Author Topic: Talking in shull  (Read 4105 times)

Offline chevron

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Dec 2013
  • Posts: 2552
  • Total likes: 543
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
Talking in shull
« on: March 14, 2014, 03:20:18 PM »
Talking in shull, something I am guilty of too but really try not too :( but I dont get it, there can be people machmir on such small stuff but talk during kadish etc.. In light of the recent tragedy's in Chabad, I was told that Rav Yehuda Kalman Marlow zt'l once said that talking in shull brings the makas hamavs to the community.

There are many many sources on this and including the mi sh'beirach of the Tosfos Yom Tov which, to my understanding, is read out loud in some shulls ?

I am also constantly reminded of the story the Lemburger Rav? tells and likewise from Rav Avigdor Miller

Offline ilherman

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jun 2013
  • Posts: 8935
  • Total likes: 227
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 35
    • View Profile
  • Location: Brooklyn
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2014, 03:32:30 PM »
Maybe we should starts a thread where members will be Mekobel themselves not to talk for the next 4 weeks lets say.
You can say what you think when you think what you say.

Offline chevron

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Dec 2013
  • Posts: 2552
  • Total likes: 543
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2014, 03:59:25 PM »
Maybe we should starts a thread where members will be Mekobel themselves not to talk for the next 4 weeks lets say.

The thing with talking I realized also is you're choteh umechateh.. Whereas if you just signal for after shull you did 2 mitzvos.

I saw this http://www.lmaanyishmeu.com/pdf/85%20-%20Standing%20before%20the%20King.pdf

Although i'd say some very controversial stuff has been said, like Rav Wosner Shlita

But I found this thanks to Mordechai Pearlman, the text of the Tosfos Yomtov M'sheberach

www.ottmall.com/mj_ht_arch/v21/mj_v21i14.html

  "The One who blessed our fathers; Avraham, Yitzchok, and Yaakov, Moshe,
and Aharon, Dovid and Shlomo; He should bless everyone who guards his
mouth and tongue from talking during davening.  Hashem should protect him
from every trouble and distress, from every plague and illness; and all
the blessing of the Torah, Nevi'im and K'suvim should rest upon him; and
he should merit to have children who will live and last (presumably not
die in childbirth); and he should be able to raise them to Torah, Chupa,
and good deeds; and he should be able to serve Hashem our G-d always with
truth and sincerity, and we should say Amen."

Offline good sam

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Jun 2011
  • Posts: 3340
  • Total likes: 558
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 10
    • View Profile
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #3 on: March 14, 2014, 04:03:28 PM »
Talking in shull, something I am guilty of too but really try not too :( but I dont get it, there can be people machmir on such small stuff but talk during kadish etc..
+1000 Finally something we agree on.

It's something I'm careful (though not perfect) about, and I literally can't stand it when I see rabbanim talking to mispallilim during kadish, chazoras hashatz, etc.
If you don't care why would you comment?
HT: DMYD

Offline chevron

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Dec 2013
  • Posts: 2552
  • Total likes: 543
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2014, 04:10:12 PM »
+1000 Finally something we agree on.

It's something I'm careful (though not perfect) about, and I literally can't stand it when I see rabbanim talking to mispallilim during kadish, chazoras hashatz, etc.

I agree its hard to resist, especially there are people you only see once a week in shull etc.. but its such a clear issur and we are at least according to Rav Miller hurting other's tefilot, disturbing others and according to some bringing plagues on to the community

Offline YitzyS

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2015
  • Posts: 5552
  • Total likes: 13697
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 34
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: Lakewood, NJ
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2023, 07:19:06 PM »
BUMP, for G-d's sake!

Offline Definitions

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jan 2018
  • Posts: 1748
  • Total likes: 480
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 3
    • View Profile
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2023, 07:27:15 PM »
Who spells shul with 2 L's?
My Tapatalk notifications don't always work.

