Satmar Rebbe's comments on the three murdered teens

[Achas Veachas]

Now, the only difference between him and other Gedolei Yisroel is that Satmar ruv had written a very rich written saifer called V'yoel Moshe and also Al Hagilah Val Hatmira where he explains him self very well vs all other gedoliem which no one did,
So just saying "He doesn't know what he's talking about" is stupid, you gotto see what he says and then you could debate.

The Lubavitcher Rebbe explained his shitah very well in letters and Sichos, I believe R' Yoel Kahn put out a Kuntres explaining the lubavitch Shitah.

[TimT]

Followers of r' zalman leib are criticizing remarks made by r' Aron. Big shocker !!

[dovy2]

Do you really think that hashem makes a miracle through people that deny his existence and do everything against his will? I'm not saying anything against lubavitche rebbe, but don't walk blindly into the wall.

And why not? did you ever learn Navi melachim?

[sillypainter]

And why not? did you ever learn Navi melachim?

Adarabah, please enlighten us.

[dovy2]

Adarabah, please enlighten us.

Almost all of the malchei yisroel were terrible reshaim. Nevertheless, countless miracles happened through them, because it is still a kiddush hashem if the yidden win a battle.
Also, Moshe rabeinu's excuse to hashem not to wipe out the yidden by the slav, is that the goyim don't understand the concept of being frum or not, and the being punished can end up being a chilul hashem.
The same thing is with the Israelis. Religious or not, they're looked at by the world as the Jewish people, and then winning is a kiddush hashem

[sky121]

This thread seems to show a lot of what is wrong with yiddeshkeit today in my eyes.

Unfortunately just because a man is called the Rebbee doesn't make him perfect by any means.  Or right necessarily. (And I'm not talking about any Rebbe specifically. )

Second, everyone is entitled to their thoughts and ideas. Everyone. You. Me. The Satmer Rebbe . Every other Rebbe. Everyone.

You don't have to agree with every single thing your Rebbe thinks, or your sect of Judaism thinks or the people around you. Contrary to popular belief yidden can have their own thoughts and opinions.

And for the people who with this topic specifically aren't able to understand why someone might think living in the settlements is dangerous or why someone might think it's important to live in the settlements than there's a good chance you're not letting yourself really think about things and try to understand the situation. 

And making comments about what everyone should or shouldn't believe with this topic is kind of silly. 

We're not all supposed to have the same thoughts and opinions. But we are supposed to be loving towards one another and get along regardless.

[TimT]

This thread seems to show a lot of what is wrong with yiddeshkeit today in my eyes.

Unfortunately just because a man is called the Rebbee doesn't make him perfect by any means.  Or right necessarily. (And I'm not talking about any Rebbe specifically. )

Second, everyone is entitled to their thoughts and ideas. Everyone. You. Me. The Satmer Rebbe . Every other Rebbe. Everyone.

You don't have to agree with every single thing your Rebbe thinks, or your sect of Judaism thinks or the people around you. Contrary to popular belief yidden can have their own thoughts and opinions.

And for the people who with this topic specifically aren't able to understand why someone might think living in the settlements is dangerous or why someone might think it's important to live in the settlements than there's a good chance you're not letting yourself really think about things and try to understand the situation. 

And making comments about what everyone should or shouldn't believe with this topic is kind of silly. 

We're not all supposed to have the same thoughts and opinions. But we are supposed to be loving towards one another.

My problem is how soon he said it. These parents just went through the most traumatic thing possible. Wait a little bit.

[sky121]

My problem is how soon he said it. These parents just went through the most traumatic thing possible. Wait a little bit.

I agree. I didn't think it was appropriate timing.  At least on the forums all it seemed to accomplish was going from a thread where we were all United, hoping, praying together to..this.

In all seriousness, his opinion aside what exactly was he trying to accomplish with what he said? Anyone?

