Topic Wiki

https://www.dansdeals.com/more/dans-commentary/dark-side-earning-credit-card-points-psa-dont-swipe-others/

https://www.mixcloud.com/zev-brenner/talkline-with-zev-brenner-on-credit-card-scams-affecting-the-orthodox-jewish-community/

http://podcast.headlinesbook.com/e/31616-credit-card-miles-and-points-swiping-for-rewards-buying-and-selling-miles-is-it-assur-and-a-chillul-hashem-or-a-great-way-for-a-side-parnassah/



BEFORE SWIPING FOR SOMEONE READ THIS: (first hand story)

https://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=36812.msg2062371#msg2062371
https://www.dansdeals.com/more/dans-commentary/dark-side-earning-credit-card-points-psa-dont-swipe-others/#comment-1399884


Dan's warning to DDF:
I hope people realize that any buying group or anyone else that gets merchandise in advance of payment can go south at any time. That's even if you get a check at the time of delivery.
X-posting as I don't want anyone to say that I never put a warning here.

A story that ended up in court - https://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/nyscef/DocumentList?docketId=iRcRHuyZUdOIx69D00a5XQ==&display=all&courtType=Kings%20County%20Supreme%20Court&resultsPageNum=1


I am one of the biggest buyers for buying groups, I have done millions in transactions and have sent to every group there is over the past 3 years. Most buying groups are okay, some scan in slower than others, some pay slower than others - most will lose a few packages over the year. You can research and find which are better for you.

However there is a bigger problem now with Amazon itself.  Amazon in the past has been great with any problems always ready with a refund for lost packages even if it was thousands of dollars. Lately Amazon has clamped down and has tagged these buying groups addresses  in their systems as "freight forwarder" and now no longer will fix any problem you have whatsoever. Doesn't matter what the problem is, even if it shows the package was never delivered, amazon will not help you in any way. Their copy and paste response will always be "this item was sent to a freight forwarder and we're unable to replace or refund the item. We recommend contacting your freight forwarder for more details, as we don't have any more insight or information regarding this matter, For more information about sending items via freight forwarders, please visit our Help Pages: https://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=201117950." As well the amazon drivers either must know this or have been increasingly bad at delivering packages because the numbers of packages missing has gone up astronomically. Previously you would have very few packages missing, now the past 3 months I have had 59 "lost" packages. I now have over $15,000 of loses and some guy in Delaware is probably living the life with all the stuff he stole from me. I will survive, I have made a lot more than $15,000 over the years however just a warning to others here that things are not as they used to be and it really is no longer worth doing buring groups with all the loses piling up

« Last edited by Yo ssi on July 24, 2023, 06:47:26 PM »

Author Topic: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others  (Read 1183647 times)

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #620 on: December 09, 2016, 02:29:50 AM »
No. It was simply a  legitimate service delivered and then paid. End of story.
If it was legitimate then you should have no problem saying what it was.
So the original story that says you gave cash to B is wrong?
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #621 on: December 09, 2016, 02:34:32 AM »
If it was legitimate then you should have no problem saying what it was.
So the original story that says you gave cash to B is wrong?
It is wrong. And that was said dozens of times including very shortly after his original post. But please don't try to make that be a difference as you scream till you were blue that C makes no difference at all. So it doesn't matter legit or now.
I run a prostitution ring and he was a client.   Just because it was legit doesn't mean it isn't private.
Either way in case it really makes a difference I'll PM you the exact charge.

Offline Mplace

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #622 on: December 09, 2016, 02:36:49 AM »
There is a major difference if it was a 3 way deal, or a 2&2
The difference is,
I know someone, who's doing the same thing (I hope he doesn't get messed over) B needs money and he asked A if he could charge his card and pay back in 45 days (b4 the closing day) as far as A is concerned B is swiping it in his Own business, in order to pay the bills that needs to be paid,
A Authorized the charge as long as he gets the 'Goods'  that he was promised which in this case is money when his bill is due
Now if B decides to go use as credit card in a third party  location that charge was not necessarily authorized as a third person charged but authorized as B charge
 And since it was authorized as a  B charge,  as far as A  is concerned he is disputing a charge from B

And even if A knows that the charge came up from a different merchant, and approved that charge, it was likely with the understanding that it's part of B's businesses..
« Last Edit: December 09, 2016, 02:40:22 AM by Mplace »
What's your plan for yud shvat?

