what you preach, write and advocate.

I have made no effort to convert any Tent City residents to my philosophy.  I didn't make any effort to dissuade anyone from signing up for the "one year free housing" (even though I've correctly predicted many of the problems with that deal, some of which are only beginning to play out).  I don't prevent people from holding rally signs I don't agree with.  Etc.

Imagine an isolated village in the jungle populated by savages whose culture leaves them unable to count to ten.  Imagine everyone in that village is suffering from a horrible disease that causes life-long agony and kills them in their teens, just after they pass the disease to the next generation.  At any moment the disease could escape the village and infect the rest of the world, which is what worries me.  I bring them the cure, and they all want the cure, because they can see it is working and they have no other alternatives.  Why would I insist that they understand all the science that went into making this cure?  That science is not secret, but I don't have the time to educate every single one of them, which would take many years, and may not work out at all.  Giving them the cure ASAP is far more important.


You are clearly not looking for a conversation, only to propagandize you're movement.

Yes, my argumentation skills are imperfect.  I am not a robot (yet).  I get very stressed out and depressed...  But that doesn't mean I'm not "looking for a conversation".  I come here with very firm and examined opinions, but I do have a long and well-documented history of changing my position to better reflect evidence and reason based on input from others.


Which if perhaps you weren't bothering allot of fellow jews in the process people wouldn't mind.

I am not bothering anyone or forcing anyone to do anything.  I came to this forum because Tent City was mentioned.  Letting me write here has been a very kind, constructive, and honorable voluntary allowance by this forum's owner(s), for which I am grateful.  No one is obligated to read this.  A lot of people here support the bulldozer and police aggression against me and my neighbors.  Given this opportunity, I'd like to explain why that is immoral and unjust.

You leave us alone, we'll have no reason to argue.  You are NOT "your brother's keeper", and neither are you his master or his slave.  Nothing is required from you except non-aggression.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2014, 07:07:31 PM by Alex Libman »

Offline Alex Libman

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #263 on: June 10, 2014, 04:47:13 PM »
Can anyone help translate our fliers to Hebrew / Yiddish?   ;D

(Click for PDF versions.)





Offline MarkS

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #264 on: June 10, 2014, 04:56:36 PM »
Can anyone help translate our fliers to Hebrew / Yiddish?   ;D

Try this:

אנחנו עצלנים ולא רוצים לעבוד

 מגיעים לנו לכרוע כל מקום שאנחנו רוצים
#אין מסים עבורנו

אנחנו רוצים טרמפ חינם

תנו לנו את הכסף שלך - אנחנו לא רוצים לעבוד

Offline Alex Libman

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #265 on: June 10, 2014, 05:30:23 PM »
This reply is brought to you by...

archive.today - a very easy and free service for archiving publicly accessible online content.  You should click their bookmarklet immediately after posting something on any message forum  (like this one), to retain an objective third party snapshot.  Just in case...


Try this:

אנחנו עצלנים ולא רוצים לעבוד
מגיעים לנו לכרוע כל מקום שאנחנו רוצים
אין מסים עבורנו
אנחנו רוצים טרמפ חינם
תנו לנו את הכסף שלך - אנחנו לא רוצים לעבוד
            Google Translate:

We are lazy and do not want to work.
We come to kneel anywhere we want.
No taxes for us.
We want a free ride.
Give us your money - we do not want to work.

You are confused.  You've written the motto of many other people in Lakewood, outside Tent City - those who live in HUD-funded mansions, who mooch off the taxpayers in a thousand different ways, who'd declare even a hot dog stand as a tax-exempt temple, etc, etc, etc.

The motto for Tent City should be:  We don't want the Welfare State!  Let us work and live within our means!  Government - recognize our negative Rights to Life, Liberty, and Property, and just leave us alone!
« Last Edit: June 10, 2014, 05:43:37 PM by Alex Libman »

Offline Baruch

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #266 on: June 10, 2014, 09:31:49 PM »
Can anyone help translate our fliers to Hebrew / Yiddish?   ;D

Carry a sign that says this:
"געב מיר א פאטש אויפ'ן טוחעת"

Offline Freddie

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #267 on: June 10, 2014, 09:35:35 PM »
I read your "writings". They are extremely shallow and empty. I've heard liberals and libertarians who were smart (Ron Paul, Bill Clinton) I disagree with a lot of what they say, but I enjoy the intelligence with which they speak. You, are an extremely boring , non-enlightening, teenage/immature writer. Your "writings" are what I'd expect from a High School newspaper. Earth to Libman - no one is impressed with you - no one. Go stock some shelves in a grocery store, maybe that's where your talents lie?

