United can't reserve flight for first leg - any way to get fare honored?

[gleff]

First, you should post the text here of the two emails you received from United.  There's speculation going on about the first one.  If it was the usual email that says your reservation is confirmed, you don't have to do anything, and you'll get a followup once they've completed 'internal processing' then you're going to be fine 100% for sure on this.  I just don't remember whether there's something different than that on revenue tickets where certain segments are operated by partners.

Second, you should escalate with United.  They took a credit card on the booking.  Their screwup, or that of their alliance partner, shouldn't be your concern.  At the very least it shouldn't cost you extra.

For those wondering what the actual DOT rule is, for the purpose of the Department's ban on post-purchase price increases a 'purchase' is deemed to have occurred when the full amount due has been paid.  Presumably, and I haven't investigated this point, that this would be when the credit card has actually been charged and not merely when the credit card information has been taken.  (That's how it works in other legal contexts I'm aware of.)

"§ 399.88 Prohibition on post-purchase
price increase.
(a) It is an unfair and deceptive
practice within the meaning of 49 U.S.C.
41712 for any seller of scheduled air
transportation within, to or from the
United States, or of a tour (i.e., a
combination of air transportation and
ground or cruise accommodations), or
tour component (e.g., a hotel stay) that
includes scheduled air transportation
within, to or from the United States, to
increase the price of that air
transportation, tour or tour component
to a consumer, including but not limited
to an increase in the price of the seat,
an increase in the price for the carriage
of passenger baggage, or an increase in
an applicable fuel surcharge, after the
air transportation has been purchased
by the consumer, except in the case of
an increase in a government-imposed
tax or fee. A purchase is deemed to have
occurred when the full amount agreed
upon has been paid by the consumer. "

DOT notwithstanding, and you can of course file a DOT complaint -- there's also small claims court.  Remember there may well be a promise by United documented in the email.

[ilherman]

Welcome back!

Nice seeing you hopping around here....

[Mordy788]

First, you should post the text here of the two emails you received from United.  There's speculation going on about the first one.  If it was the usual email that says your reservation is confirmed, you don't have to do anything, and you'll get a followup once they've completed 'internal processing' then you're going to be fine 100% for sure on this.  I just don't remember whether there's something different than that on revenue tickets where certain segments are operated by partners.

Second, you should escalate with United.  They took a credit card on the booking.  Their screwup, or that of their alliance partner, shouldn't be your concern.  At the very least it shouldn't cost you extra.

For those wondering what the actual DOT rule is, for the purpose of the Department's ban on post-purchase price increases a 'purchase' is deemed to have occurred when the full amount due has been paid.  Presumably, and I haven't investigated this point, that this would be when the credit card has actually been charged and not merely when the credit card information has been taken.  (That's how it works in other legal contexts I'm aware of.)

"§ 399.88 Prohibition on post-purchase
price increase.
(a) It is an unfair and deceptive
practice within the meaning of 49 U.S.C.
41712 for any seller of scheduled air
transportation within, to or from the
United States, or of a tour (i.e., a
combination of air transportation and
ground or cruise accommodations), or
tour component (e.g., a hotel stay) that
includes scheduled air transportation
within, to or from the United States, to
increase the price of that air
transportation, tour or tour component
to a consumer, including but not limited
to an increase in the price of the seat,
an increase in the price for the carriage
of passenger baggage, or an increase in
an applicable fuel surcharge, after the
air transportation has been purchased
by the consumer, except in the case of
an increase in a government-imposed
tax or fee. A purchase is deemed to have
occurred when the full amount agreed
upon has been paid by the consumer. "

DOT notwithstanding, and you can of course file a DOT complaint -- there's also small claims court.  Remember there may well be a promise by United documented in the email.

United is not responsible in any way. If your reservation is not ticketed, the DOT regulation does not apply. I have run across situations with Swiss in particular when trying to ticket a reservation and then got a message to contact the help desk where Swiss informs me that they are overbooked and can not issue the ticket.

This can happen, especially when dealing with an Interline reservation (where more than one airline is on the reservation).

United did not screw up and just because they took a credit card on the booking doesn't make them anymore responsible, a purchase is when the item is paid for, not when payment information is taken.

