Topic Wiki

https://www.dansdeals.com/more/dans-commentary/dark-side-earning-credit-card-points-psa-dont-swipe-others/

https://www.mixcloud.com/zev-brenner/talkline-with-zev-brenner-on-credit-card-scams-affecting-the-orthodox-jewish-community/

http://podcast.headlinesbook.com/e/31616-credit-card-miles-and-points-swiping-for-rewards-buying-and-selling-miles-is-it-assur-and-a-chillul-hashem-or-a-great-way-for-a-side-parnassah/



BEFORE SWIPING FOR SOMEONE READ THIS: (first hand story)

https://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=36812.msg2062371#msg2062371
https://www.dansdeals.com/more/dans-commentary/dark-side-earning-credit-card-points-psa-dont-swipe-others/#comment-1399884


Dan's warning to DDF:
I hope people realize that any buying group or anyone else that gets merchandise in advance of payment can go south at any time. That's even if you get a check at the time of delivery.
X-posting as I don't want anyone to say that I never put a warning here.

A story that ended up in court - https://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/nyscef/DocumentList?docketId=iRcRHuyZUdOIx69D00a5XQ==&display=all&courtType=Kings%20County%20Supreme%20Court&resultsPageNum=1


I am one of the biggest buyers for buying groups, I have done millions in transactions and have sent to every group there is over the past 3 years. Most buying groups are okay, some scan in slower than others, some pay slower than others - most will lose a few packages over the year. You can research and find which are better for you.

However there is a bigger problem now with Amazon itself.  Amazon in the past has been great with any problems always ready with a refund for lost packages even if it was thousands of dollars. Lately Amazon has clamped down and has tagged these buying groups addresses  in their systems as "freight forwarder" and now no longer will fix any problem you have whatsoever. Doesn't matter what the problem is, even if it shows the package was never delivered, amazon will not help you in any way. Their copy and paste response will always be "this item was sent to a freight forwarder and we're unable to replace or refund the item. We recommend contacting your freight forwarder for more details, as we don't have any more insight or information regarding this matter, For more information about sending items via freight forwarders, please visit our Help Pages: https://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=201117950." As well the amazon drivers either must know this or have been increasingly bad at delivering packages because the numbers of packages missing has gone up astronomically. Previously you would have very few packages missing, now the past 3 months I have had 59 "lost" packages. I now have over $15,000 of loses and some guy in Delaware is probably living the life with all the stuff he stole from me. I will survive, I have made a lot more than $15,000 over the years however just a warning to others here that things are not as they used to be and it really is no longer worth doing buring groups with all the loses piling up

« Last edited by Yo ssi on July 24, 2023, 06:47:26 PM »

Author Topic: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others  (Read 1183521 times)

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #600 on: December 09, 2016, 02:00:56 AM »
Why does it matter if A knows C? He knows there is a C, so who cares who he is?

You didn't answer my straightforward question upthread. I repeat:

JTZ: Two points. Please tell me if you disagree with either.

1) The nature of a CC dispute is that the cardholder (A) is telling the CC company that the transaction in which the merchant (C) charged money to the credit card for a product or service was not legitimate.

2) In this case, the charge was legitimate.
1 - agree
2 - I need to know the exact nature of the charges.
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #601 on: December 09, 2016, 02:01:09 AM »
Here is my original quote from how I understood the story. Not once did you lay out the facts until way later. If you would have laid them out when I asked this all would have been avoided.

I would be looking at Shimon then. He is responsible for everyone he deals with and I am responsible for everyone I deal with. SOP!
I'm not sure if I should laugh or cry. As long as you see the light I don't care if the admission is via a Trump method.
While the facts have not changed at all, and neither has who is responsible, you even once I laid out more clearly what happened you still argued tooth and nail.

Offline Cheesecake

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #602 on: December 09, 2016, 02:03:19 AM »
1 - agree
2 - I need to know the exact nature of the charges.
I am assuming it was for a service properly rendered. Why would you need more detail than that?

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #603 on: December 09, 2016, 02:04:08 AM »
I'm not sure if I should laugh or cry. As long as you see the light I don't care if the admission is via a Trump method.
While the facts have not changed at all, and neither has who is responsible, you even once I laid out more clearly what happened you still argued tooth and nail.
If you don't understand when I make a deal with you I don't give a rats *ss what side deals you make. Any actions I take that affect your side deals I don't give a rats *ss. If don't understand this basic principal you should stop doing deals.
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #604 on: December 09, 2016, 02:05:51 AM »
I am assuming it was for a service properly rendered. Why would you need more detail than that?
Because I am not assuming anything. What if there was no real service involved. What if was just a purchase to make it look that way?
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #605 on: December 09, 2016, 02:12:11 AM »
I am assuming it was for a service properly rendered.
Don't assume. Is this the way it happened?
Reuven gave Shimon his CC to use, Shimon went to Levi and told him let me swipe my card by you and pay me cash for the purcahse,
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #606 on: December 09, 2016, 02:13:30 AM »
If you don't understand when I make a deal with you I don't give a rats *ss what side deals you make. Any actions I take that affect your side deals I don't give a rats *ss. If don't understand this basic principal you should stop doing deals.
I'm starting to think this gender neutral thing is real, you've been skirting the issues at hand like a female.
Every single pointed, targeted question of mine has been sidestepped by you like they were roadmines.( they very well may have caused your basis to be blown up)

