Author Topic: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others  (Read 489470 times)

Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3180 on: March 06, 2019, 02:33:13 PM »
"The IRS will not assert that any taxpayer has understated his federal tax liability by reason of the receipt or personal use of frequent flyer miles"
If you convert to cash, then you should speak to your accountant.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Online skyguy918

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3181 on: March 06, 2019, 02:34:09 PM »
Personally I'm earning miles and I use them, but if you're selling them then you should ask your accountant. Scale also matters.
Right, that's exactly my point. I'm not worried about you or most people, but it's pretty safe to assume that people with heavy losses from the swipe farms fall into the 'large scale' and 'selling points/miles' category. That makes this question about taxation very important to this discussion/thread.

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3182 on: March 06, 2019, 02:35:12 PM »
"The IRS will not assert that any taxpayer has understated his federal tax liability by reason of the receipt or personal use of frequent flyer miles"
If you convert to cash, then you should speak to your accountant.
This has all been discussed plenty in multiple threads. As you said, scale matters and also that letter is not necessarily binding..

Ask your accountant.

Offline mmgfarb

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3183 on: March 06, 2019, 02:36:03 PM »
1) While there might be ways to phrase the dispute that wont be a straight out lie, at the end of the day the reality is all cc holder's lent money to someone on his own credit card, and the swiper did not pay back. While you are not under oath, you are in a way trying to defraud the bank Whatever you are going to tell the bank is misconstruing the truth, and essentially a lie which is a problem halachichally as well, since you are attempting to steal money from the bank.
2) If you lose the dispute, that would mean the bank did their investigation, and decided you are in the wrong. It just might make things much harder when trying to settle with the bank afterwards
3) Disputing brings much more attention to your account and connecting you to the story, wherein defaulting/settling you are one of many people that that go through that process
The banks know about each an every one or the people involved. Hell, they're even shutting people down who swiped once, years ago. There's no way you're staying under the radar by not disputing.
"JS [is] a fetid cesspool of unvarnished linguistic manure, with lots of useless drivel and post-padding." -Moishebatchy

Offline churnbabychurn

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3184 on: March 06, 2019, 02:36:43 PM »
Right, that's exactly my point. I'm not worried about you or most people, but it's pretty safe to assume that people with heavy losses from the swipe farms fall into the 'large scale' and 'selling points/miles' category. That makes this question about taxation very important to this discussion/thread.
One things for sure, if someone is "making a living" of credit cards in any way, imho it would be a tough sell to the irs that nothing is due.

Offline Yard sale

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3185 on: March 06, 2019, 02:39:10 PM »
"The IRS will not assert that any taxpayer has understated his federal tax liability by reason of the receipt or personal use of frequent flyer miles"
If you convert to cash, then you should speak to your accountant.

Next paragraph:
“This relief does not apply to travel or other promotional benefits that are converted to cash”.

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/a-02-18.pdf

Offline PSA

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3186 on: March 06, 2019, 02:42:16 PM »
The banks know about each an every one or the people involved. Hell, they're even shutting people down who swiped once, years ago. There's no way you're staying under the radar by not disputing.
-1 You seem to just like make bold statements. Are you a lawyer? Are you a Rav?

Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3187 on: March 06, 2019, 02:43:12 PM »
1) While there might be ways to phrase the dispute that wont be a straight out lie, at the end of the day the reality is all cc holder's lent money to someone on his own credit card, and the swiper did not pay back. While you are not under oath, you are in a way trying to defraud the bank Whatever you are going to tell the bank is misconstruing the truth, and essentially a lie which is a problem halachichally as well, since you are attempting to steal money from the bank.
2) If you lose the dispute, that would mean the bank did their investigation, and decided you are in the wrong. It just might make things much harder when trying to settle with the bank afterwards
3) Disputing brings much more attention to your account and connecting you to the story, wherein defaulting/settling you are one of many people that that go through that process
Did a non-biased lawyer tell you this?
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline Dan

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3188 on: March 06, 2019, 02:43:47 PM »
Next paragraph:
“This relief does not apply to travel or other promotional benefits that are converted to cash”.

https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-drop/a-02-18.pdf

As I said, with cash you need to talk to your accountant. It's worth discussing that 2% from a cashback card is not taxable under ordinary circumstances.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Online LoLo

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3189 on: March 06, 2019, 02:44:07 PM »
-1 You seem to just like make bold statements. Are you a lawyer? Are you a Rav?
He stated a fact that everyone is on the radar, not sure why he needs to be a Rav or a lawyer to know that.

