Author Topic: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban  (Read 11988 times)

Offline Vosizderneias

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #75 on: May 18, 2014, 10:43:31 AM »
Theres a sect in nigeria called "western education is a sin" AKA boko haram, they gather inspiration for what they do via being anti-everything etc. 

Offline Achas Veachas

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #76 on: May 18, 2014, 11:11:47 AM »
Theres a sect in nigeria called "western education is a sin" AKA boko haram, they gather inspiration for what they do via being anti-everything etc. 
The way to fight disrespect is not by showing disrespect...
Curiosity made the cat smarter.

Offline Vosizderneias

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #77 on: May 18, 2014, 12:09:31 PM »

The way to fight disrespect is not by showing disrespect...
no disrespect intended, and fore sure not a fight. But theres a pretty clear correlation between ideologies of getting inspired by being against other people.

Offline Satmar Lady

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #78 on: May 18, 2014, 12:44:07 PM »
Theres a sect in nigeria called "western education is a sin" AKA boko haram, they gather inspiration for what they do via being anti-everything etc.
...and so they kidnap innocent little girls to force them to become like them.
Now please try to help me understand how you compare them to Satmar, a community whose chessed and bikur cholim organizations help every Jew in need from all types and stripes - Chassidish, Litvish, modern, Yemenite, Persian (special Satmar organization for the last two) etc.
Satmar has a shittah which is different from most orthodox, so we like to keep to ourselves. That does not mean we hate those who don't follow our ways. Absolutely not. It's about the shittah and nothing else, no intention to be davka anti anyone for the sake of being anti. Granted, the language leaves room for improvement. But it's the bark that is worse than the bite (or kiss...)
I don't think Lubavitch does much to mingle with other Yidden either (and yes, they do it in a much quiter way which I find commendable). Their attendance at multi-community events which are not organized by them and them alone is, I think, even less than that of Satmar. Is it because you consider all other Yidden to be Goyim? Is it because you are anti everyone?
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 12:48:16 PM by Satmar Lady »

Offline Moshe123

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #79 on: May 18, 2014, 01:05:10 PM »
...and so they kidnap innocent little girls to force them to become like them.
Now please try to help me understand how you compare them to Satmar, a community whose chessed and bikur cholim organizations help every Jew in need from all types and stripes - Chassidish, Litvish, modern, Yemenite, Persian (special Satmar organization for the last two) etc.
Satmar has a shittah which is different from most orthodox, so we like to keep to ourselves. That does not mean we hate those who don't follow our ways. Absolutely not. It's about the shittah and nothing else, no intention to be davka anti anyone for the sake of being anti. Granted, the language leaves room for improvement. But it's the bark that is worse than the bite (or kiss...)
I don't think Lubavitch does much to mingle with other Yidden either (and yes, they do it in a much quiter way which I find commendable). Their attendance at multi-community events which are not organized by them and them alone is, I think, even less than that of Satmar. Is it because you consider all other Yidden to be Goyim? Is it because you are anti everyone?

I agree with your reading of the post-machlokes Satmar.
It used to not be this way. The 1980's aren't forgotten so fast.

Offline Satmar Lady

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #80 on: May 18, 2014, 01:10:07 PM »
It used to not be this way. The 1980's aren't forgotten so fast.
Once again - Yeah, same here... and there are still tape recordings for proof. (You're Belz, right?)

Offline Moshe123

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #81 on: May 18, 2014, 01:21:37 PM »
Correct

Offline Satmar Lady

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #82 on: May 18, 2014, 01:39:23 PM »
Correct
So were talking about machlokes which were caused by very personal attacks and then disproportionate retaliation. Both were wrong IMO, but neither of them more wrong than the other. This has nothing to do with being anti anyone just because their view is different than ours. The Satmar Rebbe zt"l kept close ties with many gedolim that held different opinions but had as much kavod hatorah and kavod zekeinim to respect his view for the great talmid chacham and Torah leader that he was.