Is this terrible to admit? I find him to be intelligent. I think he's socially immature. Maybe that's what you really mean. But he's not dumb. He's way above average intelligence. Just my take (from the guy who told you Donald Sterling was demented before anyone else.)

 ;) :P ::)

Offline aygart

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #268 on: June 11, 2014, 12:04:18 AM »
For all the fluff about libertarianism and small government its really irrelevant to the discussion at hand. The facts are that Tent City is on land owned by an entity other than themselves. Please explain by what right it exists. The only thing you mentioned that is relevant to that is that you feel a squatter has rights. On what basis?
You seem to imply that it would be wrong for the current owner to evict you in order to sell it to a developer. Why?
You feel that you are saving the govt money. That may or may not be true, but that does not excuse stealing land. All the stuff about small govt is really only relevant after you get to first base. You didn't get there yet.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline EJB

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #269 on: June 11, 2014, 12:31:00 AM »
For all the fluff about libertarianism and small government its really irrelevant to the discussion at hand. The facts are that Tent City is on land owned by an entity other than themselves. Please explain by what right it exists. The only thing you mentioned that is relevant to that is that you feel a squatter has rights. On what basis?
You seem to imply that it would be wrong for the current owner to evict you in order to sell it to a developer. Why?
You feel that you are saving the govt money. That may or may not be true, but that does not excuse stealing land. All the stuff about small govt is really only relevant after you get to first base. You didn't get there yet.

He disagrees with the law and believes that government doesn't really own the land

Offline aygart

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #270 on: June 11, 2014, 12:50:59 AM »
He disagrees with the law and believes that government doesn't really own the land
I understand that
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline MarkS

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #271 on: June 11, 2014, 08:36:47 AM »
Huh?

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #272 on: June 11, 2014, 09:32:18 AM »
Quote
There are only 2 TC residenst in the photo- Alex Libman and Kevin – who used to be a TC resident until he was given housing. Most of the protesters in ALL the photos in the past months are actually outsiders whom the “minister” convinced to come to the protests. Most TC residenst are very glad to leave TC and they hope thye never have to return


Offline Crazy tools

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #273 on: June 11, 2014, 03:33:54 PM »
Huh?
lots of the TC pictures going around have that poster in them. and if course you have Alex Libman holding it proudly while videoing with these wires coming out of his pants. he looks like he's hooked up to a bomb.

Offline Alex Libman

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #274 on: June 11, 2014, 06:20:06 PM »
This reply is brought to you by...

Yesterday's Tent City Photo Album - March On Town Square, Day One:



Today's Tent City Photo Album - March On Town Square, Day Two:




For all the fluff about libertarianism and small government its really irrelevant to the discussion at hand.

We are all material beings - economics are always relevant.  In addition to the moral argument, I have made the economic argument for Tent City.  All insults aside, no one here was able to counter it on the basis of evidence and reason.


The facts are that Tent City is on land owned by an entity other than themselves. Please explain by what right it exists.

No, this land did not have a legitimate owner before we've homesteaded it over the past 8+ years.  The government stole this land from a private owner (now long gone) and held it unused for many decades.

The government is not a business.  It does not have Property Rights as individuals and corporations (voluntarily established groups of individuals) do.  It does not bring resources into the human economy.  It does not produce goods and services in a marketplace of voluntary transactions.  It has a monopoly on force, which is becoming ever-more difficult to justify.  If it cannot be justified, it is no more legitimate than a mafia crime boss who collects "protection money" from his victims.


The only thing you mentioned that is relevant to that is that you feel a squatter has rights. On what basis?

As I keep repeating, we are not "squatters".  We are homesteaders.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homestead_principle


You seem to imply that it would be wrong for the current owner to evict you in order to sell it to a developer. Why?

This land should be ours to sell, not the Township's.  If not for government corruption, in a freer market, it would have been developed decades ago.  Of course they claim that it's an "environmentally protected no cut zone" and always will be, but that's simply a lie.  The government can make up whatever rules it wants, to reward its cronies and punish its enemies.

Words ritualistically scribbled by self-serving legislators don't magically become "law".  Law is an empirically-understood phenomenon of nature, like the laws of physics - it is deducted, not invented by men.  There is a rational ideal system of laws (aka Natural Law / Natural Rights), whether the government recognizes them or not.  Government passing a law that 2 + 2 == 5 will not make it so!