[gleff]

Again, the DOT rule is not the only thing that makes United responsible.

As I explained, the DOT rule requires the credit card to be processed (that usually happens concomitant with ticket issuance, but it isn't technically ticket issuance that triggers the post-purchase price increase regs).  So that's presumably not at play here.

But there may still be (a) recourse through United, by escalating, or (b) a detrimental reliance claim -- the offer and acceptance of a price, followed by the written assurance that the reservation was accepted and confirmed, the result of which being that the consumer lost out on the option to buy airfare at then-current prices from other providers or with other itineraries. 

That's why if escalating via United -- which, with enough tenaciousness, is likely to be successful -- were to fail, there's also a small claims path.

[Moishebatchy]

IME, you can get United to do something simply because they have the power to offer you a similar alternative on their own metal (namely, the direct flight), and if you appeal to their desire to maintain a customer-friendly reputation, they will often help you simply for PR reasons. But I really don't think going to small claims court will help.

[Mordy788]

Again, the DOT rule is not the only thing that makes United responsible.

As I explained, the DOT rule requires the credit card to be processed (that usually happens concomitant with ticket issuance, but it isn't technically ticket issuance that triggers the post-purchase price increase regs).  So that's presumably not at play here.

But there may still be (a) recourse through United, by escalating, or (b) a detrimental reliance claim -- the offer and acceptance of a price, followed by the written assurance that the reservation was accepted and confirmed, the result of which being that the consumer lost out on the option to buy airfare at then-current prices from other providers or with other itineraries. 

That's why if escalating via United -- which, with enough tenaciousness, is likely to be successful -- were to fail, there's also a small claims path.

That was a lot of high vocabulary for me and I am not a lawyer. 

While I don't discourage anyone from contacting an airline in this situation, it is highly unlikely that United will do anything.

In the airline industry no fare is guaranteed until ticketed and confirmed. Your reservation number does not mean anything until you have a ticket.

When you are booking in United you receive some messages alerting you to the fact that your selection may not actually be available:

1st message:

Fares listed are for the entire trip per person and include taxes and fees. Additional bag charges may apply.
The fare displayed is the lowest available for the dates requested; however some flights may not be in the cabin you requested.
United flights include those operated by our Express partners.

2nd message:

We will request confirmation of your flights from SWISS International Airlines. This process may take up to 24 hours. Your credit card will not be charged until your flights are confirmed and your ticket is issued.

[Mordy788]

IME, you can get United to do something simply because they have the power to offer you a similar alternative on their own metal (namely, the direct flight), and if you appeal to their desire to maintain a customer-friendly reputation, they will often help you simply for PR reasons. But I really don't think going to small claims court will help.

+1

[daprdapr]

Thanks everyone for the info - sorry I have not posted a response sooner, but that was because my time to make a flight was running out and I had to do something.

First: the email I received was :

Thank you for booking your travel on www.united.com.   

We are unable to ticket the above-referenced reservation.  Some airlines require 24 hours to confirm a seat on their flight.  In this case, we were unable to confirm your flight(s) on Swiss International Airlines.  Please call us at 800-UNITED1 (800-864-8331) so we can assist you in making alternate arrangements.  I apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.
 
Regards,
 
United.com Web Support

Spoke to 4 different United agents by phone, 2 were not very helpful, number three was downright bad telling me that I should go on line and figure it out for myself because he would need to charge me to find an alternative flight and number 4 literally spent almost an hour trying to get me an alternative at the same price, which she finally found via Lufthansa which she was able to book and confirm on the spot.

They all said that "when you booked on-line, we tell you up front that confirmation on partners can take 24 hours and we may not be able to confirm that flight in the end" which is true.

In the end, cutting one leg off the flight only cost we $175 more and I went that route.
 

Thanks for the info - this was a learning experience for me.

[daprdapr]

One detail i forgot to add is that when the helpful agent tried finding an alternative, she actually suggested the Swiss flight that United had just told me by email a few hours before couldn't be confirmed. It kept on popping up on line as well. The agent thought that was strange as said as much to me....

[Mordy788]

Sorry you were treated badly, that always stinks.

I have noticed that what Swiss shares with Travel Agents and I guess their partners can be wrong.