Poll

Should Dan Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?

Yes, please
No

Author Topic: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?  (Read 52103 times)

Offline yakov116

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #160 on: September 09, 2014, 09:20:51 AM »
WTH are these ravs thinking?!
They believe in god and god said that there is a Torah with laws and we shall follow them. Have a problem take it up with god not the rabbi!

Do they not care about other past and future victims?  They should be prosecuted
Obviously they took that into account and they felt that in THIS case that would not be the case.
Money talks...mine says goodbye!

Offline Joe4007

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #161 on: September 09, 2014, 09:25:23 AM »
Hello, Starwood, yes my names is Daraius Dubash.  ;D ;D ;D ;D
Hi Mr. Dubash, you currently have 3,300 points available, what can we do for you?...

Offline ShlockDoc

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #162 on: September 09, 2014, 09:26:15 AM »
They believe in god and god said that there is a Torah with laws and we shall follow them. Have a problem take it up with god not the rabbi!

I don't have a problem with god or the torah, I have a problem with these rabbi's interpretation of the torah. 


Offline yakov116

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #163 on: September 09, 2014, 09:28:25 AM »
I don't have a problem with god or the torah, I have a problem with these rabbi's interpretation of the torah.
So why don't you ask a rabbi what would be the ruling in such a case and see if they differ with the first?
Any way who are you to differ with a rabbi?

Money talks...mine says goodbye!

Offline ShlockDoc

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #164 on: September 09, 2014, 09:33:17 AM »
So why don't you ask a rabbi what would be the ruling in such a case and see if they differ with the first?
Any way who are you to differ with a rabbi?

Hehe. "Rabbi" = Infallible and unquestionable like God?  Anyway, taking this way off topic. Sorry about that...  We should start a different thread to discuss these ridiculous piskei "halacha" and the infallibility of someone who has the word Rabbi in front of his name.

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #165 on: September 09, 2014, 09:46:57 AM »
Hehe. "Rabbi" = Infallible and unquestionable like God?  Anyway, taking this way off topic. Sorry about that...  We should start a different thread to discuss these ridiculous piskei "halacha" and the infallibility of someone who has the word Rabbi in front of his name.
I would love to see that thread.  :)
I just found a new supply of forks!

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #166 on: September 09, 2014, 09:59:25 AM »
Not sure. If I do it will be condensed.

Thought this might be helpful. Here is a condensed version that skips the intricate details of the story and primarily serves as a warning to others, without getting into the how frum the guy is:

You know me as the guy with lot of miles. I’m also the guy who got scammed out of hundreds of thousands of them. I’ll spare you the details, as they are long and confusing, but I’d like to share a few warnings to help everyone keep their accounts safe.

An individual who follows this site and even attended one of my seminars managed to books dozens of stays for himself, his friends and family using the points in one of my accounts. With only my name, he managed to convince the phone booking agents he was in fact me, and they booked tens of thousands of dollars worth of hotel stays for him.

What can you do to avoid this?

1) Keep your profile up to date

Because the email address associated with the account was an old email address I never check or use, I did not see email confirmations for any of the bookings and it went on for months before I caught on.

Keep your email, phone and address information up to date, and you’ll get notified whenever there is activity on your account.

2) Monitor your accounts

Make a habit of checking your account balances at least once a month, and ensuring there are no unauthorized transactions. You should already be doing this with your credit card statements, do it with your mileage accounts, too.

3) Be careful who you trust.

I gave away free suite nights at various hotels around the world, but no longer can do that after one of the winners spent thousands at the minibar and other incidentals.

Thank G-d, in all the above cases, I had my points reinstated and money refunded. But it caused many stressful days and an unbelievable headache.

Unfortunately, the various loyalty programs we’ve come to know and love seem to have a few exploitable security breaches.  Please stay vigilant and make sure it doesn’t happen to you.

Offline AnonymousUser

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #167 on: September 09, 2014, 10:02:43 AM »
Frankly, It sounds to me like you were fed a shallow version of yiddeshkeit, which sadly didn't stand up to the test of life. Perhaps if you'de have taken the time and effort to try and understand these concepts you wouldn't be so troubled by them.

I believe your post mirrors this problem specifically, each one of the issues you raised are presented in a oversimplifies negative context.

The majority of DDF users have no problem with these issues and have developed a deeper understanding of them.