[AI-TRAVEL]

I agree. I didn't think it was appropriate timing.  At least on the forums all it seemed to accomplish was going from a thread where we were all United, hoping, praying together to..this.

In all seriousness, his opinion aside what exactly was he trying to accomplish with what he said? Anyone?

I think he was trying to bring a point, that yes it's a tragedy and very sad BUT you must also look at why this tragedy happened.

[sky121]

I think he was trying to bring a point, that yes it's a tragedy and very sad BUT you must also look at why this tragedy happened.

So he's saying he thinks they were just in the wrong place?

[AI-TRAVEL]

So he's saying he thinks they were just in the wrong place?

If you call being a zionest in the wrong place then yes.

[sky121]

So he's saying being a Zionist causes tragedy? Is he worried his followers are going off? Or just reminding them that Zionism is wrong?

[AI-TRAVEL]

So he's saying being a Zionist causes tragedy? Is he worried his followers are going off? Or just reminding them that Zionism is wrong?

I am not sure what your getting at. But from what I understand, which may not be right, the answer to your first qustion is yes. With plausible explanation being, 1. Zionism is a averiah. 2. you are not alowed to put yourself in sakana, which it seems that zionest do on a day to day basis. Regarding your second qustion I really don't know. Regarding the third, I don't see the problem of reminding and talking against averios, that's if of course you hold zionism is.

[george]

A unique perspective from a native west bank "settler":

http://blogs.timesofisrael.com/do-not-disregard-the-words-of-the-satmer-rebbe-just-change-the-emphasis/#ixzz36R1friOf

[Baruch]

If already quoting scripture, why not mention the many times that the torah promises that the land will "spit us out"? Like for not keeping shimita properly, giluy arayos, etc etc.

did you see the question mark at the end of my post? I was not defending his position, I was asking him if he was referring to that pasuk.

[SamKey]

My problem is how soon he said it. These parents just went through the most traumatic thing possible. Wait a little bit.

I agree. I didn't think it was appropriate timing.  At least on the forums all it seemed to accomplish was going from a thread where we were all United, hoping, praying together to..this.

In all seriousness, his opinion aside what exactly was he trying to accomplish with what he said? Anyone?

I don't know if he was right or wrong but I am positive he knew what he was doing and he did it with that in mind

[MenachemS]

Do you really think that hashem makes a miracle through people that deny his existence and do everything against his will? I'm not saying anything against lubavitche rebbe, but don't walk blindly into the wall.

Are you Hashem?

What's the difference between you and them? If you were in their shoes (raised like them) would you be any different? And as you are now can you say you are perfect from Aveiros?

Is that what makes a Yid? Is that what makes us different from the Goyim? If we identify yidden only by their beliefs, that means that we are conceding that the Zionists are right! They think we are a nation like all other nations! If we can't look at a Yid past his superficial actions and appearance than we are a nation like all other nations.

[MenachemS]

I don't know if he was right or wrong but I am positive he knew what he was doing and he did it with that in mind

Enough! What he said was dead wrong! Stop defending it!

[sky121]

I don't know if he was right or wrong but I am positive he knew what he was doing and he did it with that in mind

Right, just wondering if we knew what that was. Didn't want to miss the boat.  Anyways...His followers aren't Zionists and I'm sure they know where he stands on such issues. Hope they got whatever he intended them to out of it.

[MenachemS]

I am not sure what your getting at. But from what I understand, which may not be right, the answer to your first qustion is yes. With plausible explanation being, 1. Zionism is a averiah. 2. you are not alowed to put yourself in sakana, which it seems that zionest do on a day to day basis. Regarding your second qustion I really don't know. Regarding the third, I don't see the problem of reminding and talking against averios, that's if of course you hold zionism is.

You guys need help. In your zeal to accuse another Yid of such a horrible thing (being responsible for their child's death) you resort to ridiculous falsehoods, such as the kids being in a makom sakanah which is categorically untrue!!