Online moko

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Jul 2011
  • Posts: 4567
  • Total likes: 1484
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
  • Location: BOS
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #7 on: June 18, 2023, 07:35:07 PM »
BUMP, for G-d's sake!
www.stopthetalking.org










61 videos in total on a topic which apparently defended by the DDF community




Offline YitzyS

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Jan 2015
  • Posts: 5552
  • Total likes: 13697
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 34
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: Lakewood, NJ
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #8 on: June 18, 2023, 07:35:18 PM »
Who spells shul with 2 L's?
The "Coronavirus and Your Shul" thread, which incidentally was started by the OP, was spelled with two Ls until it was changed by JJ after tens of pages.

Offline Yo ssi

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Aug 2019
  • Posts: 6657
  • Total likes: 2588
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 60
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2023, 08:49:45 PM »
Obviously it's not comparable, but let's not pretend that it's not celebrating/institutionalizing talking during shul.
Haven't been to enough shuls to know for certain, but I'd assume that most shuls have the kiddush club not in the main davening area, which is a great way to have less talking in shul perhaps.
_    ,
' )  /
 /  / __   _   _   o
(__/_(_)  /_)_/_)_<_
 //
(/

Offline avromie7

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Feb 2014
  • Posts: 8188
  • Total likes: 2713
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 6
    • View Profile
  • Location: Lakewood
Re: About that &quot;jewish&quot; wedding
« Reply #10 on: June 18, 2023, 09:09:33 PM »

Leaving the shul is quite the opposite. Instead of talking in shul, they bring the conversation outside.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline Dan

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 50K Diamond Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 67599
  • Total likes: 16912
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 16442
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: CLE
  • Programs: UA GS, AA EXP, DL Dirt, Hyatt Glob, Fairmont Lifetime Plat, DD Diamond, Blocked By @NeriaKraus
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #11 on: June 18, 2023, 09:16:21 PM »
Haven't been to enough shuls to know for certain, but I'd assume that most shuls have the kiddush club not in the main davening area, which is a great way to have less talking in shul perhaps.
Leaving the shul is quite the opposite. Instead of talking in shul, they bring the conversation outside.
Leaving the shul is quite the opposite. Instead of talking in shul, they bring the conversation outside.
Sure, nothing like dragging a good portion of the shul outside for a drinking and shmoozing party instead of listening to kriah and davening musaf.
Sets a great example for the kids too!
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline yungermanchik

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Nov 2018
  • Posts: 2668
  • Total likes: 2047
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
  • Location: Previous Signatures: If you chapped hana'ah from a post, like it; You think you know the answers and things are the way they seem.. it just ain't so -The Rebbe from Lublin-
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #12 on: June 18, 2023, 09:19:23 PM »
Sure, nothing like dragging a good portion of the shul outside for a drinking and shmoozing party instead of listening to kriah and davening musaf.
Sets a great example for the kids too!
Nobody said "It's Great", The only thing that was said is that it's NOT talking in shul, and for those who can't control themselves, it's probably the lesser of the 2 evils.
Small people talk about other people.
Average people talk about things
BIG PEOPLE TALK ABOUT IDEAS.

Offline LNS

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite + Lifetime Gold Elite
  • ******
  • Join Date: Aug 2017
  • Posts: 800
  • Total likes: 278
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
    • View Profile
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #13 on: June 18, 2023, 09:20:33 PM »
just curious if the shuls where talking and Kiddush clubs are so prevalent does the rav speak about it or not?

Offline avromie7

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *********
  • Join Date: Feb 2014
  • Posts: 8188
  • Total likes: 2713
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 6
    • View Profile
  • Location: Lakewood
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #14 on: June 18, 2023, 09:29:32 PM »
Sure, nothing like dragging a good portion of the shul outside for a drinking and shmoozing party instead of listening to kriah and davening musaf.
Sets a great example for the kids too!
Take a step back, there is a shul where people shmooze during davening. The rav says instead of schmoozing in the shul, let's make "an attraction" outside the shul for people who can't sit quietly for so long. Now we come to today, that this great idea to stop talking in shul became a symbol of institutionalized shul talking.
I wonder what people who type "u" instead of "you" do with all their free time.