You feel that you are saving the govt money. That may or may not be true, but that does not excuse stealing land. All the stuff about small govt is really only relevant after you get to first base. You didn't get there yet.

I deal with numbers, not "feelings".  I've explained the impact of Tent City on government spending not to justify our Property Rights (moral argument), but to explain that what we're doing is the only viable solution to a growing crisis (economic argument).

The government is men with guns who shout: "obey us for your own good".  I document the harms that government brings about, even to those bums who it bribes with hand-outs of stolen loot.


[Quoting a stupid comment from a stupid article by The Lakewood Pravda]

Quote
There are only 2 TC residenst in the photo- Alex Libman and Kevin – who used to be a TC resident until he was given housing. Most of the protesters in ALL the photos in the past months are actually outsiders whom the “minister” convinced to come to the protests. Most TC residenst are very glad to leave TC and they hope thye never have to return

Yes, the Lakewood Poop reported incorrectly on who participated in the protest and why.  We never claimed everyone marching was a resident - the Poop did.

You are being lied to by this town's government, the criminal enterprise behind this government, and its propaganda wing that is posing as an independent news source.  In reality, only a small fraction of people who were in Tent City during the "census" got the "one year free housing" - as much as a year later than promised, in a tiny overpriced motel room owned by the politicians' cronies, in the middle of nowhere, and in some cases utility bills not included.  Many will become homeless again sooner than in one year.

With what evidence do you back the claim that "most TC residents are very glad to leave TC"?  How many have you surveyed?  We deliver food every night to some of the people receiving the "one year free housing".  Getting free stuff from the government is nice of course, but it's not what they were promised, and there are strings attached.  And, as Tent City's population always naturally had a high turn-over rate, the people who were on that census are just a fraction of the people harmed by the government annihilation of Tent City.

We maintain a spreadsheet of those 122 people, and try to stay in touch with them.  When the time comes, we will publish evidence of the Lakewood government reneging on / weaseling out of its promise.  But that's just a small side-project.  The bigger battle is about the anti-homeless laws, and the even bigger battle is all about homesteading so-called "public" land...


[...] you have Alex Libman holding it proudly while videoing with these wires coming out of his pants. he looks like he's hooked up to a bomb.

Yes, I'm a funny looking fat slob in a $1 t-shirt.  That was a portable battery pack.

Offline aygart

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #275 on: June 11, 2014, 06:38:10 PM »
You are making vague claims regarding the history of the property, but your basic premise is that any government owned land is ownerless. Without that this has nothing to do with the homestead principle. I reject that premise, as presumably do most others on this forum. Without convincing anyone in that regard you well get nowhere.
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Offline Baruch

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #276 on: June 11, 2014, 07:36:18 PM »
« Last Edit: June 11, 2014, 07:42:01 PM by Baruch »

Offline Alex Libman

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #277 on: June 12, 2014, 11:39:18 AM »
You are making vague claims regarding the history of the property, but your basic premise is that any government owned land is ownerless. Without that this has nothing to do with the homestead principle. I reject that premise, as presumably do most others on this forum. Without convincing anyone in that regard you well get nowhere.

True.

There are two separate arguments involved: (1) the ivory-tower moral argument of Homesteading Rights, and (2) the pragmatic economic argument for well-managed Tent Cities as a better alternative to government boondoggles of "public housing".

The first argument is for philosophy nerds; it will only confuse most people.  It is a complicated argument because of the gradualist approach that must be taken: government cannot disappear overnight, it must be a well-managed transition that takes decades, with more and more power being transferred from coercive monopolies to voluntary institutions.  (Gradualism is never pretty: some slaves can be freed today, but others must remain slaves for a while; some homesteading claims can be recognized today, but you can't put up a tent on a public beach and claim that land in five minutes.  The secluded long-abandoned land that Tent City occupied for 8+ years is an extreme case.)  From the narrow practical perspective, I am making things a lot more difficult for myself by mentioning this argument at all.  I do so to assert my integrity: I am fighting not for government handouts of land but for negative Rights.

The second argument is a lot simpler.  Money doesn't grow on trees.  The Welfare State, which in total spends $62,000/year per family below the poverty line, is not working.  More and more capital and jobs will flee socialist cesspools like NJ.  More and more of the economy will utilize technologies like Bitcoin, making it harder for the government to tax or inflate.  "The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money."  And technology will march forward at an accelerating rate, with robotics and artificial intelligence making more and more bum jobs obsolete.  What are you going to do with the bums - have them wonder the streets?  Exterminate them?  Voluntaryist Tent Cities are a far better alternative.


