Author Topic: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel  (Read 29862 times)

Offline MosheD

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #45 on: February 05, 2015, 10:08:10 AM »


From what I understand, Sheyan was using triangle k ingredients (many of the asian ingredients in israel are triangle k) and i heard that Keyara might have been using regular rabbanut lamb chops. KFI wouldnt approve of them until they kashered their kitchen.

As far as not identifying themselves, this is what R' Kuber had to say.

Mordechai Kuber
January 29, 2015 - 14:33 | Permalink
You are all correct that it is better if the Rabbanim would publicize their names. But one must understand that the culture here is not exactly American live-and-let-live. It is not impossible for a restaurateur who is losing business because he refuses to raise his standards to express his dissatisfaction in a hostile way. So we must respect the Rabbanim for taking the time and expending the effort to address a problem that is significant, even if they do not feel like dying a martyr’s death.
I know the Rabbanim involved, and they are all serious talmidei chachamim, with modest kashrus experience between them.

I don't think it's a secret who they are. I'm sure ppl could easily find out, but still respect the decision.
I know my answer wont satisfy you but the short answer is "the rabbis"
I think that many rabbis (even without realizing they are doing so) enrich and empower themselves and their colleagues by pushing stricter and stricter standards.  I think that the system is rigged that only 'rabbis' that push a chumradik agenda can come to any real power.  I think that this corruption is not only in kasharus but in gayrus, stznus and many other areas of everyday jewish life.

as an example I dont believe there has been any major leniency in kasharus since Chalov stam, and from what I've heard r' Moshe's sons have distanced them selves from that ruling.

I think that there is no true jewish leadership
Just wow.

Offline aygart

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #46 on: February 05, 2015, 10:17:11 AM »
Looks like we need some popcorn. What does KFI recommend?
You have the right to remain silent. Anything you say can and will be used to start a religious discussion.

Offline Menachem613

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #47 on: February 05, 2015, 10:19:38 AM »

I know my answer wont satisfy you but the short answer is "the rabbis"
I think that many rabbis (even without realizing they are doing so) enrich and empower themselves and their colleagues by pushing stricter and stricter standards.  I think that the system is rigged that only 'rabbis' that push a chumradik agenda can come to any real power.  I think that this corruption is not only in kasharus but in gayrus, stznus and many other areas of everyday jewish life.

as an example I dont believe there has been any major leniency in kasharus since Chalov stam, and from what I've heard r' Moshe's sons have distanced them selves from that ruling.

I think that there is no true jewish leadership

I have an e-mail from someone in a famous US Kashrus agency corroborating *one* of your points. The e-mail was from father to son and forwarded to me by son.  It needs some heavy redacting but I will send via PM when I'm done.

Offline incendia

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #48 on: February 05, 2015, 10:28:02 AM »
I have an e-mail from someone in a famous US Kashrus agency corroborating *one* of your points. The e-mail was from father to son and forwarded to me by son.  It needs some heavy redacting but I will send via PM when I'm done.

thanks

Offline Tuna Baygel

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #49 on: February 05, 2015, 11:04:20 AM »
My comment represents my general mistrust of the kasharus industry, and the undue financial burden that it puts on the jewish public
Sounds like a trying to sound smart cover up

You stated facts without doing research

Probably because of your "general mistrust of the kasharus industry"

Offline incendia

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #50 on: February 05, 2015, 11:12:23 AM »
Sounds like a trying to sound smart cover up

You stated facts without doing research

Probably because of your "general mistrust of the kasharus industry"

actually I stated my opinion

Offline Tuna Baygel

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #51 on: February 05, 2015, 11:19:36 AM »
sounds like another kosher tax to me
How are you expressing your opinion in the above comment?

Offline incendia

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #52 on: February 05, 2015, 11:30:30 AM »
How are you expressing your opinion in the above comment?

I was being facetious

Offline Tuna Baygel

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #53 on: February 05, 2015, 11:36:59 AM »
I was being facetious
Wow! if only I can use that for every time I say something stupid!

Come on!!!!!!

Offline moish

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #54 on: February 05, 2015, 11:44:03 AM »
he clearly has an ax to grind with kashrus organizations (keeping kosher?) we should move on

Offline Emkay

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #55 on: February 05, 2015, 12:11:39 PM »
he clearly has an ax to grind with kashrus organizations (keeping kosher?) we should move on
Correct
It means that I can see what kind of individual you are and it's not worth arguing with your genre

Offline elya

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #56 on: February 09, 2015, 01:46:31 PM »
I'ts simple. they are trying to standardize kasrus in Israel for the american oilem that don't know whats what here.
Places like Keyara and Sheyan are frequented by plenty of american beni torah who really have no clue what the're eating except that when their sister in laws father came to Israel 3 years ago he ate there.

How many people know what meats or fish or vegetables Aguda hechsher relays on? What kind of Bishul Yisroel they relay on? Who pours the wine?

When you have a standard set by the Rabanim and Poskim that the american bnei torah in eretz yisroel relay on, you know that you can eat there without a problem.

One of the major people behind KFI is Rabbi Shmuli Weiner from ZNT shull in Ramat Eshkol. He personally ate at Sheyan with Rav Chaim Tzvi Senter after they upgraded their kashrus.
+1000

Offline elya

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #57 on: February 09, 2015, 01:47:07 PM »
From what I understand, Sheyan was using triangle k ingredients (many of the asian ingredients in israel are triangle k) and i heard that Keyara might have been using regular rabbanut lamb chops. KFI wouldnt approve of them until they kashered their kitchen.

As far as not identifying themselves, this is what R' Kuber had to say.

Mordechai Kuber
January 29, 2015 - 14:33 | Permalink
You are all correct that it is better if the Rabbanim would publicize their names. But one must understand that the culture here is not exactly American live-and-let-live. It is not impossible for a restaurateur who is losing business because he refuses to raise his standards to express his dissatisfaction in a hostile way. So we must respect the Rabbanim for taking the time and expending the effort to address a problem that is significant, even if they do not feel like dying a martyr’s death.
I know the Rabbanim involved, and they are all serious talmidei chachamim, with modest kashrus experience between them. Although I am not officially a member of KFI, they consult me on all kashrus matters. I believe that they have managed to establish high standards without getting involved in the politics of hashgachos, for which they are to be commended. They will be publishing their standards very soon, and the names of the first two restaurants who have met those standards, and the details of the kashrus there.
I realize that it would be great if they could already be at the finish line. But this is a work in progress, and they have moved forward patiently and with great attention to detail.
In the words of a great man long departed, “You have to crawl before you walk, and walk before you run.” Slowly and patiently this job will get done, and our community will finally have the opportunity to confidently eat out without guesswork and blissful ignorance. It is long in coming, and just a little more patience and some thoughtful understanding will get us to the finish line.
+1000

Offline elya

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #58 on: February 09, 2015, 01:47:28 PM »
I know this information first hand!!!

Offline SamKey

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #59 on: February 09, 2015, 01:55:41 PM »
Whoever thinks they're are not charging for this service is very naive... and wrong