Offline Dan

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 50K Diamond Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 67599
  • Total likes: 16912
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 16442
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: CLE
  • Programs: UA GS, AA EXP, DL Dirt, Hyatt Glob, Fairmont Lifetime Plat, DD Diamond, Blocked By @NeriaKraus
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #15 on: June 18, 2023, 10:16:43 PM »
Take a step back, there is a shul where people shmooze during davening. The rav says instead of schmoozing in the shul, let's make "an attraction" outside the shul for people who can't sit quietly for so long. Now we come to today, that this great idea to stop talking in shul became a symbol of institutionalized shul talking.
Are you serious? You think that's how they started?

https://web.archive.org/web/20080213195759/http://www.ou.org/other/5765/kiddushclubsrw65.htm

https://jewishchronicle.timesofisrael.com/kiddush-clubs-are-becoming-a-destructive-force/
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Online aygart

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 17399
  • Total likes: 14339
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 14
    • View Profile
    • Lower Watt Energy Brokers
  • Programs: www.lowerwatt.com
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #16 on: June 18, 2023, 10:45:41 PM »
Haven't been to enough shuls to know for certain, but I'd assume that most shuls have the kiddush club not in the main davening area, which is a great way to have less talking in shul perhaps.
Leaving the shul is quite the opposite. Instead of talking in shul, they bring the conversation outside.
It is definitely less disturbing yet debatable which is a worse thing to do. Leaving during leining is one of things about which we say ועוזבי ה' יכלו And leaving early from lack of patience is described in אורחות יושר As אין לך מבזה עבודתו של של הקב"ה יותר מזה וכאילו אינו מאמין ששכינה נמצאת בביהכ"נ So They are both pretty bad.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline Dan

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 50K Diamond Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 67599
  • Total likes: 16912
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 16442
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: CLE
  • Programs: UA GS, AA EXP, DL Dirt, Hyatt Glob, Fairmont Lifetime Plat, DD Diamond, Blocked By @NeriaKraus
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #17 on: June 18, 2023, 10:47:33 PM »
It is definitely less disturbing yet debatable which is a worse thing to do. Leaving during leining is one of things about which we say ועוזבי ה' יכלו And leaving early from lack of patience is described in אורחות יושר As אין לך מבזה עבודתו של של הקב"ה יותר מזה וכאילו אינו מאמין ששכינה נמצאת בביהכ"נ So They are both pretty bad.
Equally bad from a chinuch perspective, except that people know talking in shul is wrong, whereas kiddush club is institutionalized/celebrated, so I'd argue that it's worse.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.

Offline chevron

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Dec 2013
  • Posts: 2552
  • Total likes: 543
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #18 on: June 18, 2023, 10:52:47 PM »
I don't really blame people, tefillah is very long and we live in an ADD society of connectivity.

I actually think that people should go outside to talk. 

We can shorten davening,

Or, why not simply split it up? Like on simchas Torah. After kriah, make a kiddush.. have your break.. go back for yekum purkan

Offline Dan

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 50K Diamond Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: May 2008
  • Posts: 67599
  • Total likes: 16912
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 16442
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
  • Location: CLE
  • Programs: UA GS, AA EXP, DL Dirt, Hyatt Glob, Fairmont Lifetime Plat, DD Diamond, Blocked By @NeriaKraus
Re: Talking in shull
« Reply #19 on: June 18, 2023, 10:54:50 PM »
I don't really blame people, tefillah is very long and we live in an ADD society of connectivity.

I actually think that people should go outside to talk. 

We can shorten davening,

Or, why not simply split it up? Like on simchas Torah. After kriah, make a kiddush.. have your break.. go back for yekum purkan
No need to shorten davening. Just cut out the dead space so people don't get restless and have a nice kiddush afterwards to shmooze.
Save your time, I don't answer PM. Post it in the forum and a dedicated DDF'er will get back to you as soon as possible.