Author Topic: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others  (Read 504459 times)

Offline ExGingi

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3200 on: March 06, 2019, 03:31:42 PM »
I have no clue if Sterling on Central Ave in Lawrence is affiliated, but listen to how AT answers the question, it definitely sounds like he's hiding something.

Years ago there might have been an affiliation between the two. I believe both businesses have changed owners (possibly multiple times).
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Online aygart

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3201 on: March 06, 2019, 03:32:53 PM »
Well, if the card was swiped by a supplier the rebate would be on the cost of the supplies. If it was directly swiped by the business, the rebate would be on the amount ďlentĒ to the business. In either case it would lower the cost basis, and have tax implications when the full amount before the rebate is paid back to the credit card holder.
Basically, making the arguments on DDF is fun. In front of an IRS auditor-not so much. At the very least it is unclear enough that it is not something you really want to have them looking at.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Yard sale

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3202 on: March 06, 2019, 03:47:52 PM »
Basically, making the arguments on DDF is fun. In front of an IRS auditor-not so much. At the very least it is unclear enough that it is not something you really want to have them looking at.

Itís pretty simple:
https://www.nonprofitaccountingbasics.org/federal-tax-issues/taxability-credit-card-cashback-rewards

Offline PSA

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3203 on: March 06, 2019, 03:48:13 PM »

I was only addressing your third point that you would stay under the radar by not disputing. I haven't given any advice about disputing or any other legal matter. I just think that anyone who is under the impression that not disputing will keep you under the radar is either deluding themselves or is being told that by someone with alterior motives. As I said, if you have reason to believe that what I said isn't true then please share but from everything I can see here and elsewhere, there is no reason to think that the banks aren't looking at every transaction.

You just think.... Blah blah....
Again, disputing can potentially affect your defaulting options.

Online LoLo

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3204 on: March 06, 2019, 03:49:21 PM »
He didn't say otherwise, let it go.

Offline mmgfarb

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3205 on: March 06, 2019, 03:50:06 PM »

You just think.... Blah blah....
Again, disputing can potentially affect your defaulting options.
That may be true, I know nothing about it and have never pretended that I do, I was just commenting on that single point of yours which I think is untrue, I didn't say anything about whether or not anyone should dispute.
"JS [is] a fetid cesspool of unvarnished linguistic manure, with lots of useless drivel and post-padding." -Moishebatchy

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3206 on: March 06, 2019, 03:50:51 PM »

You just think.... Blah blah....
Again, disputing can potentially affect your defaulting options.
I understand that you are unfortunately under a lot of pressure, but this has zero relevance to anything @mmgfarb wrote. It may or may not affect defaulting options, but does that mean it will keep one under the radar?
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline PSA

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3207 on: March 06, 2019, 03:54:37 PM »
I understand that you are unfortunately under a lot of pressure, but this has zero relevance to anything @mmgfarb wrote. It may or may not affect defaulting options, but does that mean it will keep one under the radar?
100% and that's not coming from people with ulterior motives...

This is a useless argument. Every person who's involved should make their decision based on the advice of their attorney, and rav
« Last Edit: March 06, 2019, 04:07:21 PM by PSA »

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3208 on: March 06, 2019, 03:57:35 PM »
Itís pretty simple:
https://www.nonprofitaccountingbasics.org/federal-tax-issues/taxability-credit-card-cashback-rewards
That is his opinion.

However, there are some situations where the IRS could view.....
then the points are generally considered......
 the IRS could consider........
 then it should reduce......

Doesn't sound so clear and simple.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline sky121

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3209 on: March 06, 2019, 04:11:30 PM »
Listening now to the Brenner interview for the first time.

A few takeaways so far.

1. I say um too much.
2. It does sound like AT is personally involved in $50MM+ of these cases, though which side for each is unclear.
3. AT says disputing can get you in criminal trouble as you affirming under oath that you don't recognize the charge, but an initial chargeback isn't an affirmation under oath. Of course it may come to that, but it should not be hard to at least initiate a chargeback without those repercussions.
You didn't say it enough that I particularly noticed, so that's good.  But you were probably being extra critical of yourself.
"Not all who wander are lost"

Offline chevron

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3210 on: March 06, 2019, 04:41:56 PM »
Everyone says umm too much lol

Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3211 on: March 06, 2019, 04:47:57 PM »
You didn't say it enough that I particularly noticed, so that's good.  But you were probably being extra critical of yourself.
I always cringe hearing myself talk on a recording.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Denverite

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3212 on: March 06, 2019, 04:52:01 PM »
I know for a fact that people have been either AA'd or FRed for transactions that took place years ago, that would imply strongly that the banks are looking at every single transaction that these companies did. If you have reason to believe otherwise then please share but there's no logical reason to believe that anyone who is in this mess is going to fly under the radar.