Offline Moshe123

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #83 on: May 18, 2014, 01:52:39 PM »
And the root to it all was one side trying to impose its worldview on the rest of Torah Jewry. Let's not lose the forest for the trees.
And this was the point I wanted to make in the first place.
Chabad might have tried certain things, but in its history it never used coercion by intimidation.
Yes, Satmar has changed a lot in recent years. Mostly IMHO  due to circumstances of internal strife and loss of power over events in Torah Jewry in America due to loss in public opinion rather than any change in shita.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 01:56:31 PM by Moshe123 »

Offline Satmar Lady

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #84 on: May 18, 2014, 02:41:39 PM »
And the root to it all was one side trying to impose its worldview on the rest of Torah Jewry. Let's not lose the forest for the trees.
And this was the point I wanted to make in the first place.
Chabad might have tried certain things, but in its history it never used coercion by intimidation.
Yes, Satmar has changed a lot in recent years. Mostly IMHO  due to circumstances of internal strife and loss of power over events in Torah Jewry in America due to loss in public opinion rather than any change in shita.
Alright, this is not going the way I intended it to. I was very careful to stay away from blaming one side only, and to take the blame for what we are responsible. Doesn't seem like you are planning to do so. Let's just say that there are 2 sides to what you are mentioning above but I am keeping mine to myself.
« Last Edit: May 18, 2014, 03:19:56 PM by Satmar Lady »

Offline TimT

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #85 on: May 18, 2014, 06:13:02 PM »
It was beautiful as usual. Nobody was trying to influence anyone. I've taken my kids for several years & they still don't even know that it's done by Lubavitch. R' Ginzberg does an amazing job every year. & yes, there were plenty of satmarers there.

Offline A European

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #86 on: May 18, 2014, 06:17:05 PM »
Well said!

Satmar unfortunately had their bad experience with chabad when one of their teachers was caught influencing his students to join chabad. They respect chabad very much, but they have a right to shelter their young children from leaving their Mesorah.

That's a lie!
The magid shiur (harav Vechter) did not  convinced no one to join chabad!

They caught him learning chassidus chabad, so they kicked him out of satmer and told his x-talmidim that he is a kofer.....,

but you can't lie just like this to kids/bochurim so they went to Crown Hights to check the place where their beloved teacher "became a kofer" (because they know that it is impossible that such a yrei shomaim when off the way!)

And guess what they found there.......a real kolel! (yes! they were told in satmer that Chabad don't learn and are frei women don't go to the mikve......)

And the rest is history....


P.S. I think that today satmer is not so close minded any more about lubavich but I know 100% that that was the case back then...


Offline ilherman

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #87 on: May 18, 2014, 06:45:16 PM »
That's a lie!
The magid shiur (harav Vechter) did not  convinced no one to join chabad!

They caught him learning chassidus chabad, so they kicked him out of satmer and told his x-talmidim that he is a kofer.....,

but you can't lie just like this to kids/bochurim so they went to Crown Hights to check the place where their beloved teacher "became a kofer" (because they know that it is impossible that such a yrei shomaim when off the way!)

And guess what they found there.......a real kolel! (yes! they were told in satmer that Chabad don't learn and are frei women don't go to the mikve......)

And the rest is history....


P.S. I think that today satmer is not so close minded any more about lubavich but I know 100% that that was the case back then...
And I know 100% that that was NOT the case.
You can say what you think when you think what you say.

Offline A European

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade Ban
« Reply #88 on: May 18, 2014, 06:47:55 PM »
And I know 100% that that was NOT the case.
I have some very close friends from this community (x-satmer now lubavich) so I know the story pretty well.

Offline meshugener

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Re: Chabad Lag B'Omer Parade
« Reply #89 on: May 18, 2014, 10:32:56 PM »
This is nothing to do with hate.
There are very strong hashkafik disagreements between many sects and chabad. (-really?!  ;) ) For whatever reason, Chabad always had an interest in selling/trying to influence others to their derech and hashkafa. -Arguably this is what the parade idea was all about.- Satmar and others are entitled to raise their kids al pi their derech without the kids having undue influence from other mehalchim. When I was growing up, we were also warned very strongly not to go near the chabad parades which were designed to entertain and entice kids....

Not trying to start a chabad bashing fest, I just don't think that satmar is so out of line here at all.
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