Author Topic: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel  (Read 62343 times)

Offline Boruch999

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #220 on: June 11, 2015, 08:28:31 AM »
There is a problem in Israeli kashrus that many seem not to be aware of.  There are kashrus agencies that officially have certain standards but have terrible track records ensuring those standards at establishments under their hashgocha.   It is therefore possible for an establishment to have a hechsher whose official standards are acceptable to KFIs rabbonim, yet whose actually enforced level of kashrus are not.  It is possible that they committed to a certain level of enforced kashrus standards, and were later found not to be upholding their commitment.

I know nothing of the actual case under discussion, and I do not know anything about KFI other than what I've read in this thread.

Offline yochiek93

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #221 on: June 11, 2015, 08:30:08 AM »
There is a problem in Israeli kashrus that many seem not to be aware of.  There are kashrus agencies that officially have certain standards but have terrible track records ensuring those standards at establishments under their hashgocha.   It is therefore possible for an establishment to have a hechsher whose official standards are acceptable to KFIs rabbonim, yet whose actually enforced level of kashrus are not.  It is possible that they committed to a certain level of enforced kashrus standards, and were later found not to be upholding their commitment.
+1 couldnt say better myself

Offline raphy781

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #222 on: June 11, 2015, 08:30:27 AM »
I must say agudah is around for long enough, so kfi first saying it's standards are good (stop saying they didn't do that) and then within a short while changing it's tone leaves me wondering if they did the homework

While I am sure intentions are good, I am not sure a few choshuwe 'wanna be kashrus experts' can be relied on, as this quick u-turn has showed
FWIU Sheyan and Keyara were under the Agudah, many things weren't being done the way they should have been, and the Agudah never removed their hashgacha nor did they implement the changes that were necessary. KFI worked with the restaurants to fix these issues and is helping them maintain certain standards of kashrus. Being that the Agudah isn't up to par (based on what was happening under their watch) they will be switching hechsherim, but finding a new hechsher isn't simple which is why it didn't happen right away.
P.s. I haven't verified this. It's just the way I understand all that I've heard about the issue.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2015, 11:02:11 AM by raphy781 »

Offline Emkay

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #223 on: June 11, 2015, 08:57:53 AM »


'wanna be kashrus experts'
I am not either sure whats going on here, but that is just going to far. You are now zero in my book. (Not that it means anything)

Offline Boruch999

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #224 on: June 11, 2015, 09:03:33 AM »
I am not either sure whats going on here, but that is just going to far. You are now zero in my book. (Not that it means anything)
+1

Offline Chaikel

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #225 on: June 11, 2015, 09:21:56 AM »
I am not either sure whats going on here, but that is just going to far. You are now zero in my book. (Not that it means anything)

Cmon, you don't find it even a little funny that someone called R Kuber a wannabe kashrus expert?
Create professional looking itineraries.
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Offline yochiek93

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #226 on: June 11, 2015, 09:26:20 AM »
Cmon, you don't find it even a little funny that someone called R Kuber a wannabe kashrus expert?
from now on we should ask chuchem all kashrus questions he seems to know better

Offline moish

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #227 on: June 11, 2015, 09:57:07 AM »
Cmon, you don't find it even a little funny that someone called R Kuber a wannabe kashrus expert?
lol

Offline elya

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #228 on: June 11, 2015, 01:35:17 PM »
I don't understand all the venting here, if anyone is confused about what they are trying to do, why don't you call them yourself?

Offline elya

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #229 on: June 11, 2015, 01:42:03 PM »
And with regard to sheyan - keyara, there were very serious halachic problems when the rabbanim went to check it out, however they didn't feel it was they're place to make a restaurant change hashgachos, so they sent down they're own mashgichim to be on top of it once the restaurant promised to make the necessary changes, being that the aguda is completely incompetent, however that was only a trial period, as kfi is not a hashgacha so they could not be on top of it forever. My guess is what happened now is that the restaurant wasn't keeping to what was agreed upon, which would therefore constitute kfi to tell them to change hashgachos, as the aguda is not reliable based on what they found.

Offline Drago

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #230 on: June 11, 2015, 02:46:11 PM »
There is a problem in Israeli kashrus that many seem not to be aware of.  There are kashrus agencies that officially have certain standards but have terrible track records ensuring those standards at establishments under their hashgocha.

Is this a problem in the US at all, or is it Israel-specific?

Offline elya

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #231 on: June 11, 2015, 03:00:41 PM »
Is this a problem in the US at all, or is it Israel-specific?
It seems the system in place with American hashgachos is more sophisticated as well as more effective, than that of the Israeli system. For example in America, the Mashgiach is the one with the keys, and has a say.. Etc, as opposed to in israel where there is a mifakeach on top of the Mashgiach, and a mifakeach on top him.... Etc. Besides all the politics that go on with Israeli hashgachos.

Offline Drago

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #232 on: June 11, 2015, 03:08:53 PM »
It seems the system in place with American hashgachos is more sophisticated as well as more effective, than that of the Israeli system. For example in America, the Mashgiach is the one with the keys, and has a say.. Etc, as opposed to in israel where there is a mifakeach on top of the Mashgiach, and a mifakeach on top him.... Etc. Besides all the politics that go on with Israeli hashgachos.
A place as big of NYC has been able to stay away from politics in kashrus?
(I'm from small town USA, so am unaware of these things)

Offline elya

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #233 on: June 11, 2015, 03:11:56 PM »
A place as big of NYC has been able to stay away from politics in kashrus?
(I'm from small town USA, so am unaware of these things)
I don't know enough to answer that, although I suppose your right. But it seems in israel it's alot more widespread, as has more serious repercussions.

Offline Emkay

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #234 on: June 11, 2015, 03:17:18 PM »
A place as big of NYC has been able to stay away from politics in kashrus?
not close, but the issues are different

Offline Drago

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #235 on: June 11, 2015, 03:19:13 PM »
not close, but the issues are different
Teach me father
I need to be kovea itim tonight

Offline Emkay

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #236 on: June 11, 2015, 03:20:47 PM »
Teach me father
I need to be kovea itim tonight
i charge, and i only teach if people will actually implement

Offline Drago

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #237 on: June 11, 2015, 06:24:43 PM »
i charge, and i only teach if people will actually implement
When I eat out in NYC, I'll take what you say under serious consideration.
But in the end, it's up to my posek and her psak.

Offline Emkay

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #238 on: June 11, 2015, 06:29:29 PM »
When I eat out in NYC, I'll take what you say under serious consideration.
But in the end, it's up to my posek and her psak.

Offline shimino1

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Re: KFI - Kashrus Watchdog in Israel
« Reply #239 on: June 12, 2015, 09:45:04 AM »
When I eat out in NYC, I'll take what you say under serious consideration.
But in the end, it's up to my posek and her psak.
LOL!!!