Ceo of elal resigns

[reed]

I totally agree. I think racial profiling is a must for security. But we shouldn't stick our head in the sand, and blame the other side every time someone can't come to an agreement
This is exactly my point. So we actually are in agreement
Let's not pretend that we know what went on. It's very possible that relations was what ultimately caused them not to come to an agreement, but I think it's very narrow minded to assume that Turkey was the one to blame. Maybe Israel was the one who made it hard to deal with because of the countries relations.

Elal has flown there plenty of times in the past! Now TK has more flights going into TLV then elal has going to JFK and EWR combined. Over 100 per week. Enough! You want to rationalize yourself saving a few dollars go for it! I for one still have principles. Do chaikel you do what you want and continue flying TK. But chas veshalom don't ever drive a German car.

Wake up people! Israel is treated like dirt by its neighbors. Elal has to travel around most of the countries there bec they are not allowed over Thier airspace. You don't want to support elal that's fine. But don't fly the enemy please!

There are nations that hate us out there, they don't even do it in secret. There were plenty of Jews that were rationalizing the Germans pre WWII too. Wake up stand together and don't fly an enemies airline.

[reed]

So what you're saying is that in your small mind, you think Israel would allow armed Turkish security agents into restricted areas of Ben Gurion

Also it is really a strong mark of intelligence when one must come to insulting the one he his having an argument with.

Especially  on an anonymous  forum.

[damaxer91]

This is a total non issue being trumped by El Al for the purpose of getting more $$ money

El Al stands very little to gain by flying to IST (once a day on a 737). TK fills up planes because passengers are using IST as a hub to connect onward at a much lower price.

Since El Al has no partners at IST, there is little to no money to made with onward connections and surely nobody from Turkey is using TLV as a hub to connect to Europe/Asia etc

[meshugener]

Why wouldn't they use TLV as a hub?

[damaxer91]

Why wouldn't they use TLV as a hub?

Why would they? EL AL is always more expensive and people dont like dealing with Israeli security

[Dan]

This is a total non issue being trumped by El Al for the purpose of getting more $$ money

El Al stands very little to gain by flying to IST (once a day on a 737). TK fills up planes because passengers are using IST as a hub to connect onward at a much lower price.

Since El Al has no partners at IST, there is little to no money to made with onward connections and surely nobody from Turkey is using TLV as a hub to connect to Europe/Asia etc

My thoughts exactly.

Plus TK has made flights to TLV on US carriers from everywhere but NYC much cheaper.

If LY wants to compete they need to lower their cost structure. I'm not talking about their security which is paid for by Israel.  I mean their union issues.

Right now LY doesn't compete on price, service, or product except in F.  That's a bad combo.

[PlatinumGuy]

LY Fleet: 40 Employees: 6,056 (151:1).
AB Fleet 124 Employees: 9,284. (75:1)

ותו לא מידי

[Chaikel]

My thoughts exactly.

Plus TK has made flights to TLV on US carriers from everywhere but NYC much cheaper.

If LY wants to compete they need to lower their cost structure. I'm not talking about their security which is paid for by Israel.  I mean their union issues.

Right now LY doesn't compete on price, service, or product except in F.  That's a bad combo.

Last year they couldn't make money because no one was letting them into an alliance because they were Jewish, this year it's because of Turkey. They have to stop playing the blame game and figure out that they have only themselves to blame.

[Chaikel]

But chas veshalom don't ever drive a German car.

I have no issue with a german car. I have an issue with people who claim to have an issue with people driving German cars, but  own a Bosch or Braun, own a pair of Adidas, a camera with a Carl-Zeiss lens.
Those people are just hypocrites

[PlatinumGuy]

Or wear Hugo Boss who was bankrupt until he starting making Nazi uniforms.

[moish]

I have no issue with a german car. I have an issue with people who claim to have an issue with people driving German cars, but  own a Bosch or Braun, own a pair of Adidas, a camera with a Carl-Zeiss lens.
Those people are just hypocrites

oy, from the frying pan to the fire...

