Author Topic: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban  (Read 11989 times)

Offline Centro

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: May 2012
  • Posts: 2973
  • Total likes: 4
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 33
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #60 on: May 16, 2014, 08:01:29 PM »
You guys have it quite wrong;

It's not about Lubavitch, it's not about Tanya and it's not about chassidus,
It's just that Satmar gives much a stricter Chinuch then everyone else, therefore they'll try to keep there kids from gatherings or so which would give there child a different point of view of which they see at home, for example, marching on the streets with caps, etc.

A child gets different feelings and starts wanting different things,
That's basically why Satmar banned this parade,
It has nothing to do with the fact that Lubavitch is the one who's organizing it,

Look, they didn't ban the simches bies ha'shievah on 13th even though it's Lubavitch.

Offline jj1000

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: Jun 2008
  • Posts: 10848
  • Total likes: 1015
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 8015
    • View Profile
  • Location: The value of a forum such as this one is not in that one can post a question and receive an answer, but in that the question has most likely been asked before, and the answer is available to him that will but only use the search function.
  • Programs: 1. Search on google. 2. Search in the right board of DDF with a general word or two. 3. Read the wiki. 4. Read the thread. 5. Ask away.
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #61 on: May 16, 2014, 08:08:27 PM »
Im not answering for satmar,  but in this instance,  what you're saying   doesn't make much sense.

The Kol Koreh was meant for the kids FWIU.  They don't want thier kids getting influences from chabad.  (and maybe thry suspect luring,  as others here have posted. )

That problem doesn't really exist with a normal  stable adult who already found his path over the last 20+ years of his life (hopefully).  (obviously we all have nisyonos,  but this isn't exactly a nisayaon)

I don't have a good comparison,  but I'll try. 

Would you want your  kids playing with the goyim on the block? Leaning all the curse words,  etc?

When they get older,  they  go to work,  and many times thier surrounded by goyim.  We hope by that age their hashkafas are already well built and very strong.  And because there's no alternative,  they go wrong with goyim.

I'm not comparing chabad to goyim. I'm comparing a different scenario for you to realize that  adult life and childlife aaren't the same -  influentialey.   

I think you just summed up the problem Dan has very well and how he compared it to the reason the temple was destroyed and why we mourn during sfira.

The problem is that some sects of Judaism look at others as if they are goyim and they can't associate or have their children play with each other. At the Parade they say psakim from tanach get treats and maybe sing some jewish songs. If you can't allow yidishe children to get together to do say psakim and tehhilim and posibbly even say we want moshiach now *gasp* then ya it is a major problem.

All hashkafas aside if someone is frum you can't look at them as goyim and that you'd be afraid to let your kid attend one of "their" events is sad IMHO and definitely not achdus.

I don't think this is the view of most satmar anyway, and this whole letter and call is probably a hoax.

See my 5 step program to your left <--

(Real signature under my location)

Offline ganizzy

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Mar 2010
  • Posts: 1062
  • Total likes: 3
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #62 on: May 16, 2014, 08:11:02 PM »
Vechter wasn't trying to make anyone chabad, he was teaching tanya.
He found it,  loved it and choose to share.
I guess it was a big enough crime to almost be killed for.

And what's interesting is,  is that he prob wouldn't have become chabad if he ant forced to leave satmar. He would have been chabad friendly,  learned tanya and gone to the Rebbe once every few years.

The point of the parade isn't too spread chabad minhogim,  it's too unite all Jews by having a parade showcasing Jewish pride.
Each organization makes a float depicting a Jewish theme. There's speeches. ...

The fact is that this is the Boro Park parade.  There will be barely any lubavitchers there, so they can't say do u want to end up like them.
And the shluchim in Boro Park  dress in Boro Park standards

Offline jj1000

  • Administrator
  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • **********
  • Join Date: Jun 2008
  • Posts: 10848
  • Total likes: 1015
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 8015
    • View Profile
  • Location: The value of a forum such as this one is not in that one can post a question and receive an answer, but in that the question has most likely been asked before, and the answer is available to him that will but only use the search function.
  • Programs: 1. Search on google. 2. Search in the right board of DDF with a general word or two. 3. Read the wiki. 4. Read the thread. 5. Ask away.
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #63 on: May 16, 2014, 08:22:19 PM »
$20 says the Shluchim in BP made the letter and phone call to make it controversial so they will get a bigger turn out. :))
See my 5 step program to your left <--

(Real signature under my location)

Offline SamKey

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Mar 2013
  • Posts: 3314
  • Total likes: 11
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
  • Location: If I'm there I can't be here and if I'm here I can't be there
  • Programs: National EE; Hertz PC; Sixt Plt; Avis First; Hilton Gold; Priority Club Plt; West Bestern DE; Carlson Club GE; Accor PLT
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #64 on: May 17, 2014, 06:58:33 PM »
FWIW I have gotten the feeling from numerous encounters with chabadniks (far from all), especially Israeli ones, that they were trying to "chap"me

Offline oiseli48

  • Dansdeals Platinum Elite
  • ****
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 386
  • Total likes: 2
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #65 on: May 17, 2014, 09:47:22 PM »
If Satmar wants to keep their kids under their watch Lag B'Omer, maybe it's time someone tells them to make their own parade, instead of just forbidding someone else's.

Offline theberk

  • Dansdeals Gold Elite
  • ***
  • Join Date: Mar 2013
  • Posts: 201
  • Total likes: 0
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 1
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #66 on: May 17, 2014, 11:25:03 PM »
$20 says the Shluchim in BP made the letter and phone call to make it controversial so they will get a bigger turn out. :))
They didn't make it but they don't mind it.