Even if it's only half.  It is scary.  These schemes have hurt so many people.

In that lost messiah blog posting of the court case, if you read it, it's about how a "real estate developer" solicited a GEMACH to do the actual swiping for him (gotta, admit he's a smart one, wouldn't have thought to add that extra layer in to these convoluted transactions).  They say in the brief that the gemach did this for him to encourage his donations. A lawyer can chime in if I'm misreading it but it looks like the gemach is suing the cardholder for the chargeback and the guy who got the money isn't even involved in the suit! 

When the cardholder did the chargeback it was to the gemach, so no mater who wins this particular case, either the gemach or the cardholder will be paying the bank AND now the gemach can't process credit cards for people who want to make donations.

If someone had told me last week that a relatively small group of people were doing this for a total amount of $50 mil, I would never have believed them.  If the scale is so huge, it seems like there would be lots of other small businesses (or average people) doing this but just haven't defaulted the cardholder yet.  As Dan said in is original DDMS post, if you are engaging in any kinds of these activities (even for someone in your family you are just trying to help) please stop and probably best to call an accountant and attorney.



Offline boruchmig

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3213 on: March 06, 2019, 04:53:18 PM »
I always cringe hearing myself talk on a recording.
There is an excellent course that can help you with that. While you are thinking great, how much will it cost? The news only gets better. You can sign up for the course by just giving your social security number, and agreeing to let us apply for a couple card in your name.
I am making you an exclusive offer so please don't share

Offline ExGingi

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3214 on: March 06, 2019, 04:58:11 PM »
I always cringe hearing myself talk on a recording.

I think most people do.

One of my favorite speakers, Rabbi Yossi Paltiel once told me that he cannot listen to recordings of himself (and he makes sure to record every shiur or speech he gives - a lot are available on insidechassidus.org and theyeshiva.net)
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan

Offline Denverite

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3215 on: March 06, 2019, 04:59:49 PM »
Never heard of a 1099 for goods purchased.

I believe Ebay issues a 1099k after 20k worth of sales and Amazon after 50k.  Not trying to go off topic here, and no idea if these companies do this for other reasons than IRS guidelines but I think there are points buyers an sellers on this thread that may be facing increasing scrutiny from banks and the government and may want to seek out some professional advice.

Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3216 on: March 06, 2019, 05:01:06 PM »
I think most people do.

One of my favorite speakers, Rabbi Yossi Paltiel once told me that he cannot listen to recordings of himself (and he makes sure to record every shiur or speech he gives - a lot are available on insidechassidus.org and theyeshiva.net)
Good to know.
I remember RYP recording shiurim back when I was in ULY. Don't recall RYYJ doing the same.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3217 on: March 06, 2019, 05:02:01 PM »
I believe Ebay issues a 1099k after 20k worth of sales and Amazon after 50k.  Not trying to go off topic here, and no idea if these companies do this for other reasons than IRS guidelines but I think there are points buyers an sellers on this thread that may be facing increasing scrutiny from banks and the government and may want to seek out some professional advice.
Ebay and Amazon are facilitating payments, not buying your goods.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Denverite

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3218 on: March 06, 2019, 05:07:00 PM »
Ebay and Amazon are facilitating payments, not buying your goods.

Good point, maybe it's not an issue.  Hopefully this whole industry is doing everything according to halacha and following tax laws correctly.

Offline ExGingi

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3219 on: March 06, 2019, 05:11:47 PM »
Good to know.
I remember RYP recording shiurim back when I was in ULY. Don't recall RYYJ doing the same.
As I said (and I've spoken to him about it) RYP records EVERYTHING using (relatively) high-end equipment!

I don't think that RYYJ records himself (except when he's taking for the purpose of recording) to this day. I think RYYJ is extremely engaging and entertaining when he's not scripted and just lets things flow, the same can't be said when he's scripted or talking to a camera.
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
-- Dan