[skyguy918]

I have no issue with a german car. I have an issue with people who claim to have an issue with people driving German cars, but  own a Bosch or Braun, own a pair of Adidas, a camera with a Carl-Zeiss lens.
Those people are just hypocrites

Learned some new things googling those companies to see what their connection to Nazi Germany might be. Didn't see anything of note on the Braun or Bosch wiki pages, while Carl-Zeiss used forced labor and Adidas factories were used to produce anti-tank weaponry. I also discovered that Adidas comes from Adi Dassler and Puma used to be called Ruda, from Rudi Dassler (the brothers who started the company).

[reed]

This is a total non issue being trumped by El Al for the purpose of getting more $$ money

El Al stands very little to gain by flying to IST (once a day on a 737). TK fills up planes because passengers are using IST as a hub to connect onward at a much lower price.

Since El Al has no partners at IST, there is little to no money to made with onward connections and surely nobody from Turkey is using TLV as a hub to connect to Europe/Asia etc

Your logic makes no sense, if people are using IST as a hub why can't elal cash in on that in flying people to IST?

[reed]

My thoughts exactly.

Plus TK has made flights to TLV on US carriers from everywhere but NYC much cheaper.

If LY wants to compete they need to lower their cost structure. I'm not talking about their security which is paid for by Israel.  I mean their union issues.

Right now LY doesn't compete on price, service, or product except in F.  That's a bad combo.

New to the forum so not sure if one is allowed to argue with Dan, but I will take a shot. I am not saying people should fly elal, rather as jews we should not fly TK.  They do not allow elal to fly into thieir airport. It also emerged that El Al Israel Airlines had contingency plans that would address the possibility that Turkey would bar the Israeli carrier from overflying Turkish territory. They also have had an extremely anti Israel policy the last bunch of years. Moshe Ya'alon, Israel's Minister of Strategic Affairs, accused Turkey of cooperating with Hamas and Iran. According to the Shin Bet, Hamas established a command post in Turkey and has used it to recruit operatives and oversee operations in the Middle East. David Ignatius has reported that in 2012, Turkey revealed the names of Mossad agents to Iran. Erdoğan described Zionism as "a crime against humanity". Hürriyet reported that Erdoğan had stated to a meeting of the AKP's provincial chairs that Israel was responsible for the recent military coup in Egypt which overthrew Mohammad Morsi. Erdoğan reportedly stated "Who is behind this? Israel. We have evidence".In September 2011, military agreements between Turkey and Israel were suspended. According to Turkey’s Ministry of Culture and Tourism, Israelis' share of Turkey's total tourism declined from 3% to 0.05%. The number of Arab tourists in Turkey, by contrast, increased to about 1.4 million visitors in the first part of 2011, a jump from about 912,000 in the whole of 2009. Turkey’s Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdoğan stated in June 2012: "We do not need Israeli tourists. We have successfully filled their places".

[Dan]

Your logic makes no sense, if people are using IST as a hub why can't elal cash in on that in flying people to IST?

People could care less about where the hub is, IST is incidental.
The amount of people originating IST-TLV is miniscule.
The point is that TK has brought cheap fares to the US-TLV market and people will always gravitate to the cheapest option.

LY would gain nothing from flying to IST. There is no market to be captured there. They still have the same ridiculously high cost structure with too many employees that cost too much and get too many benefit for the airline to be competitive in a global economy. 

They need to stop the blame game, improve their product (they're the only US-TLV airline without lie-flat business class, etc), improve their mileage program (the only profitable part of US airlines) and lower their cost structure to better compete.

[Bostener]

Dan, wow!
Usually we hope airlines don't listen in here but this time we hope they do.

[meshugener]

But they're the only airline flying non-stop F US-TLV.

[Bostener]

But they're the only airline flying non-stop F US-TLV.

I see you are already standing up for El Al. Sounds like you are heading there.

[Dan]

And also the only one requiring you to pay for F for lie flat.

[meshugener]

Ever heard the story of tha half cup full and the half cup empty.

But I gotta agree, it takes some talent to spin an obvious positive into a negative.

Its late. Good night my friends, they say tomorrow is another day.

By the way Dan, I maybe planning an int'l trip in the near future - if I manage to have a connection in CLE would you step by in UA club for a mini-DO?
Answer yes or no.