Author Topic: Yom Kippur Davening  (Read 105891 times)

Offline eliraps

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #360 on: October 15, 2016, 10:11:35 PM »
Eta: i checked the Dirshu M"B hilchos yom kippur... where the M"B talks about Havdalah he brings the sdai chemed who quotes the minchas pittim who says it's assur and the sdai chemed is docheh his proof. He then brings a whole slew of "contemporary" poskim (r'sz, R elyashiv..) who seem to all agree that with boruch hamavdil it would be muttar to drink (some even without) then ends off with the C' HaG"riz Yuma that leaves with a tzruch iyun if it would be muttar, I looked up there and although he does leave off like that it seemed he is noteh ltzad heter.

Conclusion: seems like its only a daas yaachid who assurs
If u have some other source/ contemporary pose who assurs please post..
As far as hil. YK is concerned you may drink WATER before havdala and even before saying baruch hamavdil.
However, like every shabbos, according to kabala it is a sakana to drink WATER before havdala.
You can not drink other drinks before havdala

Offline Eliyohu

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #361 on: October 15, 2016, 10:19:45 PM »


As far as hil. YK is concerned you may drink WATER before havdala and even before saying baruch hamavdil.

That's a machlokes (I believe) R Elyashiv and R Shlomo Zalmen


However, like every shabbos, according to kabala it is a sakana to drink WATER before havdala.
You can not drink other drinks before havdala

Source?
And other drinks as well as food seem to be shaila as to why it's any diff than water, linyan yom kippur, (although have not found a posek who says it's muttar) it's not necessarily the same halacha as every motsie shabbos

Offline eliraps

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #362 on: October 16, 2016, 02:53:36 AM »

That's a machlokes (I believe) R Elyashiv and R Shlomo Zalmen

 
Source?
And other drinks as well as food seem to be shaila as to why it's any diff than water, linyan yom kippur, (although have not found a posek who says it's muttar) it's not necessarily the same halacha as every motsie shabbos

Excuse me for not quoting exact sources, I'm not with my books. I'll be happy to if you pm me later.

It may be that r elyashiv is machmir but the mekal is not just rsz auerbach. Iirc it's explicit in shua harav, and almost explicit in mishna berura. (R elyashiv is often more machmir)

The point is that the prohibition to eat on yk finishes as soon as tosefes Yom Kippur does, I.e. A short while after three stars.

At that point a new prohibition starts. Namely, don't eat or drink or do melacha until you have made havdala (over wine for eating and just saying baruch hamavdil for melacha).
This is nothing unique to yk, every shabbos has this. And al pi halacha it does not apply to drinking water as is explicit in gemara and shu"a.

However the mekubalim are strict about drinking water - see sources quoted in kaf hachaim hil. Havdala.

Btw, by the same token, If you're in middle of a meal on the last day of pesach and your meal continues into the night, you are allowed to have chometz in that meal without making any king of havdala, and you can still say yalle veyavo in bentching. And the same would apply to eating out of the Sukah at the end of sukos.

Offline yesitsme

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Offline chaimmayer

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #364 on: October 16, 2016, 01:20:56 PM »
Btw, by the same token, If you're in middle of a meal on the last day of pesach and your meal continues into the night, you are allowed to have chometz in that meal without making any king of havdala, and you can still say yalle veyavo in bentching. And the same would apply to eating out of the Sukah at the end of sukos.
The Magen avraham says you can eat Chometz without havdala because havdala is on,y needed to be matir Melacha not for other issues.
However the mishna Brura there says not to do it because you would NOT be able to say yaale veyavo after eating Chometz.