"Ethics" outside of a religious system is undefined and can be abused or used as one sees fit. In  truth it is but a practical social construct which has no more inherent value than the quality of life it provides for us.

If society were to begin to begin to find drugs, gun fights, and prostitution to be acceptable and praiseworthy then these could be called "ethical", but that could never happen... right?...listen to a random sampling of 5 rap songs and you won't be so sure anymore.

The first R' Avadiya MeBartenura on Avos makes the point that the reason the chain of Torah ShBal Pe is first listed here of all places (mid-nezikin) is to make sure nobody mistakes the morality and ethics written here for a human construct, rather OUR ETHICS come from Hashem in the very same chain as EVERY other part of the Torah.

He is essentially warning us not to fall into the fallacy of assuming that your own moral meter can decide what is right regardless of what G-d has to say. He is warning us not make the mistakes you proudly portray in your post. You naively yet arrogantly indicate your belief that G-d's morality is skewed and you have got it right.

"Ethics" that are not in line with halacha and Torah hashkafa are meaningless and dangerous, why should we teach that to our children?
+10000000, extremely well said.
It reminds me of the story where a father brought his children to Rav Avigdor Miller, and they were being very polite, saying please and thank you. The proud father said to him, "Don't my children have good manners?" Rav Miller answered, "The Nazis also had good manners, and it didn't stop them from killing millions of people."
Manners and ethics are meaningless, unless one believes there is a Higher Power which dictates what they are, since otherwise every person will define their ethics according to what feel good for them and works for their benefit.
Whenever there is a discussion about whether something is ethical, and someone said his Rav told him it's mutar, there will always be that one person who jumps up and starts disparaging him, saying that he's a terrible Rav and this is clearly unethical and wrong, etc. etc. Guess what? The Torah doesn't care about our small minded definition about what is ethical or not, or right and wrong. If the Torah says something is permitted, it is whether you and I understand it or not. If you believe he's wrong, take it up with your own Rabbi, but don't start knocking this Rav's psak based on how he understands the Shulchan Aruch.
/end rant
I still think that we should shy away from unethical concepts in the torah including amalek and not try to explain it to a 6 year old like it is simple. It is the last thing from simple and it is one of the strongest arguments the Christians use against the Jewish religion. This past weeks parsha talked about how the torah permits rape after a battle. Would you teach that to a 6 year old? Is that ethical?
I believe that almost everything can be brought down to any level, even that of a 6 year old. If you teach him that the Torah permits rape after a battle, then it's almost like you're saying "I don't understand this and I think it's totally wrong, but the Torah says it, so we have to go with it." If you brought it down to his level and just said simply that the Torah permits marrying a non-Jewish woman after a battle, most kids won't even think about the fact that it could be non-consensual. That is besides for the fact that this is not rape like any other pillaging army in history where she gets thrown away like a used tissue after one time, but rather if he indeed marries her, he must treat her like any other wife.
Forget the work "ethics" and think about right, wrong and gray areas. Many of the frum people I know, like to go in the gray area of halacha as well. Davening shachris a few minutes past the zman, talking during prayers etc....  When a child is raised with halacha as the only code of ethics and he sees people bending the small rules (even for a good reason) he will not be able to know the difference between wrong, really wrong and right.
Whatever system of ethics you teach a child, they will see people violating it. So why is that a reason not teach him the only one which is inherently true and really matters?
Thought this might be helpful. Here is a condensed version that skips the intricate details of the story and primarily serves as a warning to others, without getting into the how frum the guy is:

You know me as the guy with lot of miles. I’m also the guy who got scammed out of hundreds of thousands of them. I’ll spare you the details, as they are long and confusing, but I’d like to share a few warnings to help everyone keep their accounts safe.

An individual who follows this site and even attended one of my seminars managed to books dozens of stays for himself, his friends and family using the points in one of my accounts. With only my name, he managed to convince the phone booking agents he was in fact me, and they booked tens of thousands of dollars worth of hotel stays for him.

What can you do to avoid this?

1) Keep your profile up to date

Because the email address associated with the account was an old email address I never check or use, I did not see email confirmations for any of the bookings and it went on for months before I caught on.

Keep your email, phone and address information up to date, and you’ll get notified whenever there is activity on your account.