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #607 on: December 09, 2016, 02:15:51 AM »
Don't assume. Is this the way it happened?
Reuven gave Shimon his CC to use, Shimon went to Levi and told him let me swipe my card by you and pay me cash for the purcahse,
For someone who keeps on insisting that its A/B and C has nothing to do with anything, you don't get to determine if B/C was legit. There must be a blanket conclusion for that.

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #608 on: December 09, 2016, 02:18:39 AM »
For someone who keeps on insisting that its A/B and C has nothing to do with anything, you don't get to determine if B/C was legit. There must be a blanket conclusion for that.
This is now an A/B/C deal as you laid out the facts. Please tell us if this was a real purchase or one to make it look that way.
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #609 on: December 09, 2016, 02:20:42 AM »
I'm starting to think this gender neutral thing is real, you've been skirting the issues at hand like a female.
You personal attacks are picking up. Real nice.
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline yuneeq

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #610 on: December 09, 2016, 02:20:53 AM »
I asked many times for you to spell out the facts. Final you spell out the facts and it was different than the original story as I seen it. I said from the beginning this is an A/B deal and C doesn't matter. Now it is an A/B/C deal (three way) and C does matter. I have been called stupid, silly and a few other names. Have a nice day!!!

I think everyone here (besides you) realized that C was getting screwed by A at least 2-3 (50 post) pages ago.
Also you kept calling out DS for not answering your questions but I saw quite a few inconvenient posts aimed at you that you ignored until you were confronted a few times.
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Offline shulem92

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #611 on: December 09, 2016, 02:21:09 AM »
Don't assume. Is this the way it happened?
Reuven gave Shimon his CC to use, Shimon went to Levi and told him let me swipe my card by you and pay me cash for the purcahse,
While I don't agree with @JTZ's argument, I do see why he thought the way he did
Reuven gave Shimon his CC to use, Shimon went to Levi and told him let me swipe my card by you and pay me cash for the purcahse, Levi wasn't aware that it is really Reuven's card and that he may face any sort of risk he went and used the card at PayPal, end of the story, Shimon didn't pay Reuven, Reuven disputed the PayPal charge, Levi's PayPal account got frozen...

Because I am not assuming anything. What if there was no real service involved. What if was just a purchase to make it look that way?


While the facts have not changed at all, and neither has who is responsible, you even once I laid out more clearly what happened you still argued tooth and nail.

And @Emkay may have not changed the facts, but they definitely did change since OP. OP clearly said that Levi gave Shimon back cash

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #612 on: December 09, 2016, 02:21:32 AM »
This is now an A/B/C deal as you laid out the facts. Please tell us if this was a real purchase or one to make it look that way.
As I said since the very beginning and haven't changed once.
1) this was a 100% legit and legal transaction.
2) A doesnt know C personally yet approved to swipe.


Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #613 on: December 09, 2016, 02:22:59 AM »
I think everyone here (besides you) realized that C was getting screwed by A at least 2-3 (50 post) pages ago.
Were did I say this? I said it was an A/B deal and c was no concern of A's.
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #614 on: December 09, 2016, 02:23:13 AM »
While I don't agree with @JTZ's argument, I do see why he thought the way he did

And @Emkay may have not changed the facts, but they definitely did change since OP. OP clearly said that Levi gave Shimon back cash
@ SG post was corrected shortly after and was clarified before me asking the question that set this off.

Offline yuneeq

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #615 on: December 09, 2016, 02:23:17 AM »
While I don't agree with @JTZ's argument, I do see why he thought the way he did

And @Emkay may have not changed the facts, but they definitely did change since OP. OP clearly said that Levi gave Shimon back cash

The facts changed about 300 posts ago and were reiterated ad nauseum.
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Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #616 on: December 09, 2016, 02:23:53 AM »
As I said since the very beginning and haven't changed once.
1) this was a 100% legit and legal transaction.
2) A doesnt know C personally yet approved to swipe.
Did you give cash back for the purchase?
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #617 on: December 09, 2016, 02:23:57 AM »
You personal attacks are picking up. Real nice.
If I put an emoji in that text is it then OK?

Offline shulem92

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #618 on: December 09, 2016, 02:24:35 AM »
@ SG post was corrected shortly after and was clarified before me asking the question that set this off.

The facts changed about 300 posts ago and were reiterated ad nauseum.
I know. I know. But OP's post still says that Levi was giving Shimon money. #JustSaying

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #619 on: December 09, 2016, 02:24:53 AM »
Did you give cash back for the purchase?
No. It was simply a  legitimate service delivered and then paid. End of story.