Topic Wiki

https://www.dansdeals.com/more/dans-commentary/dark-side-earning-credit-card-points-psa-dont-swipe-others/

https://www.mixcloud.com/zev-brenner/talkline-with-zev-brenner-on-credit-card-scams-affecting-the-orthodox-jewish-community/

http://podcast.headlinesbook.com/e/31616-credit-card-miles-and-points-swiping-for-rewards-buying-and-selling-miles-is-it-assur-and-a-chillul-hashem-or-a-great-way-for-a-side-parnassah/



BEFORE SWIPING FOR SOMEONE READ THIS: (first hand story)

https://forums.dansdeals.com/index.php?topic=36812.msg2062371#msg2062371
https://www.dansdeals.com/more/dans-commentary/dark-side-earning-credit-card-points-psa-dont-swipe-others/#comment-1399884


Dan's warning to DDF:
I hope people realize that any buying group or anyone else that gets merchandise in advance of payment can go south at any time. That's even if you get a check at the time of delivery.
X-posting as I don't want anyone to say that I never put a warning here.

A story that ended up in court - https://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/nyscef/DocumentList?docketId=iRcRHuyZUdOIx69D00a5XQ==&display=all&courtType=Kings%20County%20Supreme%20Court&resultsPageNum=1


I am one of the biggest buyers for buying groups, I have done millions in transactions and have sent to every group there is over the past 3 years. Most buying groups are okay, some scan in slower than others, some pay slower than others - most will lose a few packages over the year. You can research and find which are better for you.

However there is a bigger problem now with Amazon itself.  Amazon in the past has been great with any problems always ready with a refund for lost packages even if it was thousands of dollars. Lately Amazon has clamped down and has tagged these buying groups addresses  in their systems as "freight forwarder" and now no longer will fix any problem you have whatsoever. Doesn't matter what the problem is, even if it shows the package was never delivered, amazon will not help you in any way. Their copy and paste response will always be "this item was sent to a freight forwarder and we're unable to replace or refund the item. We recommend contacting your freight forwarder for more details, as we don't have any more insight or information regarding this matter, For more information about sending items via freight forwarders, please visit our Help Pages: https://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=201117950." As well the amazon drivers either must know this or have been increasingly bad at delivering packages because the numbers of packages missing has gone up astronomically. Previously you would have very few packages missing, now the past 3 months I have had 59 "lost" packages. I now have over $15,000 of loses and some guy in Delaware is probably living the life with all the stuff he stole from me. I will survive, I have made a lot more than $15,000 over the years however just a warning to others here that things are not as they used to be and it really is no longer worth doing buring groups with all the loses piling up

« Last edited by Yo ssi on July 24, 2023, 06:47:26 PM »

Author Topic: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others  (Read 1182960 times)

Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2480 on: February 24, 2019, 09:09:56 PM »
There is a heimeshe course in the NY area that offers a free payment option: giving them your personal info and they take the money from the points.
The problem is that people are falling for it.
POIDH
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Fish Tank

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2481 on: February 24, 2019, 09:19:18 PM »
One of these scams now is run by the owner of a lakewood school. He probably did this as well...
Which school?

Offline Mountain Man

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2482 on: February 24, 2019, 09:43:38 PM »
I feel like the key word for this thread is recklessly. I use buying groups and though I would hate to take a total haircut the max I've ever been owed in total was apx 30k. A loss like that would suck but I've paid back more than that in student loans so I know I can dig myself out of that hole and a it wouldn't wreck me. But a 200-300k loss, that would wreck most anyone's finances. It's basically like having your home burn down and you are uninsured.

I think that the BG's and other shtick can be a great way to get extra cash to sock away. Personally I try to max out my Roth IRA's with the extra "income" so I never end up relying on it. That's really a big sticking point in this game. So many people end up relying on the point revenue that once a stream dries they have all sorts of nasty things to say instead of being grateful that they fell into such an easy revenue stream in the first place.

But as many have said there's risk involved. It's very hard to know your risk tolerance. I work for a large fund company and I overhear CSR talking with clients about their risk tolerance on a scale of 1-10. It's laughable when you hear, um I think 8? If you think your risk tolerance is an 8 you should expect to have 50%+ drawdowns perhaps 2-4 times in a 50 year investment plan. If you want to think about risk tolerance 30k = crashing an uninsured brand new car into a brick wall for a total loss. 200-300k = burning down your house without insurance. If you really think about how you would feel if either happened to you, you'd start to have a clearer idea of what your risk tolerance is.

Quote from: JTZ link=topic=10531.msg1695873
If you never had to eat crow then you lived one boring life.