2) Monitor your accounts

Make a habit of checking your account balances at least once a month, and ensuring there are no unauthorized transactions. You should already be doing this with your credit card statements, do it with your mileage accounts, too.

3) Be careful who you trust.

I gave away free suite nights at various hotels around the world, but no longer can do that after one of the winners spent thousands at the minibar and other incidentals.

Thank G-d, in all the above cases, I had my points reinstated and money refunded. But it caused many stressful days and an unbelievable headache.

Unfortunately, the various loyalty programs we’ve come to know and love seem to have a few exploitable security breaches.  Please stay vigilant and make sure it doesn’t happen to you.

Well written. Although, I don't know if it's wise to explain, even briefly, how he pulled it off,.

Offline username

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #168 on: September 09, 2014, 10:03:26 AM »
Thought this might be helpful. Here is a condensed version that skips the intricate details of the story and primarily serves as a warning to others, without getting into the how frum the guy is:

You know me as the guy with lot of miles....
Nice.
^^^

Offline aygart

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #169 on: September 09, 2014, 10:09:13 AM »
Hehe. "Rabbi" = Infallible and unquestionable like God?  Anyway, taking this way off topic. Sorry about that...  We should start a different thread to discuss these ridiculous piskei "halacha" and the infallibility of someone who has the word Rabbi in front of his name.
obviously this is a rabbi who he respected enough to ask him this question. It is a pretty fair assumption that the respect was earned and is not just because of the word rabbi.
Feelings don't care about your facts

Offline ChaimMoskowitz

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #170 on: September 09, 2014, 10:17:49 AM »
Manners and ethics are meaningless, unless one believes there is a Higher Power which dictates what they are, since otherwise every person will define their ethics according to what feel good for them and works for their benefit.
I sure hope everyone then chooses the correct higher power or we are going to have big problems. Wait a second I think I just figured out why we have so many conflicts in the world.
I just found a new supply of forks!

Offline @Yehuda

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #171 on: September 09, 2014, 10:18:58 AM »
Just reading about this and joining now. Sorry it happened, absolutely terrible, so glad you have your points back. I'm sure the last week was crazy for you, and even if it all gets resolved (I'm sure you don't consider this "resolved" just yet), the stress, anxiety, and time you spent on this can't be repaid.

Some thoughts:

1) I think the story got a bit confusing with the 3 names - at times I had to reread a sentence to see who was saying what. A rewrite during a calmer time period might help organize it a bit.

In terms of the 2 issues with posting to DDMS...
2) Copycats: Perhaps don't post how it was done, just a PSA that people should keep all accounts on emails that are checked.
3) Chillul Hashem: Perhaps use non-Jewish names as your characters and just say things like "out of the country" instead of "Israel".

4) I would not - and I don't think you would either - let this end here. Obviously religion and Halacha is a touchy subject, so speak with your Rav if you so desire, but if you go the route of reporting him, I'm sure it won't be any easier or less stressful than it has been so far, so so I wish you good luck dealing with it.

Well written. Although, I don't know if it's wise to explain, even briefly, how he pulled it off,.
+1 Nice summary Yehuda57, but I wouldn't mention how it was done.

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #172 on: September 09, 2014, 10:26:32 AM »
+1 Nice summary Yehuda57, but I wouldn't mention how it was done.

Here is a version without that:


You know me as the guy with lot of miles. I’m also the guy who got scammed out of hundreds of thousands of them. I’ll spare you the details, as they are long and confusing, but I’d like to share a few warnings to help everyone keep their accounts safe.

1) Keep your profile up to date

Because the email address associated with the account stolen from was an old email address I never check or use, I did not see email confirmations for any of the fraudulent activity and it went on for months before I caught on.

Keep your email, phone and address information up to date, and you’ll get notified whenever there is activity on your account.

2) Monitor your accounts

Make a habit of checking your account balances at least once a month, and ensuring there are no unauthorized transactions. You should already be doing this with your credit card statements, do it with your mileage accounts, too.

3) Be careful who you trust.

I gave away free suite nights at various hotels around the world, but no longer can do that after one of the winners spent thousands at the minibar and other incidentals.

Thank G-d, in all the above cases, I had my points reinstated and money refunded. But it caused many stressful days and an unbelievable headache.

Unfortunately, the various loyalty programs we’ve come to know and love seem to have a few exploitable security breaches.  Please stay vigilant and make sure it doesn’t happen to you.