Offline PSA

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3190 on: March 06, 2019, 02:45:17 PM »
Did a non-biased lawyer tell you this?
More then one
He stated a fact that everyone is on the radar, not sure why he needs to be a Rav or a lawyer to know that.
Does not address any of the other points I made

Offline mmgfarb

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3191 on: March 06, 2019, 02:46:32 PM »
-1 You seem to just like make bold statements. Are you a lawyer? Are you a Rav?
I know for a fact that people have been either AA'd or FRed for transactions that took place years ago, that would imply strongly that the banks are looking at every single transaction that these companies did. If you have reason to believe otherwise then please share but there's no logical reason to believe that anyone who is in this mess is going to fly under the radar.
"JS [is] a fetid cesspool of unvarnished linguistic manure, with lots of useless drivel and post-padding." -Moishebatchy

Offline PSA

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3192 on: March 06, 2019, 02:51:09 PM »
I know for a fact that people have been either AA'd or FRed for transactions that took place years ago, that would imply strongly that the banks are looking at every single transaction that these companies did. If you have reason to believe otherwise then please share but there's no logical reason to believe that anyone who is in this mess is going to fly under the radar.
Imply strongly... No logical reason...

Still did not address any of my other points.

Funny how all of a sudden everyone is a legal expert and can give advise disputing credit cards.

Offline mmgfarb

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3193 on: March 06, 2019, 02:57:40 PM »


Imply strongly... No logical reason...

Still did not address any of my other points.

Funny how all of a sudden everyone is a legal expert and can give advise disputing credit cards.

I was only addressing your third point that you would stay under the radar by not disputing. I haven't given any advice about disputing or any other legal matter. I just think that anyone who is under the impression that not disputing will keep you under the radar is either deluding themselves or is being told that by someone with alterior motives. As I said, if you have reason to believe that what I said isn't true then please share but from everything I can see here and elsewhere, there is no reason to think that the banks aren't looking at every transaction.
"JS [is] a fetid cesspool of unvarnished linguistic manure, with lots of useless drivel and post-padding." -Moishebatchy

Offline aygart

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3194 on: March 06, 2019, 03:00:57 PM »
He has a well paid staff of producers who seem competent in sourcing and prepping him.
Very nice, but it does not replace real knowledge of the topic.

a little learning is a dangerous thing. Sort of like giving advise on disputing credit card by being a DDF member.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Yard sale

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3195 on: March 06, 2019, 03:11:12 PM »
As I said, with cash you need to talk to your accountant. It's worth discussing that 2% from a cashback card is not taxable under ordinary circumstances.

If you mean swiping for personal use where it can be considered a rebate on the purchase price absolutely. For business (or for swiping income, cc farm etc.) there will likely be tax implications.

Offline aygart

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3196 on: March 06, 2019, 03:19:46 PM »
If you mean swiping for personal use where it can be considered a rebate on the purchase price absolutely. For business (or for swiping income, cc farm etc.) there will likely be tax implications.
How could something be a rebate on an item purchased when there is no item purchased? (I think I am agreeing with you)
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline knowitall

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3197 on: March 06, 2019, 03:24:00 PM »
Looks like this thread may need to get split off again.

Relevant question:
Was Sterling paying victim's CC directly, or were they giving checks for what they swiped?

Offline knowitall

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3198 on: March 06, 2019, 03:26:49 PM »
Listening now to the Brenner interview for the first time.

A few takeaways so far.

1. I say um too much.
2. It does sound like AT is personally involved in $50MM+ of these cases, though which side for each is unclear.
3. AT says disputing can get you in criminal trouble as you affirming under oath that you don't recognize the charge, but an initial chargeback isn't an affirmation under oath. Of course it may come to that, but it should not be hard to at least initiate a chargeback without those repercussions.
I have no clue if Sterling on Central Ave in Lawrence is affiliated, but listen to how AT answers the question, it definitely sounds like he's hiding something.

Offline Yard sale

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Re: PSA: Don't swipe recklessly for others
« Reply #3199 on: March 06, 2019, 03:29:46 PM »
How could something be a rebate on an item purchased when there is no item purchased? (I think I am agreeing with you)
Well, if the card was swiped by a supplier the rebate would be on the cost of the supplies. If it was directly swiped by the business, the rebate would be on the amount “lent” to the business. In either case it would lower the cost basis, and have tax implications when the full amount before the rebate is paid back to the credit card holder.