Offline Satmar Lady

  • Non-Elite Member
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 0
  • Total likes: 1
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #67 on: May 18, 2014, 02:56:59 AM »
I think you just summed up the problem Dan has very well and how he compared it to the reason the temple was destroyed and why we mourn during sfira.

The problem is that some sects of Judaism look at others as if they are goyim and they can't associate or have their children play with each other. At the Parade they say psakim from tanach get treats and maybe sing some jewish songs. If you can't allow yidishe children to get together to do say psakim and tehhilim and posibbly even say we want moshiach now *gasp* then ya it is a major problem.

All hashkafas aside if someone is frum you can't look at them as goyim and that you'd be afraid to let your kid attend one of "their" events is sad IMHO and definitely not achdus.

I don't think this is the view of most satmar anyway, and this whole letter and call is probably a hoax.

I wasn't planning on posting on this thread, as I personally wouldn't have any issue with my kids attending the parade, but I respect the view of those who do. But this post was very upsetting. "some sects of Judaism look at others as if they are goyim" - assuming you are referring to Satmar, the topic of this discussion - if Satmar really does consider chabadniks as if they are goyim, why did they put an unbelievable effort into raising money for the Rubashkin cause, like no other orthodox community did? Why would they set up the call center to donate money for a Chabadnik in a village none other than Kiryas Yoel?
I'm not trying to condone the letter, just pointing out that it is a difference in chinuch and nothing else. And I would expect you to use the very same ahavas yisroel and respect this way of child-rearing, just like you would probably expect the MO to respect the restrictions all of us ultra-orthodox implement into our chinuch which they don't.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 03:55:49 AM by Satmar Lady »

Offline plainbachur

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Dec 2011
  • Posts: 1870
  • Total likes: 18
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 5
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #68 on: May 18, 2014, 03:12:22 AM »

I wasn't planning on posting on this thread, as I personally wouldn't have any issue with my kids attending the parade, but I respect the view of those who do. But this post was very upsetting. "some sects of Judaism look at others as if they are goyim" - assuming you are referring to Satmar, the topic of this discussion - if Satmar really does consider chabadniks as if they are goyim, why did they put in an unbelievable amount of effort to raise money for the Rubashkin cause, like no other orthodox community did? Why would they set up the call center to donate money for a Chabadnik in a village none other than Kiryas Yoel?
I'm not trying to condone the letter, just pointing out that it is a difference in chinuch and nothing else. And I would expect you to use the very same ahavas yisroel and respect this way of child-rearing, just like you would probably expect the MO to respect the restrictions all of us ultra-orthodox implement into our chinuch which they don't.
rubashkin is a non chabad matter don't bring into this thread

Offline sillypainter

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Jan 2012
  • Posts: 1557
  • Total likes: 43
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
  • Gender: Male
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #69 on: May 18, 2014, 03:20:46 AM »
rubashkin is a non chabad matter don't bring into this thread

If you don't have anything intelligent to say, then don't.

Offline Satmar Lady

  • Non-Elite Member
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 0
  • Total likes: 1
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #70 on: May 18, 2014, 03:32:02 AM »
rubashkin is a non chabad matter don't bring into this thread
Wasn't referring to the Rubashkin matter per se. Just pointing out that he considers himself Chabad, and as such, according to JJ, Satmar would've considered him a goy and wouldn't have loved him like a fellow Jew. I don't believe this to be true.

Offline ganizzy

  • Dansdeals Lifetime Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Mar 2010
  • Posts: 1062
  • Total likes: 3
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 2
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #71 on: May 18, 2014, 03:34:29 AM »
I think the issue isn't so much about people not wanting their kids to go,  I can understand that.
It's that the tone of the letter and the call make it seem more anti chabad then anti lowering standards.

When u couple the wording with the history u get the automatic defensive reaction.

And rubashkin isn't the only example of satmars ahavas yisrael to chabad.  There is more,  but there is also a pretty strong history and a general feeling.

 

Offline Satmar Lady

  • Non-Elite Member
  • Join Date: Nov 2013
  • Posts: 0
  • Total likes: 1
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #72 on: May 18, 2014, 03:42:08 AM »
I think the issue isn't so much about people not wanting their kids to go,  I can understand that.
It's that the tone of the letter and the call make it seem more anti chabad then anti lowering standards.

When u couple the wording with the history u get the automatic defensive reaction.

And rubashkin isn't the only example of satmars ahavas yisrael to chabad.  There is more,  but there is also a pretty strong history and a general feeling.
I wouldn't have worded it that way either. But I wouldn't have worded the problem as considering them to be goyim. It's just Satmar's strong, outspoken style at work here.
"but there is also a pretty strong history and a general feeling" - yeah, same here... hence the harshness of it all.

Offline joeb1

  • Dansdeals Presidential Platinum Elite
  • ********
  • Join Date: Aug 2011
  • Posts: 2909
  • Total likes: 1
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 0
    • View Profile
  • Location: Brooklyn
  • Programs: SPG Platinum, Hyatt Diamond, Hilton Diamond, CPA, Travel Agent
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #73 on: May 18, 2014, 08:49:50 AM »
They are allowed to tell their kids not to to go to the parade but there are many ways to do something and negative flyers and phone calls like that ain't the way to go

Offline TimT

  • Dansdeals Lifetime 10K Presidential Platinum Elite
  • *******
  • Join Date: Dec 2013
  • Posts: 17854
  • Total likes: 912
  • DansDeals.com Hat Tips 3
    • View Profile
Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #74 on: May 18, 2014, 09:10:42 AM »
I take my kids there every year. It's always beautiful. They're not trying to chap anyone in. The program is always full of non-Lubavitcher speakers.