Offline ayman

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2483 on: February 24, 2019, 09:55:30 PM »
But a 200-300k loss, that would wreck most anyone's finances. It's basically like having your home burn down and you are uninsured.
LOL, clearly don't live in LA, NYC etc.
Buy discounted gift cards from me.
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Offline aygart

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2484 on: February 24, 2019, 09:59:46 PM »
LOL, clearly don't live in LA, NYC etc.
-1 don't include the value of the land
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline ExGingi

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2485 on: February 24, 2019, 10:04:00 PM »
-1 don't include the value of the land
When last did you check construction costs in NYC?
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Offline Mountain Man

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2486 on: February 24, 2019, 10:07:14 PM »
LOL, clearly don't live in LA, NYC etc.
Proudly  ;D

-1 don't include the value of the land
Maybe 300-400k. Most of the home value in LA or NYC (assuming detached 3 bed 3 bath home) is in the land value. You don't lose the land when your home burns down.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2019, 10:10:57 PM by Mountain Man »
Quote from: JTZ link=topic=10531.msg1695873
If you never had to eat crow then you lived one boring life.

Offline Mo2

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2487 on: February 24, 2019, 10:08:59 PM »
Any critiques before I post?
https://www.dansdeals.com/more/dans-commentary/dark-side-earning-credit-card-points-psa-dont-swipe-others/
ישר כוח ר' דניאל
Personally I was always responsible when it came to these things. I thought it was common sense. I was shocked to find out how many friends and relatives were swiping in massive quantities without realizing the risks, including bochurim, girls & young kollel ppl.
This post was extremely neccessary.
It cracked me up when even my father shared your post on our family WhatsApp. 
A post on your MS has a far reach and hopefully it will bring sufficient awareness.
Thank you.
« Last Edit: February 24, 2019, 10:17:47 PM by Mo2 »
Common sense is not a gift, it is a punishment.
Because you have to deal with everyone who doesn't have it.

Offline Redbull3

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2488 on: February 24, 2019, 10:15:59 PM »
Great piece Dan. DD has brand equity in the realm of personal finance in the orthodox community (where these events are prevalent) and bottom line people listen when he speaks. Just stating his thoughts and advice alone goes a long way. As such I think just stating axioms like the quotes below is the best strategy to hopefully plant some seeds and get conversations going. I don't think Dan needed to post specific details.

"do not open a credit card if you are going to go into debt for it"
"You should never lend more than you can afford to lose"
"Never give anyone your personal information and never give anyone access to your credit line or to goods that you paid for unless you realize that it is the same as cash and can afford to lose it all."

Offline yelped

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2489 on: February 24, 2019, 10:18:49 PM »
He didn't want to tell me. (He might've been afraid I'd sound an alarm)
If you ask me he has a chiyuv to tell you, and we all have a chiyuv to call up that school and give them a good yelling.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2490 on: February 24, 2019, 10:40:14 PM »
I remember seeing the letter from the school a while back.. don't remember which school.

Offline Hab

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2491 on: February 24, 2019, 10:41:40 PM »
Ok I will answer what I know:

The main seasons were Kinnus HaShluchim, Kinnus HaShluchos, and Pesach. They carried stuff with foreign voltage for that reason. Esrogim was finished by the time I got there.

There was no warehouse for the store, just the basement and a garage. I don't think they were overstocked, maybe just a disorganized look.

The SIM cards were a good product, as CH attracts a lot of foreigners. An Israeli or Frenchie who comes for Tishrei to 770 is getting one from Sterling, not a bodega.

It wasn't a huge operation, and the owners were real small business shopkeepers. It wasn't a "front", it was just were it started from. In my time, there was no investor for the store itself.

I hope this meets @Password criteria.

I know this personally and the store had a warehouse in lakewood

Offline churnbabychurn

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Offline Mordyk

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Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2494 on: February 24, 2019, 11:02:48 PM »
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Mountain Man

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2495 on: February 24, 2019, 11:04:09 PM »
Quote from: JTZ link=topic=10531.msg1695873
If you never had to eat crow then you lived one boring life.

Offline shapsam

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2496 on: February 24, 2019, 11:07:32 PM »
Care to translate for us korean illiterates?
Translate it on Chrome.
https://www.milemoa.com/bbs/board/5940389
How did you find that, do you actually follow that blog?

Offline Moshe123

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2498 on: February 24, 2019, 11:09:26 PM »
Dans dill.

Quote
Dan Cine Dill = Jewish Miles

 

Here are the three things I check every day, up to Slick Dill. Secondly, it is a surprise if the Koreans gather hard for miles, but when they see Jews gathering, their mouths open. So it seems to fall into this scam too. 

Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2499 on: February 24, 2019, 11:12:18 PM »
How did you find that, do you actually follow that blog?
It's the number one referring site to that post right now.
Shmais is 2.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.