Author Topic: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others  (Read 222171 times)

Offline Naftuli19

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2610 on: February 25, 2019, 07:39:05 PM »
I know people that settled for Ę10 on the dollar with Chase and were able open new Chase cards a few years later.
Chase is prob the hardest bank to get CL after any kind of settlements.
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Offline PSA2

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2611 on: February 25, 2019, 07:52:08 PM »
Can someone detail the different consequences between, filling bankrupcy vs settling with the bank
Anybody with knowledge (not theory ) can please chime in?

Offline aro123

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2612 on: February 25, 2019, 08:06:28 PM »
Are you missing the whole point?
i very clearly wrote "without laying out a penny " . not "not risking a penny ".

Offline aygart

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2613 on: February 25, 2019, 08:08:14 PM »
i very clearly wrote "without laying out a penny " . not "not risking a penny ".
So the answer is yes
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline aro123

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2614 on: February 25, 2019, 08:31:23 PM »
So the answer is yes
no. it's called leverage.  more risk and more return.  to make 24% on interest free leveraged money is a much higher rate of return.  obviously u should only do it if you have 25k in available liquidity  to cover your risk

Offline ExGingi

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2615 on: February 25, 2019, 08:33:38 PM »
Can someone detail the different consequences between, filling bankrupcy vs settling with the bank
Anybody with knowledge (not theory ) can please chime in?

There are a few differences that I am aware of, let's start with the potential tax consequences.

Debt eliminated in bankruptcy qualifies for an exemption from inclusion in gross income. Debt otherwise cancelled is included in taxable income, unless an insolvency exclusion applies (equity in your home and retirement assets are included in the calculation). 
I've been waiting over 5 years with bated breath for someone to say that!
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Online LoLo

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2616 on: February 25, 2019, 08:45:16 PM »
no. it's called leverage.  more risk and more return.  to make 24% on interest free leveraged money is a much higher rate of return.  obviously u should only do it if you have 25k in available liquidity  to cover your risk
Most people swiping had no clue there was any risk at all.

Offline aro123

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2617 on: February 25, 2019, 08:56:24 PM »
Most people swiping had no clue there was any risk at all.
i agree and that is a major problem but many people made tons taking some risk and every situation is a different risk/return. and to make a blanket statement that no one should ever do it and everyone that did it is stupid and naive and needs to get an education is also wrong. plenty of smart people with education have also taken too big of risks and lost everything . (and a lot of them had much more to lose than a bankruptcy on their credit report)

Offline aygart

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2618 on: February 25, 2019, 09:19:07 PM »
no. it's called leverage.  more risk and more return.  to make 24% on interest free leveraged money is a much higher rate of return.  obviously u should only do it if you have 25k in available liquidity  to cover your risk
No it is called irresponsible leverage.
i agree and that is a major problem but many people made tons taking some risk and every situation is a different risk/return. and to make a blanket statement that no one should ever do it and everyone that did it is stupid and naive and needs to get an education is also wrong. plenty of smart people with education have also taken too big of risks and lost everything . (and a lot of them had much more to lose than a bankruptcy on their credit report)
Whether the risks occurred does not change whether they existed. To leverage your entire financial stability on any investment is irresponsible. To "invest"in such a venture where they cannot get loans from people who can afford to lose it is irresponsible even if it is not leveraging your financial stability. To do both in one shot.....

That doesn't mean the people are stupid or naive, it means they did something irresponsible that they probably should have known better than to do. These things happen all the time that people do stupid things that they should have known better. Sometimes it is financial sometimes it is with their health sometimes it is with their spouse or someone else.

That some people made goods returns on it is totally irrelevant to the conversation and that you are even bringing it up shows that you missed the point.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2019, 09:22:24 PM by aygart »
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline aro123

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2619 on: February 25, 2019, 09:22:22 PM »
No it is called irresponsible leverage.Whether the risks occurred does not change whether they existed. To leverage your entire financial stability on any investment is irresponsible. To "invest"in such a venture where they cannot get loans from people who can afford to lose it is irresponsible even if it is not leveraging your financial stability. To do both in one shot.....

That doesn't mean the people are stupid or naive, it means they did something irresponsible that they probably should have known better than to do.

That some people made goods returns on it is totally irrelevant to the conversation and that you are even bringing it up shows that you missed the point.
why is it irresponsible leverage for someone who has 100k of liquid assets and 500k of net worth to swipe 25k a month for a 240% annual return

Offline aygart

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2620 on: February 25, 2019, 09:27:26 PM »
why is it irresponsible leverage for someone who has 100k of liquid assets and 500k of net worth to swipe 25k a month for a 240% annual return
1. Explain your numbers in detail.

2. If you don't understand the risks and w why they can't get regular loans?

3. 25% of liquid net worth is not what we are dealing with here. I'm not even sure why you are bringing it in.
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2621 on: February 25, 2019, 10:40:23 PM »
why is it irresponsible leverage for someone who has 100k of liquid assets and 500k of net worth to swipe 25k a month for a 240% annual return
If you are sufficiently liquid, fully understand the risk vs reward and all of it's implications just go ahead! No one is stopping you. And Dan's post wasn't for a "sophisticated investor" or someone registered with SEC.
If you get it, and understand the risk, and are not simply desperately living of points because you have no honest way to make ends meet, gezunteh heit.


[Happens to be that there is someone worth  many many millions who "invested" in sungames... So maybe even you should take another thinking]

Offline Chief Rabbi of New York

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2622 on: February 25, 2019, 10:41:20 PM »
The companies that swiped by their own company other peopleís cards
Why donít people bring a criminal investigation towards them ?
Isnít that totally illegal and something they can get out of
Show Some Respect for Me, I am The Chief Rabbi of New York :)

Online sillypainter

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2623 on: February 25, 2019, 11:00:27 PM »
The companies that swiped by their own company other peopleís cards
Why donít people bring a criminal investigation towards them ?
Isnít that totally illegal and something they can get out of

CRONY, this is the LAST warning. Stop or I'll ban you for life. You make me cringe when you post about this topic.

Offline S209

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #2624 on: February 25, 2019, 11:02:39 PM »
There are a few differences that I am aware of, let's start with the potential tax consequences.

Debt eliminated in bankruptcy qualifies for an exemption from inclusion in gross income. Debt otherwise cancelled is included in taxable income, unless an insolvency exclusion applies (equity in your home and retirement assets are included in the calculation).
Donít you think if youíd settle this with a bank you can file this as a business and take a deduction on the money you lost to the scheme, thus offsetting the settlement income dollar for dollar?
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