Offline lunatic

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #173 on: September 09, 2014, 10:29:00 AM »
Thought this might be helpful. Here is a condensed version that skips the intricate details of the story and primarily serves as a warning to others, without getting into the how frum the guy is:

You know me as the guy with lot of miles. I’m also the guy who got scammed out of hundreds of thousands of them. I’ll spare you the details, as they are long and confusing, but I’d like to share a few warnings to help everyone keep their accounts safe.

An individual who follows this site and even attended one of my seminars managed to books dozens of stays for himself, his friends and family using the points in one of my accounts. With only my name, he managed to convince the phone booking agents he was in fact me, and they booked tens of thousands of dollars worth of hotel stays for him.

What can you do to avoid this?

1) Keep your profile up to date

Because the email address associated with the account was an old email address I never check or use, I did not see email confirmations for any of the bookings and it went on for months before I caught on.

Keep your email, phone and address information up to date, and you’ll get notified whenever there is activity on your account.

2) Monitor your accounts

Make a habit of checking your account balances at least once a month, and ensuring there are no unauthorized transactions. You should already be doing this with your credit card statements, do it with your mileage accounts, too.

3) Be careful who you trust.

I gave away free suite nights at various hotels around the world, but no longer can do that after one of the winners spent thousands at the minibar and other incidentals.

Thank G-d, in all the above cases, I had my points reinstated and money refunded. But it caused many stressful days and an unbelievable headache.

Unfortunately, the various loyalty programs we’ve come to know and love seem to have a few exploitable security breaches.  Please stay vigilant and make sure it doesn’t happen to you.
I like it

Offline bubble347

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #174 on: September 09, 2014, 10:32:24 AM »

Here is a version without that:


You know me as the guy with lot of miles. I’m also the guy who got scammed out of hundreds of thousands of them. I’ll spare you the details, as they are long and confusing, but I’d like to share a few warnings to help everyone keep their accounts safe.

1) Keep your profile up to date

Because the email address associated with the account stolen from was an old email address I never check or use, I did not see email confirmations for any of the fraudulent activity and it went on for months before I caught on.

Keep your email, phone and address information up to date, and you’ll get notified whenever there is activity on your account.

2) Monitor your accounts

Make a habit of checking your account balances at least once a month, and ensuring there are no unauthorized transactions. You should already be doing this with your credit card statements, do it with your mileage accounts, too.

3) Be careful who you trust.

I gave away free suite nights at various hotels around the world, but no longer can do that after one of the winners spent thousands at the minibar and other incidentals.

Thank G-d, in all the above cases, I had my points reinstated and money refunded. But it caused many stressful days and an unbelievable headache.

Unfortunately, the various loyalty programs we’ve come to know and love seem to have a few exploitable security breaches.  Please stay vigilant and make sure it doesn’t happen to you.
Well written, however people are curious and don't like to be spared the details as we have seen here on DDF. Perhaps Dan should add a snippet of the story just to curb people's curiosity and put the basic emphasis on what to learn from this disgusting incident.   
Watch this inspiring video.

Offline Achas Veachas

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #175 on: September 09, 2014, 10:32:49 AM »
Now who get's the HT if it goes MS?

Offline henche

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #176 on: September 09, 2014, 10:37:30 AM »
Now who get's the HT if it goes MS?

Dovid

Offline zlt123

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #177 on: September 09, 2014, 10:43:29 AM »
I think meshugener gets it. He started the poll. For some reason he got very quiet in this thread ;)

Offline Yehuda57

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #178 on: September 09, 2014, 10:49:29 AM »
Well written. Although, I don't know if it's wise to explain, even briefly, how he pulled it off,.


+1 Nice summary Yehuda57, but I wouldn't mention how it was done.

Well written, however people are curious and don't like to be spared the details as we have seen here on DDF. Perhaps Dan should add a snippet of the story just to curb people's curiosity and put the basic emphasis on what to learn from this disgusting incident.

Offline @Yehuda

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Re: Petition: Should Dan Please Share The Story Of The Stolen Points Or Not?
« Reply #179 on: September 09, 2014, 11:05:43 AM »
I hear his point, but either way, don't get worked up about it. I'm sure Dan can figure out away to word it if he decides to MS it.