Any Lawyers out there of whom I may ask a question?

[ckmk47]

Whenever a tenant whose original term of leasing shall be for a period of one month or longer shall hold over or remain in possession of the demised premises beyond the term of the letting, the tenancy created by or resulting from acceptance of rent by the landlord shall be a tenancy from month to month N.J.S.A. 46:8-10

In Green v. Verma court ruled that the the clause landlord inserted was ok. But they were lawyers. (and roughed up the landlord in court).

in Gamble v. Connolly tenants were able to argue that the lease provision is an unconscionable “term of adhesion,”. I would argue the same.

Wow! Great info!
So the tenant is free to leave.

[churnbabychurn]

Wow! Great info!
So the tenant is free to leave.

No!
The law is only if there is no agreement to the contrary.

Question is if the agreement is valid or not.

[ckmk47]

No!
The law is only if there is no agreement to the contrary.

Question is if the agreement is valid or not.

Got it.

[ExGingi]

in Gamble v. Connolly tenants were able to argue that the lease provision is an unconscionable “term of adhesion,”. I would argue the same.

I am not a lawyer, but I've heard of "contract of adhesion", not of "term of adhesion".

From my personal experience, leases are almost always negotiable, with language added or crossed out from the standard form. Wouldn't that negate the "term of adhesion" argument?

In my responses above, I wasn't arguing law, I am not qualified for that (despite some very limited knowledge in certain areas), I was suggesting real life practical approaches. The fact that you are bringing a legal argument against the contract, just strengthens my PRACTICAL approach. Since the landlord won't win by default in court, he has to weigh his options before pursuing that route. Many times they will just move on.

[bubkiz]

I am not a lawyer, but I've heard of "contract of adhesion", not of "term of adhesion".

From my personal experience, leases are almost always negotiable, with language added or crossed out from the standard form. Wouldn't that negate the "term of adhesion" argument?

In my responses above, I wasn't arguing law, I am not qualified for that (despite some very limited knowledge in certain areas), I was suggesting real life practical approaches. The fact that you are bringing a legal argument against the contract, just strengthens my PRACTICAL approach. Since the landlord won't win by default in court, he has to weigh his options before pursuing that route. Many times they will just move on.

+1
Keep in mind that the tenants are usually viewed as the underdog against the "greedy" landlord which makes it much harder to litigate for the landlords.

I had a somewhat similar situation when I was a tenant and even though the landlord may have won in court, they moved on. The cost of serving papers, having a lawyer represent them, the possibility of the case getting pushed off, etc. will usually deter legal action unless there is a large amount at stake or they want to make a korbon out of you.

[churnbabychurn]

Yeah, but how about reports on credit report? Do they need a court judgment for that, or can they just file 30/90 day late ?

Also, are these simple to remove?

[ExGingi]

Yeah, but how about reports on credit report? Do they need a court judgment for that, or can they just file 30/90 day late ?

Also, are these simple to remove?

I would guess that unless they are a professional landlord, they wouldn't even go that route.

If it reaches credit report, you can probably fight. Request validation, etc. etc.

[churnbabychurn]

I would guess that unless they are a professional landlord, they wouldn't even go that route.

If it reaches credit report, you can probably fight. Request validation, etc. etc.

They are professional. But the risk of a judge invalidating this nasty clause will ruin their contract for hundreds of units.

They may not want to take that risk...

[churnbabychurn]

I would guess that unless they are a professional landlord, they wouldn't even go that route.

If it reaches credit report, you can probably fight. Request validation, etc. etc.

Wouldn't it reach the credit report fast? Will the put collection people to chase the tenant? Can they without a court order?

[henche]

I am not a lawyer, but I've heard of "contract of adhesion", not of "term of adhesion".

From my personal experience, leases are almost always negotiable, with language added or crossed out from the standard form. Wouldn't that negate the "term of adhesion" argument?

In my personal experience, leases are never negotiable.

[ExGingi]

In my personal experience, leases are never negotiable.

-1

I have negotiated leases.

Obviously if it's an owner's market, owners won't bother negotiating, as they can easily find someone else. However, in such a scenario, how likely are they to spend resources pursuing a tenant for early termination? They might even be happy, as they can get a new tenant at more favorable terms.

[churnbabychurn]

Would attorneys be interested in handling this on contingency?
When tenant wins, they will collect the fees from the wealthy and oppressive landlord.
Should be a pretty easy case. Matter of drafting a couple of letters. I can't imagine landlord wants to risk a judge invalidating the clause. - would be a major hit to business model.

 

[thaber]

As someone on the other side of the table, I'm struggling to understand how any landlord anywhere can unilaterally renew for a year. He can change terms, but can't extend a contract. what happens after the expiration of the lease is explicated in the actual lease in every lease I've ever seen. Perhaps automatic yearly renewals are there?
As an aside, it's not difficult to get a judgment, and it's really not difficult to report to credit/ collections, many services do it for you for a nominal fee.

[noturbizniss]

Any real estate lawyers here I can pm a question to?

[good sam]

Any real estate lawyers here I can pm a question to?

Yup

[noturbizniss]

Yup

Thanks,but too late. Got question answered.

[elit]

I am not sure if this is the right thread but.... I am trying to figure out how to figure out zoning rules for a shul in a specific part of Nassau County, I cant find anything that I understand online.  Is that a real estate lawyer question? Does anyone here have knowledge or know how to find that info out? Thanks!

[Am]

I am not sure if this is the right thread but.... I am trying to figure out how to figure out zoning rules for a shul in a specific part of Nassau County, I cant find anything that I understand online.  Is that a real estate lawyer question? Does anyone here have knowledge or know how to find that info out? Thanks!

Land use attorney. You can also ask your engineer.

[elit]

Land use attorney. You can also ask your engineer.

didn't know there is such a thing. Any land use attorneys on here?

[Am]

didn't know there is such a thing. Any land use attorneys on here?

If you didn't need a land use attorney for the job then ask the engineer. If it's a simple answer, he'll just answer. Otherwise, Zoning due diligence is one of the services that Civil engineers do.