I love that line - "the system isn't broken, it was built this way". So true!

That one was made by one of our "left-wing" co-belligerents...   ::)

Simple-minded people favor belief systems where everything is explained through a central controller.  Perplexed by the complexity of the universe?  Making up a god is far easier than understanding science.  Perplexed by the complexity of society?  Making up an all-powerful conspiracy is far easier than studying economics, history, sociology, psychology, geopolitics, etc.

No one "built" the "system" - its emergence is a complex evolutionary phenomenon.  There are great concentrations of power, just and more often unjust, but they are set against each-other, and they all have their limits.  Even a government with a multi-Trillion-dollar military is very limited, because its power depends on maintaining the illusion of its benevolence, which in the Internet age is becoming ever-more difficult for it to pull off.  No one is in control.  And yet anyone can have some impact.  One person with the right ideas and the ability to broadcast or apply them can change the world.

The only rallying signs I've composed myself end with:

ALL WE NEED IS LAND!

 ;D

My ideas are gradually winning.  The technological, economic, and social trends I've been predicting for a decade are all in the process of coming true.  There will be thousands of low-income communities like Tent City popping up all over the nation, for as long as there is a need.  Lakewood Township demolishing these tents is like the Luddites smashing up some early textile machines - the Industrial Revolution will not be stopped!

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #278 on: June 12, 2014, 12:28:54 PM »
True.

There are two separate arguments involved: (1) the ivory-tower moral argument of Homesteading Rights, and (2) the pragmatic economic argument for well-managed Tent Cities as a better alternative to government boondoggles of "public housing".

The first argument is for philosophy nerds; it will only confuse most people.  It is a complicated argument because of the gradualist approach that must be taken: government cannot disappear overnight, it must be a well-managed transition that takes decades, with more and more power being transferred from coercive monopolies to voluntary institutions.  (Gradualism is never pretty: some slaves can be freed today, but others must remain slaves for a while; some homesteading claims can be recognized today, but you can't put up a tent on a public beach and claim that land in five minutes.  The secluded long-abandoned land that Tent City occupied for 8+ years is an extreme case.)  From the narrow practical perspective, I am making things a lot more difficult for myself by mentioning this argument at all.  I do so to assert my integrity: I am fighting not for government handouts of land but for negative Rights.

The second argument is a lot simpler.  Money doesn't grow on trees.  The Welfare State, which in total spends $62,000/year per family below the poverty line, is not working.  More and more capital and jobs will flee socialist cesspools like NJ.  More and more of the economy will utilize technologies like Bitcoin, making it harder for the government to tax or inflate.  "The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money."  And technology will march forward at an accelerating rate, with robotics and artificial intelligence making more and more bum jobs obsolete.  What are you going to do with the bums - have them wonder the streets?  Exterminate them?  Voluntaryist Tent Cities are a far better alternative.
They absolutely are separate arguments, but without the first one the second is irrelevant. It may save money, but NIMBY. The government can retain the right to spend more for the quality of life of its constituents who are willing to pay for that. It is only once you can establish a right to the land that you have any claim. You are FAR from having done so.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Alex Libman

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Re: Tent City Lakewood
« Reply #279 on: June 12, 2014, 12:41:52 PM »
Let me now make an even bolder prediction: in 20 years, Lakewood will be the regional mecca of libertarian politics!

Its Jewish communities, which I greatly admire, will (in part thanks to me) lose much of the corrupt political power that some of them presently have, and they will discover that the free market is what favors them best.

We will discover this quicker than any other culture group, on average, in part due to our genetic intelligence, culture, and work ethic.  Jews have been at the forefront of most big ideas in economics, good or bad, and a hugely disproportional fraction of top libertarian thinkers have been Jewish.

Lakewood is already ahead with such a high concentration of private schools, private charities, private ambulances, private security, private neighborhoods, private arbitration, etc.  In 1964 Barry Goldwater only got 10% of the Jewish vote, but in today's Lakewood the Jewish community has largely flipped to fiscally conservative Republicans.  It's a step in the right direction.

Jewish Marxism / socialism / communism was a freak fad of overcompensation, a misdirected reaction against stagnant 19th century European monarchy and feudalism.  The death of this fad is long overdue.  Over centuries of diaspora, the European Jewish Community has evolved through natural selection to have an exceptionally good understanding of business and finance - we should be proud of this, not ashamed! 

There is a very close historical link between "antisemitism" and anti-capitalism.  On the flip-side, I think that "Jewish self-esteem", when examined rationally, will naturally gravitate to the free market.