Offline koplonko

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #365 on: October 18, 2016, 11:15:14 PM »
The Magen avraham says you can eat Chometz without havdala because havdala is on,y needed to be matir Melacha not for other issues.
However the mishna Brura there says not to do it because you would NOT be able to say yaale veyavo after eating Chometz.
Incorrect. He says not to do it since he WILL need to say yaale veyavo and it will seem like a contradiction  (MB 491:1)
According to the way the SA Harav  explains it, he COULD eat chometz, SAY yaale veyavo,  and it will NOT be a contradiction

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #366 on: October 19, 2016, 06:58:37 AM »
Gam Gam in Venice serves pizza at mashiach seuda. Can't remember if we did havdala first or not.
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Offline AsherO

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #367 on: October 19, 2016, 07:59:58 AM »
Gam Gam in Venice serves pizza at mashiach seuda. Can't remember if we did havdala first or not.

It's a Chabad "thing", to have Pesach'dike Chametz...
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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #368 on: October 19, 2016, 09:07:22 AM »
It's a Chabad "thing", to have Pesach'dike Chametz...
No we had real pizza. Probably the best pizza I ever had.
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Offline Dan

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #369 on: October 19, 2016, 09:09:34 AM »
That's what Asher meant.
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Offline koplonko

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #370 on: October 19, 2016, 10:59:07 AM »
It's a Chabad "thing", to have Pesach'dike Chametz...
Probably to bring out the chidush of the SA Harav

Offline Ergel

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #371 on: October 20, 2016, 11:11:28 AM »
Is that how it works? What if I go 2 days without eating?
There is a mitzvah d'oraisa to be mosif mechol al hakodesh
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Offline Ergel

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #372 on: October 20, 2016, 11:18:29 AM »
They never kept two days yk due to sakana I believe.
There were those who kept two days when it was a real safek. However, this was never imposed upon the hamon am. There is a question amongst the poskim if this is because Yom tov sheini, even when it was an actual safek, is only drabanan because midinah we follow rov or midinah you're really chayav but because of sakanah we only keep one day.
Either way, because there wasn't never two days Yom Kippur, the enactment of minhag avoiseinu in the Gemara never included Yom Kippur because there was no such minhag
« Last Edit: October 20, 2016, 11:56:16 AM by Ergel »
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Offline Dan

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #373 on: October 20, 2016, 11:20:35 AM »
There is a mitzvah d'oraisa to be mosif mechol al hakodesh
Does the mitzvah become greater if you extend for 5 minutes vs an hour vs 24 hours?
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Offline Ergel

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #374 on: October 20, 2016, 11:22:40 AM »
Does the mitzvah become greater if you extend for 5 minutes vs an hour vs 24 hours?
Yes. The Mishna Berura is clear in hilchos shabbos that the more the better
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Offline Dan

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #375 on: October 20, 2016, 11:30:15 AM »
Yes. The Mishna Berura is clear in hilchos shabbos that the more the better
My point remains, ain l'dovor sof. At what point do you draw the line?
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Offline Ergel

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #376 on: October 20, 2016, 11:31:19 AM »
My point remains, ain l'dovor sof. At what point do you draw the line?
With that I don't disagree
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Offline dealfinder85

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #377 on: October 20, 2016, 11:38:20 AM »
Yes. The Mishna Berura is clear in hilchos shabbos that the more the better
IIRC, he quotes specific shitos as to how long the shiur is, so he recommends going with the longer shiur of tosefes
but to go longer than any shita holds, i would think, would not gain anything

Offline Eliyohu

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #378 on: October 20, 2016, 11:53:08 AM »
There were those who kept two days when it was a real safek. However, this was never imposed upon the hamon am. There is a question amongst the poskim if this is because Yom tov sheini, even when it was an actual safek, is only drabanan because midinah we follow to or midinah you're really chalav but because of sakanah we only keep one day.
Either way, because there wasn't never two days Yom Kippur, the enactment of minhag avoiseinu in the Gemara never included Yom Kippur because there was no such minhag
Shulchan Aruch Harav hilchos yom kippur  discusses this and it's ramifications

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Re: Yom Kippur Davening
« Reply #379 on: September 30, 2017, 09:05:31 PM »
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