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #623 on: December 09, 2016, 02:38:54 AM »



A Authorized the charge as long as he gets the 'Goods'  that he was promised which in this case is money when his bill is due
If only life worked this way.

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #624 on: December 09, 2016, 02:41:29 AM »
There is a major difference if it was a 3 way deal, or a 2&2
The difference is,
I know someone, who's doing the same thing (I hope he doesn't get messed over) B needs money and he asked A if he could charge his card and pay back in 45 days (b4 the closing day) as far as A is concerned B is swiping it in his Own business, in order to pay the bills that needs to be paid,
A Authorized the charge as long as he gets the 'Goods'  that he was promised which in this case is money when his bill is due
Now if bY decides to go use as credit card in a third party  location that charge was not necessarily authorized as a third person charged but authorized as B charge
 And since it was authorized as a  B charge,  as far as A  is concerned he is disputing a charge from B
Thank you! If someone didn't understand I considered this an A/B deal then they must be from another planet. Not until all the facts were laid out clearly did I say this was an A/B/C deal.
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Mplace

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #625 on: December 09, 2016, 02:42:34 AM »
If only life worked this way.
it most definitely does, if you pay for goods or services, and you don't receive it, you most definitely can dispute, as you didn't get what you paid for (might be an argument though)
What's your plan for yud shvat?

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #626 on: December 09, 2016, 02:43:02 AM »
Thank you! If someone didn't understand I considered this an A/B then they must be from another planet. Not until all the facts were laid out clearly did I say this was an A/B/C deal.
Now can you please clearly explain to me why you assumed this to be an A/B case and why that now changed, and why it makes a difference?

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #627 on: December 09, 2016, 02:44:23 AM »
it most definitely does, if you pay for goods or services, and you don't receive it, you most definitely can dispute, as you didn't get what you paid for (might be an argument though)
Simple question. If you call up Amex and tell them your reason for disputing, will they agree?

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #628 on: December 09, 2016, 02:46:59 AM »
Either way in case it really makes a difference I'll PM you the exact charge.
The charge was legit. How did PP get involved? He paid for the service via PP? How much was the charge?
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #629 on: December 09, 2016, 02:47:48 AM »
The charge was legit. How did PP get involved? He paid for the service via PP? How much was the charge?
Yes. Paid via PayPal. 3K

Offline Mplace

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #630 on: December 09, 2016, 02:48:37 AM »
Simple question. If you call up Amex and tell them your reason for disputing, will they agree?
in this case (swiping for cash) no they will terminate their relationship with you
 But in most situations yes I think
 If you tell them that you bought something and it never arrived and the merchant doesn't want to help you out then yes you will most probably win a dispute
What's your plan for yud shvat?

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #631 on: December 09, 2016, 02:49:13 AM »
Simple question. If you call up Amex and tell them your reason for disputing, will they agree?
Of course not. See how simple that was. Now my turn.
If A called up Amex and explained this whole deal to them as the reason why he wanted to add an AU would they let him?
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #632 on: December 09, 2016, 02:50:30 AM »
Of course not. See how simple that was. Now my turn.
If A called up Amex and explained this whole deal to them as the reason why he wanted to add an AU would they let him?
Yes. 100%. Without a doubt.

Offline Mplace

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #633 on: December 09, 2016, 02:50:39 AM »
If A called up Amex and explained this whole deal to them as the reason why he wanted to add an AU would they let him?
as I said, no they will shut A  down :)
What's your plan for yud shvat?

Offline shulem92

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #635 on: December 09, 2016, 02:51:40 AM »


There is more at stake when you get suspended besides the dispute amount.

Offline shulem92

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #636 on: December 09, 2016, 02:52:01 AM »
There is more at stake when you get suspended besides the dispute amount.
Gotcha

Offline JTZ

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #637 on: December 09, 2016, 02:53:15 AM »
There is more at stake when you get suspended besides the dispute amount.
A is out tens of thousands. What am I missing?
"LESS IS MORE" It is the cumulative effect that kills deals!!! How many times do I have to say this?  >:(

Offline Mplace

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #638 on: December 09, 2016, 02:53:41 AM »
Yes. 100%. Without a doubt.
I know someone who lost amex, cuz he told them the 'truth' of the charge,
Hoping that if he's honest they will let him off with a warning, didn't work as planned
What's your plan for yud shvat?

Offline Emkay

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #639 on: December 09, 2016, 02:54:09 AM »
A is out tens of thousands. What am I missing?
Based on the last 1000 posts, a whole lot