Author Topic: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others  (Read 214723 times)

Offline boruchmig

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3150 on: March 06, 2019, 12:18:58 PM »
I'm sure its not your first time being challanged. Just on this forum alone you've bes challenged a bunch of times, so you certainly know how to respond.

So go on his show,  because if you are the man you portray yourself as; you will come out fine, and if you get burned then great, cause what right do you have to...
(Based on the works of r' shmuel munkes)

Offline Alexsei

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3151 on: March 06, 2019, 12:21:30 PM »
Slightly OT but funny, from https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Lichtenstein
Quote
He purchased his first property with a $12,000 down payment in the mid-1980s, which was funded by maxing out credit cards and using some funds from a small savings account.
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Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3152 on: March 06, 2019, 12:24:01 PM »
Listening now to the Brenner interview for the first time.

A few takeaways so far.

1. I say um too much.
2. It does sound like AT is personally involved in $50MM+ of these cases, though which side for each is unclear.
3. AT says disputing can get you in criminal trouble as you affirming under oath that you don't recognize the charge, but an initial chargeback isn't an affirmation under oath. Of course it may come to that, but it should not be hard to at least initiate a chargeback without those repercussions.
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Online ExGingi

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3153 on: March 06, 2019, 12:26:05 PM »
Listening now to the Brenner interview for the first time.

A few takeaways so far.

1. I say um too much.

Most people do. There are speaking courses and possibly practice groups where one can improve their speaking.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3154 on: March 06, 2019, 12:28:04 PM »
Most people do. There are speaking courses and possibly practice groups where one can improve their speaking.
Mic Drop  ;D
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Offline jj1000

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3155 on: March 06, 2019, 12:34:30 PM »
Mic Drop  ;D
I can get you a good rate ;)
See my 5 step program to your left <--

(Real signature under my location)

Offline Dan

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Offline shapsam

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3157 on: March 06, 2019, 12:39:05 PM »
Listening now to the Brenner interview for the first time.

3. AT says disputing can get you in criminal trouble as you affirming under oath that you don't recognize the charge, but an initial chargeback isn't an affirmation under oath. Of course it may come to that, but it should not be hard to at least initiate a chargeback without those repercussions.
If not under oath, are you allowed to say whatever you want to a bank without any repercussions?

Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3158 on: March 06, 2019, 12:40:42 PM »
If not under oath, are you allowed to say whatever you want to a bank without any repercussions?
I'm not advocating lying. But there are other things you can likely say that aren't lying. I'd suggest hiring a lawyer in these cases.
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Offline shapsam

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3159 on: March 06, 2019, 12:44:44 PM »
I'm not advocating lying. But there are other things you can likely say that aren't lying. I'd suggest hiring a lawyer in these cases.
I'm asking in general, it is illegal to lie to bank only if under oath?
Is a credit card application under oath?

Offline Baruch

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3160 on: March 06, 2019, 12:45:51 PM »
. And don't forget to talk about wealthy people declaring bankruptcy to save their assests. Ask him if that's also against his ethics.
And if he needs an example of a bankruptcy
http://www.worldpropertyjournal.com/us-markets/vacation-leisure-real-estate-1/extended-stay-inc-lightstone-group-llc-blackstone-group-lp-bear-stearns-david-lichtenstein-federal-reserve-wachovia-943.php
When somebody thanks you for a favor you've done, respond "my pleasure", not "no problem".

Online churnbabychurn

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3161 on: March 06, 2019, 12:47:56 PM »
Keep in mind that his credentials to be discussing halacha are that he is wealthy.
He has a well paid staff of producers who seem competent in sourcing and prepping him.

Offline EJB

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3162 on: March 06, 2019, 12:56:44 PM »
He has a well paid staff of producers who seem competent in sourcing and prepping him.

Ah, so he and they are well paid.

Offline Denverite

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3163 on: March 06, 2019, 01:20:28 PM »
Well, asking hard questions is a better way to gain clarity than having an echo chamber. See Bava Metzia.
Wow, that's a beautiful and powerful concept.

Maybe not explicitly "you can / should sell your points for cash", but offering "Have a ton of miles to burn? We can also work out a method to pay for the cruise with them!" certainly implied that.

You are right.  This could be problematic although I'm still (perhaps naively or in willful denial) hoping that this advertised "method" didn't include selling points and no 1099.  :'(

Listening now to the Brenner interview for the first time.

A few takeaways so far.

3. AT says disputing can get you in criminal trouble as you affirming under oath that you don't recognize the charge, but an initial chargeback isn't an affirmation under oath. Of course it may come to that, but it should not be hard to at least initiate a chargeback without those repercussions.

I'm not advocating lying. But there are other things you can likely say that aren't lying. I'd suggest hiring a lawyer in these cases.

Guys, no one responded to my question about mileage buyers issuing 1099's.  Can someone please do so?  The answer changes the whole landscape around where this could all end up.  It seems many of you on here have sold points, no one wants to chime in?

If there was multi-millions of tax-fraud, along with all the bank issues for these cardholders, they could have bigger legal consequences to disputing these charges (and if the feds start looking through the books of these points buyers servicing these cardholders involved, all the other little guys that "only" sell points could be facing  consequences too). 

I really don't want thousands of my brethren to have problems with the law or to have to face the tremendous Chillul HaShem in the media.  Seems like if people dispute charges and banks and legal authorities start digging (although they may start digging without the chargebacks) there could be consequences none of us ever dreamed of.  It also seems like people should add this aspect into their personal calculus of deciding if they want to continue to engage in any of these (admittedly profitable) transactions.  If people ARE getting 1099s and paying income taxes on money earned from these swiping arrangements and selling points, disregard all these worries as its a moot point.

Do points buyers issue 1099s?


Offline rileywiles23

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3164 on: March 06, 2019, 01:24:29 PM »
Life is as good as you make it...