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Will anyone answer this question or should I just delete the thread :)

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Total Members Voted: 4

Voting closed: April 28, 2014, 09:12:32 AM

Author Topic: Taking Point in Mortgage  (Read 1396 times)

Offline puddles

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Taking Point in Mortgage
« on: April 25, 2014, 07:27:23 AM »
I've been told that there are some banks that will pay you to take points (eg a higher interest rate) as opposed to paying points (and taking a lower interest rate).
The general idea is you take a higher rate the bank hands you a check and you refinance six months down the road when rates are hopefully within the range you could have had six months ago.
Other than the interest rate risk, is there anything else anyone knows about this. Am I missing something?

Offline MarkS

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Re: Taking Point in Mortgage
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2014, 10:06:57 AM »
I've been told that there are some banks that will pay you to take points (eg a higher interest rate) as opposed to paying points (and taking a lower interest rate).
The general idea is you take a higher rate the bank hands you a check and you refinance six months down the road when rates are hopefully within the range you could have had six months ago.
Other than the interest rate risk, is there anything else anyone knows about this. Am I missing something?
Keep in mind that refinancing can cost money negating any of the gain!

Offline puddles

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Re: Taking Point in Mortgage
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2014, 11:04:51 AM »
Keep in mind that refinancing can cost money negating any of the gain!
I am aware. The amount being paid obviously has to be great enough to cover the closing costs on a Refi.

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Taking Point in Mortgage
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2014, 01:09:49 PM »
I've been told that there are some banks that will pay you to take points (eg a higher interest rate) as opposed to paying points (and taking a lower interest rate).
The general idea is you take a higher rate the bank hands you a check and you refinance six months down the road when rates are hopefully within the range you could have had six months ago.
Other than the interest rate risk, is there anything else anyone knows about this. Am I missing something?
It's a silly way to bet on interest rates. You can accomplish the same thing for less with futures and options on the 10yr Treasury. The decision as to where on a particular rate sheet you want to be (buying or 'selling' points) should be primarily based on breakeven calculation and how long you expect to stay in that house/loan.

Offline henche

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Re: Taking Point in Mortgage
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2014, 06:57:41 PM »
In case anyone is wondering what he is talking about (I was), I found this article this morning, but didn't have time to post it until now http://www.bankrate.com/brm/news/mortgages/20060126a1.asp

Offline skyguy918

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Re: Taking Point in Mortgage
« Reply #5 on: April 27, 2014, 02:11:25 PM »
In case anyone is wondering what he is talking about (I was), I found this article this morning, but didn't have time to post it until now http://www.bankrate.com/brm/news/mortgages/20060126a1.asp
Not sure if you were referring to the OP or to my comment, but that article doesn't address the question/topic of the OP. The article is specifically about 'buying points', which means paying the bank to give you a lower interest rate on your loan. Many lenders also offer the option to 'sell points' (I don't think anyone uses that term, it's just a way to contrast to the buying option), which means that the bank pays you to take a higher interest rate on the loan.

While the concept of a calculating a breakeven point applies equally to 'selling points', the OP was asking about a specific strategy that I've found some mortgage brokers try to push. The strategy is predicated on the idea that historically, in the very short term (say 6 months) mortgage rates remain stable. So if the 'no points' rate you would get today is 4%, and you take $5000 from the bank in exchange for a 5% rate, in 6 months you would refinance back to (hopefully still available) 4%. As long as the refi costs are less than $5000, you'll have done better than just going with 4% to begin with. You'd also have to factor in paying the higher monthly mortgage payment for 6 months, but that shouldn't be a huge issue.

As you can pretty easily see, the profit/loss compared with just taking the no points option to begin with comes solely from the movement of mortgage rates during the 6 months between your original mortgage and your refi. And as I already mentioned, this is a terrible way to bet on interest rates. The only thing people should take into account when deciding which rate on a particular rate sheet they should select (positive or negative points, or no points) is the breakeven calc.